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      10-13-2011, 06:02 PM   #23
VP Electricity
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Drives: F34 xDrive
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: portland oregon

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Thanks for all the comments! Here are some general replies:

We have done a lot of E82 and E90/E92 upgrades, and a few E60. We have had a very similar package for the E90 sedan for quite a while. It gets great reviews - Technic ran one in his sedan until he sold it for a coupe and has installed them into a number of his customer's cars in south Florida - and it works very well. Our entry-level woofer is the ID10. For its price, it sounds much better, and plays lower, than any other woofer we've tested.

But what we are asked about most is for a subwoofer that:

- Looks stock

- Has a grille

- Doesn't involve cutting, screwing, or modification

- Has minimal impact on the trunk volume

- Sounds great - not overbearing or "one-note" in character - and blends with whatever is in the front cabin system.

So that's exactly what this is (basically, what we've been offering for the E90 for quite a while, just for the E82).

We've used the ID10 in the E90 Level One sub-add package since day one. We use a 250W amp. Why? Because 250W is what the speaker's voice coil is rated to handle electrically, and because Arc makes a fan-cooled micro-sized amp with some internal circuitry to let it work well with the Top HiFi system. I have no idea if the suspension makes noise when running it at higher power levels (actually, what it would make noise at is higher excursions, which is also enclosure-dependent), and I suspect the designer didn't care either, since the Pe is 250W RMS, but I can say this: E90 owners get plenty of low-end output with 250W in our Level One system, and the transfer from the E90 trunk to the cabin isn't any easier than it is in the E82.

We've done plenty - plenty - of fully-upgraded amplified systems with the ID10 in the E90 sedan, and it works very well. The only time I would suggest adding this to stock speakers is if you have the Top HiFi (Logic 7 or harman/kardon) system. Even then, I'm pretty critical of that system, and our upgrades sound better.

Now, comparing an ID10 to a 10W6 is kind of apples-and-oranges - and I am sure no one meant to make such a comparison. You don't buy a W6 unless you are looking for a LOT of bass output. We work with both lines here, we are a dealer for both, and the W6 is a totally different animal than the ID series.

I know that some folks just want lots of bass, and are not as concerned with musicality, the midbass-sub-bass handoff, or actual sub-bass extension to the degree that I am - and that's fine, even if it's not my bag, baby. If someone wants the W6 in here - and this enclosure is within the operating specs of a W6 - we eliminate the recess for the grille, flatten the front panel, and front-load the woofer flat with the outer plane.


Quote:
My concern would be that if you are amping the Speakers then I'm not sure that a 250-300w sub is sufficient.
Well, that depends on your goal. If you want a musical system that extends the sub-bass down below what an 8" can provide, this works great. If you want lots and lots of output, you may want more power - but don't make the mistake of comparing RMS power to output, because there isn't a linear correlation. 250W into a W6 won't give you the same output as 250W into a different woofer. (Don't use sensitivity ratings either, as those are all measured at 1K,not in the bass region - JL makes this point on their wb site IIRC). The number of watts a speaker is rated doesn't tell us how loud it plays, and neither does the number of watts we give it. It's a more systems-oriented calculation (enclosure, speaker, wattage, car in question, frequency band, etc.)

Quote:
"My thoughts are that it doesn't really make sense to put an SQ focussed Sub in the boot where it's muffled by the back seat anyway..."
Well, that's pretty much where they go, isn't it. We do mostly SQ-oriented systems, and fortunately, that's not a problem. Some crazy systems do put them in the dash, or in the floor, but those are such a minority to seem a statistical aberration. Actually, because our BMWs have 8" in the floor, we have the opportunity to run fast woofers as midbass up front and then depend on the trunk sub for the sub-bass - it's the best of both worlds.

In the E90, we have used ID, JL, and Morel pretty often. That's what we have tested in the E82 1-series. Some woofers, like the IDQ and the W3 and W6, work, but won't accept our matching grille. Some, like the ID and the Morel, work fine with the matching grille.

Quote:
My guess - without having seen one in the flesh - is that it won't be capable of keeping up with a seriously powerful setup.
I've read this a few times, and I'm sorry to say, I can't quite figure out what you're trying to say here. We're talking about an enclosure, and also an enclosure with one of the woofers available in our Level One package. We have systems which can be ordered with three different ID models, including the IDMAX, the JL W3 and W6, and the Morel Ultimo and Ultimo SC. Are you seriously trying to say that this enclosure isn't capable of supporting a woofer that is part of a "seriously powerful setup"? Are are you just saying that using the ID woofer in a high-powered aftermarket system might be the wrong choice (which I agree with - we only use the ID woofer in Level One).


In response to another question, we have been a supporting vendor of Bimmerpost for some time, and we would be listed as a supporting 1Addicts vendor if the program existed. We pay the Supporting Vendor fees every month to have the opportunity to offer our products on Bimmerpost, and we have received permission to talk about our 1-series products on 1Addicts, even though the system doesn't show us as a 'vendor" in the 1Addicts section.
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