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      08-20-2012, 07:12 PM   #1
blutattoo
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Money no object Susp. upgrades?

If cost was not a consideration what suspension setup would you choose for the ultimate street/autocross/track setup for a 135? Tires not withstanding, because that's a whole other ball of wax.

Everyone has an opinion, but I'd love to get an idea of what I should shoot for.

I autocross frequently and am willing to deal with a little stiffer suspension than some, but don't want a total compromise of ride quality.

I find the current setup ill prepared for autocross. Tons of understeer which I'd love to do away with (although driver error has a lot to do with that as well).

Thanks for any input.

Current setup
2012 135i M pkg 6mt
Dinan Stage 1 suspension
Apex 18's w/PSS 235/40/18 265/35/18
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      08-20-2012, 10:00 PM   #2
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See my sig for all the new susp mods I got. Ride is same, not much harsher at all. Gone is body roll and much less understeer. Jury is still out as I am waiting for cooler weather before AutoX and track time.
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      08-21-2012, 12:03 AM   #3
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Ohlins

Still reasonably ish priced, but $2500pp plus install for the base models.. isn't cheap.. Look exponentially more for higher spec stuff. Serious track gear though.
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      08-21-2012, 12:28 AM   #4
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ohlins.

because... ohlins.

if your roads are crap like mine, stay with the standard springs. if they're reasonably smooth, talk to HPautowerke and let them talk you into some swift springs.
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      08-21-2012, 01:35 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yaymitch View Post
See my sig for all the new susp mods I got. Ride is same, not much harsher at all. Gone is body roll and much less understeer. Jury is still out as I am waiting for cooler weather before AutoX and track time.
I like the thought of the M3 bit's but have heard mixed reviews about the front suspensions components when it comes to understeer on the track. I read a couple of posts that suggested it actually increased understeer in autox even though it made the car much flatter when turning. I'm not sure it would make me quicker on the track, but probably a vast improvement over stock during normal spirited driving.

I guess if you consider BMW has a multi-million dollar r&d budget. The suspension bits are about as good as they're gonna get.

What about coil-overs or spring/shock combos? The M3 parts will break the bank for me, but it'll be nice to have something to shoot for.
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      08-21-2012, 03:01 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blutattoo
Quote:
Originally Posted by yaymitch View Post
See my sig for all the new susp mods I got. Ride is same, not much harsher at all. Gone is body roll and much less understeer. Jury is still out as I am waiting for cooler weather before AutoX and track time.
I like the thought of the M3 bit's but have heard mixed reviews about the front suspensions components when it comes to understeer on the track. I read a couple of posts that suggested it actually increased understeer in autox even though it made the car much flatter when turning. I'm not sure it would make me quicker on the track, but probably a vast improvement over stock during normal spirited driving.

I guess if you consider BMW has a multi-million dollar r&d budget. The suspension bits are about as good as they're gonna get.

What about coil-overs or spring/shock combos? The M3 parts will break the bank for me, but it'll be nice to have something to shoot for.
M3 front bits (control arm tension rod etc.) will 100% help, no way are they worse than stock
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      08-21-2012, 04:08 AM   #7
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Money no object?

ER Front Widebody conversion. Then run 285's square. Get full M3 bits + Ohlin's or Moton's. LSD as well.
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      08-21-2012, 06:24 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blutattoo View Post
I like the thought of the M3 bit's but have heard mixed reviews about the front suspensions components when it comes to understeer on the track. I read a couple of posts that suggested it actually increased understeer in autox even though it made the car much flatter when turning. I'm not sure it would make me quicker on the track, but probably a vast improvement over stock during normal spirited driving.

I guess if you consider BMW has a multi-million dollar r&d budget. The suspension bits are about as good as they're gonna get.
Unfortunately not the case. The bushings in the front suspension arms are very soft. Its because they are designed for run-flat tires. It is possible to upgrade to aftermarket bushings without changing the front suspension arms. The M3 arms include proper rubber bushings and also give increased negative camber. This small amount of negative front camber makes a really big difference to the handling over stock in a street driving scenario - MUCH LESS understeer! If you want to really dial-out understeer in autox, you will probably want to get camber plates to get even more negative camber. Although I don't run autox, I would say that camber plates + upgraded tension strut bushings is an alternative to the M3 front arm kit.
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      08-21-2012, 06:41 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cooler2442 View Post
Money no object?

ER Front Widebody conversion. Then run 285's square. Get full M3 bits + Ohlin's or Moton's. LSD as well.
+1
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      08-21-2012, 07:25 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cooler2442 View Post
Money no object?

ER Front Widebody conversion. Then run 285's square. Get full M3 bits + Ohlin's or Moton's. LSD as well.
+2
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      08-21-2012, 08:00 AM   #11
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I'm hearing a lot of talk about saving money for a money is no object thread.

Drop out the front and rear subframes and retrofit the frames from a 1M. It's not too much of a difference from all M3 parts in the front. But in the rear it completely changes the suspension geometry.

Do that - and ER kit up front + LSD and you'd be pretty set
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      08-21-2012, 01:19 PM   #12
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If money is no object, buy a Ferrari instead:-):-):-)
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      08-21-2012, 01:44 PM   #13
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I like the Ferrari idea, now where do I fit that pesky baby seat?!

Gonna order the bushings, dinan camber kit and m3 front suspension stuff this week. Then I'm gonna go hunting down some 996's hehe. This car is so quick in autox it's gonna be nice to get the backend to rotate. As is I'm only half second off the quickest 996's and a second and a half of the gt3's.

As for the ohlins well there on the to do list along with some seat time at willow springs and laguna seca.
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      08-21-2012, 03:22 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blutattoo View Post
I like the Ferrari idea, now where do I fit that pesky baby seat?!

Gonna order the bushings, dinan camber kit and m3 front suspension stuff this week. Then I'm gonna go hunting down some 996's hehe. This car is so quick in autox it's gonna be nice to get the backend to rotate. As is I'm only half second off the quickest 996's and a second and a half of the gt3's.

As for the ohlins well there on the to do list along with some seat time at willow springs and laguna seca.
You'll get maximum -2.0 camber with Dinan + M3 parts. I promise, that's not enough for autocross or track. Get Ground Control or Vorshlag adjustable camber plates and either adjust them from -1.2 for street to -3.2 for track like I do or just set it to -3.2 and leave it that way like most people.
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      08-21-2012, 05:30 PM   #15
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Money no object? Street and competition? Bilstein MDS doubles.
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      08-21-2012, 06:30 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cooler2442 View Post
Money no object?

ER Front Widebody conversion. Then run 285's square. Get full M3 bits + Ohlin's or Moton's. LSD as well.
transformer lol
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      08-21-2012, 06:33 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blutattoo View Post
I like the thought of the M3 bit's but have heard mixed reviews about the front suspensions components when it comes to understeer on the track. I read a couple of posts that suggested it actually increased understeer in autox even though it made the car much flatter when turning. I'm not sure it would make me quicker on the track, but probably a vast improvement over stock during normal spirited driving.

I guess if you consider BMW has a multi-million dollar r&d budget. The suspension bits are about as good as they're gonna get.

What about coil-overs or spring/shock combos? The M3 parts will break the bank for me, but it'll be nice to have something to shoot for.
I think the increased understeer is due to folks putting on the E9x sway bar on stock suspension, especially the E93 sway bar.
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      08-22-2012, 01:37 AM   #18
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I would do a full M3 suspension swap, front and rear, strut tower brace and all, adjustable rear toe arms, Ohlins R&T or JRZ RS1 and a good LSD.
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      08-22-2012, 02:51 AM   #19
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Quote:
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I would do a full M3 suspension swap, front and rear, strut tower brace and all, adjustable rear toe arms, Ohlins R&T or JRZ RS1 and a good LSD.
+3 (from others) on the full M3 suspension swap + Ohlins + LSD + ER Widebody

If you want to maintain comfort when not racing, keep the stock suspension (springs / shocks) and swap them back in.
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      08-23-2012, 01:02 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cooler2442
Money no object?

ER Front Widebody conversion. Then run 285's square. Get full M3 bits + Ohlin's or Moton's. LSD as well.
Dry of course

But really, 305 or go home

Can't imagine how wide it'd look from behind on our teeny cars

Lsd with shorter final drive allowed? ;p

Cant forget strut braces.. Arc or bmwp cf front, probably just a whiteline rear, and underbody etc. etc.
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      09-01-2012, 03:54 PM   #21
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Want to get rid of your understeer at the autox then you need some more negative camber and scratch the 235/265 tire setup. You need a square setup. Your car is almost perfect 50/50 front/rear weight balanced. Having a 235/265 setup is almost guaranteed to give you understeer no matter how much negative camber you dial in.

My recommendation is the dinan camber plates plus a set of wheels with 235 all around for the autocross track. The dinan camber plates are not adjustable which for me is a positive since some adjustable camber plates can be problematic over time.
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      09-01-2012, 05:45 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeelToe
Want to get rid of your understeer at the autox then you need some more negative camber and scratch the 235/265 tire setup. You need a square setup. Your car is almost perfect 50/50 front/rear weight balanced. Having a 235/265 setup is almost guaranteed to give you understeer no matter how much negative camber you dial in.

My recommendation is the dinan camber plates plus a set of wheels with 235 all around for the autocross track. The dinan camber plates are not adjustable which for me is a positive since some adjustable camber plates can be problematic over time.
235 is a bit narrow, even a 128 would struggle for traction
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