Oil Cooler

[TimMc]

Originally Posted by BMW86

I'll take it off your hands Tim

I'll add you to the list if I don't use it. Should probably use Andrew's original list though too.
I actually think this kit may be much more beneficial to auto N54s than manual ones. As your oil temps aren't super high on track Vinney I'm guessing it's either the water or tranny fluid that's causing the limp. I believe the N54's auto is similar/same as an XR6/XR6 Turbo Falcon's? What do the guys who tune these turbo monsters do to negate overheating their autos/water?

[BMW86]

Originally Posted by TimMc

I'll add you to the list if I don't use it. Should probably use Andrew's original list though too.
I actually think this kit may be much more beneficial to auto N54s than manual ones. As your oil temps aren't super high on track Vinney I'm guessing it's either the water or tranny fluid that's causing the limp. I believe the N54's auto is similar/same as an XR6/XR6 Turbo Falcon's? What do the guys who tune these turbo monsters do to negate overheating their autos/water?

I'm happy with that as I was the first one to call dibs in the for sale thread amd comtact Andrew. I didnt jump on it because he didnt verify what the hardware was and I assumed it was an oil cooler. If you don't want it I'll cover your costs plus more, that is if you decide to let it go

[Drawn05]

Originally Posted by TimMc

I'll add you to the list if I don't use it. Should probably use Andrew's original list though too.
I actually think this kit may be much more beneficial to auto N54s than manual ones. As your oil temps aren't super high on track Vinney I'm guessing it's either the water or tranny fluid that's causing the limp. I believe the N54's auto is similar/same as an XR6/XR6 Turbo Falcon's? What do the guys who tune these turbo monsters do to negate overheating their autos/water?

They use the 6HP26 which is better rated gearbox and they have loads more options available due to the scale of the market use have them - but iirc they come form the factory with a proper oil cooler for the atf unlike the bmw design.

[Ian///M]

Originally Posted by Justin@ADVAN Performance

Hey Ian I suspected that was the case.

IMHO,

what should be open to debate is why did BMW in all their wisdom, install a secondary radiator of such meagre proportions into a M vehicle, that is targeted at the track day enthusiast?

It makes you wonder if this was there way of moving all those BMW PPK components that were never sold, as the cost versus performance ratio of the kits were somewhat underwhelming.

Anyway whilst I am not saying it can definitely be done, as we have not performed a close inspection of the 1M front bar, but it would have been nice if BMW had fitted up oil and water coolers more in line with the volume of our cores, for the dedicated "track day" car that is the 1M...

I know there are some that have the opinion that extra water cooling is a better way to go than oil cooler, the logic being that cooler water results in lower oil temps . A larger main radiator?

1Ms don't seem to have high temp issues from those who have been tracking and modding in the US.

[BMW86]

Originally Posted by Drawn05

They use the 6HP26 which is better rated gearbox and they have loads more options available due to the scale of the market use have them - but iirc they come form the factory with a proper oil cooler for the atf unlike the bmw design.

I've always wanted to know the difference between the 2. It's a long shot but is it a possibility to retrofit their radiator? At the very least I'm sure we could get ideas from their design.

Originally Posted by ianf

I know there are some that have the opinion that extra water cooling is a better way to go than oil cooler, the logic being that cooler water results in lower oil temps . A larger main radiator?

1Ms don't seem to have high temp issues from those who have been tracking and modding in the US.

Here is my opinion on oil temp issues and general limp mode for the 1M http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showp...&postcount=310

I think it comes down to MT v AT on the N54. I'm certain the AT are generating a lot more heat which is the underlying issue.

[Justin@ADVAN Performance]

Originally Posted by BMW86

Justin, whilst I welcome the idea of a completely new radiator that replaces the stock unit, I'm not a fan of the close mesh design as it has it's downsides for a daily driver. In my case, this is my daily driver, and the occasional weekend track car so definitely a no-go for me.

Also, as you have already stated, changing out the radiator will create the need to purchase a new FMIC (which I already have and am happy with) and purchase a stand alone trans cooler. I have no doubt this would be the ultimate solution but for most it could be an overkill. Plus it sounds like big $$$. The radiator alone is $1200 or so, plus needing the FMIC and trans cooler and installation, plus the wait time to develop the product, it's just not feasible at this stage.

If you could somehow replicate and improve upon BMW's design of incorporating a secondary radiator in the brake duct, I would think it would be priced more reasonably and it might be up to the task anyway. I would welcome this idea depending on price and design.

By the way, any updates on the progress of the stage 2 oil cooler? Any photos of it installed and photos of the bracket? I hope there are not any issues?

Hey Vinney,

with regards the "Close Mesh Core" option from PWR, we are yet to confirm that it does in fact have "downsides for a daily driver", it may end up being quite ok for the commute to work and an excellent upgrade, when the car is being raced at the track.

The complete custom cooling system Peter will do for his 335i is not something he is looking to market as a product. It will be done to his specifications and requirements and it will cost what it costs, without cutting any corners.

As such if there are no customers that are prepared to go down a similar road, I do not think he will lose any sleep over it.

Lastly the mounting brackets are being powder coated as we speak, pics of the complete Stage 2 kit in its full glory to come soon.

Cheers,

JD.

[Drawn05]

Originally Posted by TimMc

I'll add you to the list if I don't use it. Should probably use Andrew's original list though too.
I actually think this kit may be much more beneficial to auto N54s than manual ones.

If all that is needed is the retrofit coding then you can just use something like autologic which has the ability to code through the CIP system just like BMW dealers can.

But, I think where it states 'activation codes on CD' it means that you need FSC codes to be able to code it all. If you didnt get this cd than it is unlikely to work.

[TimMc]

Originally Posted by TimMc

Perhaps you're right. I hope not. If the DME just "thought" it was feeding a signal to the original fan then there should be no issue. I'll try and read up some more & see how the hardware/connections on page 21 (A5* Socket contact, on DME control unit A6020, plug X60101) differ.

Originally Posted by Drawn05

If all that is needed is the retrofit coding then you can just use something like autologic which has the ability to code through the CIP system just like BMW dealers can.

But, I think where it states 'activation codes on CD' it means that you need FSC codes to be able to code it all. If you didnt get this cd than it is unlikely to work.

You sound like you're much more in the know about this stuff than I, but why would the DME think/know it's feeding anything other than the original 600w fan? Is there some kind of coding on the connector? If it's just the connector change then couldn't you just take the connector off the 600w fan and swap it with the 850w units connector so that the DME knows no different? I'm an electrician & an electrical engineer, but certainly no auto electrician or BMW electrics expert so please tell me where my logic may be flawed.
As I see it, engine gets hot, notifies the control unit of the degree of hotness who then feeds a (0-5V / 0-12V?) signal to the (600 or 850w) fan which then spins/spins faster as suggested by the DME until the temp sensor tells the system that things have cooled down. The worst I can see happening here without recoding is that with the 850w fan, things may cool down a little more rapidly than the DME wanted.

[Drawn05]

Originally Posted by TimMc

You sound like you're much more in the know about this stuff than I, but why would the DME think/know it's feeding anything other than the original 600w fan? Is there some kind of coding on the connector? If it's just the connector change then couldn't you just take the connector off the 600w fan and swap it with the 850w units connector so that the DME knows no different? I'm an electrician & an electrical engineer, but certainly no auto electrician or BMW electrics expert so please tell me where my logic may be flawed.
As I see it, engine gets hot, notifies the control unit of the degree of hotness who then feeds a (0-5V / 0-12V?) signal to the (600 or 850w) fan which then spins/spins faster as suggested by the DME until the temp sensor tells the system that things have cooled down. The worst I can see happening here without recoding is that with the 850w fan, things may cool down a little more rapidly than the DME wanted.

I am far from an expert but I am interested in upgrading my fan too, so just trying figure it out.

I know it seems straight forward but after having fiddled with certain modules in my previous bmw, I can tell you that its never easy. Basically, if you installed the new fan without the new wiring I dare say it will throw codes as the behavior of the unit will be different from stock.

[TimMc]

Originally Posted by Drawn05

I am far from an expert but I am interested in upgrading my fan too, so just trying figure it out.

I know it seems straight forward but after having fiddled with certain modules in my previous bmw, I can tell you that its never easy. Basically, if you installed the new fan without the new wiring I dare say it will throw codes as the behavior of the unit will be different from stock.

I will have all the new wiring. I have most of it now, just need an extension cable for RHD cars.

[pavo335]

Originally Posted by TimMc

I will have all the new wiring. I have most of it now, just need an extension cable for RHD cars.

Sounds like someone's off to bunnings :

[TimMc]

Originally Posted by pavo335

Sounds like someone's off to bunnings :

Unfortunately I'll be paying for the OEM BMW extension cable
Luckily I'll not be paying BMW Oz rates

[luster]

It's a straight swap, as the fans use PWM for speed control, not voltage. This means if the car says run @ 20% it will be 20% of possible power. 100% will be 100% of possible.

If it were voltage, it wouldn't be plug and play

[TimMc]

Originally Posted by luster

It's a straight swap, as the fans use PWM for speed control, not voltage. This means if the car says run @ 20% it will be 20% of possible power. 100% will be 100% of possible.

If it were voltage, it wouldn't be plug and play

Excellent!
I'm not sure why it couldn't be plug & play if it used a variable voltage input for speed control (feeding a transistor fed by the supplied beefier relay), but as stated above, this is well beyond my field of expertise. Pulse width modulation sounds like it would be much more precise than voltage modulation though.
The only issue I could foresee is that, if the car "knew" through coding that it had an 850w fan instead of a 600w unit, it may decide in a certain situation that it only needed say 80% of the 850w unit's speed rather than 100% of the 600w's. I don't see this as a biggee though, it will just cool things down a little faster.

[TimMc]

Advan's stage 1 oil cooler kit turned up at work today. Very nicely packaged in a big box. Too big for me to fit in the car as had my track tyres in the back & needed to pick the GF with luggage up from the airport. All looks good though Pete & Justin, thanks. I'll check it all out next week & research installing. How hard can it be... I'm gonna have the coolest N54 in Brisbane!

[Justin@ADVAN Performance]

Originally Posted by TimMc

Advan's stage 1 oil cooler kit turned up at work today. Very nicely packaged in a big box. Too big for me to fit in the car as had my track tyres in the back & needed to pick the GF with luggage up from the airport. All looks good though Pete & Justin, thanks. I'll check it all out next week & research installing. How hard can it be... I'm gonna have the coolest N54 in Brisbane!

Hey Tim,

I am happy to hear your Stage 1 kit arrived safely and in good order.

Once again our apologies for the delay, unfortunately the laser cutting of the bracket components and subsequent powder coating took a lot longer than originally expected.

With regards fitment, the Stage 1 kit is really quite simple and will not require the removal of the front bar.

Feel free to call the workshop next week and either Peter or "young" Chris will be able to give you some pointers, on the steps required for installation.

Cheers,

Justin.

[Justin@ADVAN Performance]

Hi Gents,

in lieu of the less than spectacular interest in our group buy and an unforeseen increase in component costs, we will no longer be offering either our Stage 1 or Stage 2 oil cooler kits at the previously advertised GB pricing.

The kits will still be availble for purchase, however they will now be sold at a yet to be determined retail price.

We will also require payment in full, prior to assembling any kits for shipment in the future.

Thanking you,

Justin.

[luster]

did you ever come up with a price for the second hand stage 1 unit?

[alik01]

Justin, is there any reports from the discussions with Peter regarding 1M cooling? Especially following Zuzu's visit.

Thanks.

[BMW86]

Originally Posted by TimMc

Advan's stage 1 oil cooler kit turned up at work today. Very nicely packaged in a big box. Too big for me to fit in the car as had my track tyres in the back & needed to pick the GF with luggage up from the airport. All looks good though Pete & Justin, thanks. I'll check it all out next week & research installing. How hard can it be... I'm gonna have the coolest N54 in Brisbane!

Tim, get the kit fitted up and give us a review!

Originally Posted by Justin@ADVAN Performance

Hi Gents,

in lieu of the less than spectacular interest in our group buy and an unforeseen increase in component costs, we will no longer be offering either our Stage 1 or Stage 2 oil cooler kits at the previously advertised GB pricing.

The kits will still be availble for purchase, however they will now be sold at a yet to be determined retail price.

We will also require payment in full, prior to assembling any kits for shipment in the future.

Thanking you,

Justin.

Justin, I'm still waiting for photos of the Stage 2 kit, and it's mainly the custom fabricated bracket I'm interested in. I like to see/know what I'm buying before I pay. Also I assume you mean this pricing revision applies to anyone purchasing after the GB?

[BMW86]

Originally Posted by Drawn05

I am far from an expert but I am interested in upgrading my fan too, so just trying figure it out.

I know it seems straight forward but after having fiddled with certain modules in my previous bmw, I can tell you that its never easy. Basically, if you installed the new fan without the new wiring I dare say it will throw codes as the behavior of the unit will be different from stock.

Originally Posted by TimMc

You sound like you're much more in the know about this stuff than I, but why would the DME think/know it's feeding anything other than the original 600w fan? Is there some kind of coding on the connector? If it's just the connector change then couldn't you just take the connector off the 600w fan and swap it with the 850w units connector so that the DME knows no different? I'm an electrician & an electrical engineer, but certainly no auto electrician or BMW electrics expert so please tell me where my logic may be flawed.
As I see it, engine gets hot, notifies the control unit of the degree of hotness who then feeds a (0-5V / 0-12V?) signal to the (600 or 850w) fan which then spins/spins faster as suggested by the DME until the temp sensor tells the system that things have cooled down. The worst I can see happening here without recoding is that with the 850w fan, things may cool down a little more rapidly than the DME wanted.

I did some reading up on this kit also, and it seems coding is required for this kit, although it's meant to be included. Also, it seems new brake ducts are also required and it's designed to work with the Performance bumper only, although I can't see why it wouldn't work with the standard M Sport bumper though

I'm keen to see how it pans out and then possibly look at getting something custom made up.

[Justin@ADVAN Performance]

Originally Posted by luster

did you ever come up with a price for the second hand stage 1 unit?

Hey Clinton,

to be honest I had not given it any further thought, as the Stage 1 kit is still on my car.

When I have bought all the Stage 2 components and I'm ready to do the upgrade I will let you know.

Cheers,

JD.