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      10-13-2011, 06:02 PM   #23
VP Electricity
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Thanks for all the comments! Here are some general replies:

We have done a lot of E82 and E90/E92 upgrades, and a few E60. We have had a very similar package for the E90 sedan for quite a while. It gets great reviews - Technic ran one in his sedan until he sold it for a coupe and has installed them into a number of his customer's cars in south Florida - and it works very well. Our entry-level woofer is the ID10. For its price, it sounds much better, and plays lower, than any other woofer we've tested.

But what we are asked about most is for a subwoofer that:

- Looks stock

- Has a grille

- Doesn't involve cutting, screwing, or modification

- Has minimal impact on the trunk volume

- Sounds great - not overbearing or "one-note" in character - and blends with whatever is in the front cabin system.

So that's exactly what this is (basically, what we've been offering for the E90 for quite a while, just for the E82).

We've used the ID10 in the E90 Level One sub-add package since day one. We use a 250W amp. Why? Because 250W is what the speaker's voice coil is rated to handle electrically, and because Arc makes a fan-cooled micro-sized amp with some internal circuitry to let it work well with the Top HiFi system. I have no idea if the suspension makes noise when running it at higher power levels (actually, what it would make noise at is higher excursions, which is also enclosure-dependent), and I suspect the designer didn't care either, since the Pe is 250W RMS, but I can say this: E90 owners get plenty of low-end output with 250W in our Level One system, and the transfer from the E90 trunk to the cabin isn't any easier than it is in the E82.

We've done plenty - plenty - of fully-upgraded amplified systems with the ID10 in the E90 sedan, and it works very well. The only time I would suggest adding this to stock speakers is if you have the Top HiFi (Logic 7 or harman/kardon) system. Even then, I'm pretty critical of that system, and our upgrades sound better.

Now, comparing an ID10 to a 10W6 is kind of apples-and-oranges - and I am sure no one meant to make such a comparison. You don't buy a W6 unless you are looking for a LOT of bass output. We work with both lines here, we are a dealer for both, and the W6 is a totally different animal than the ID series.

I know that some folks just want lots of bass, and are not as concerned with musicality, the midbass-sub-bass handoff, or actual sub-bass extension to the degree that I am - and that's fine, even if it's not my bag, baby. If someone wants the W6 in here - and this enclosure is within the operating specs of a W6 - we eliminate the recess for the grille, flatten the front panel, and front-load the woofer flat with the outer plane.


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My concern would be that if you are amping the Speakers then I'm not sure that a 250-300w sub is sufficient.
Well, that depends on your goal. If you want a musical system that extends the sub-bass down below what an 8" can provide, this works great. If you want lots and lots of output, you may want more power - but don't make the mistake of comparing RMS power to output, because there isn't a linear correlation. 250W into a W6 won't give you the same output as 250W into a different woofer. (Don't use sensitivity ratings either, as those are all measured at 1K,not in the bass region - JL makes this point on their wb site IIRC). The number of watts a speaker is rated doesn't tell us how loud it plays, and neither does the number of watts we give it. It's a more systems-oriented calculation (enclosure, speaker, wattage, car in question, frequency band, etc.)

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"My thoughts are that it doesn't really make sense to put an SQ focussed Sub in the boot where it's muffled by the back seat anyway..."
Well, that's pretty much where they go, isn't it. We do mostly SQ-oriented systems, and fortunately, that's not a problem. Some crazy systems do put them in the dash, or in the floor, but those are such a minority to seem a statistical aberration. Actually, because our BMWs have 8" in the floor, we have the opportunity to run fast woofers as midbass up front and then depend on the trunk sub for the sub-bass - it's the best of both worlds.

In the E90, we have used ID, JL, and Morel pretty often. That's what we have tested in the E82 1-series. Some woofers, like the IDQ and the W3 and W6, work, but won't accept our matching grille. Some, like the ID and the Morel, work fine with the matching grille.

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My guess - without having seen one in the flesh - is that it won't be capable of keeping up with a seriously powerful setup.
I've read this a few times, and I'm sorry to say, I can't quite figure out what you're trying to say here. We're talking about an enclosure, and also an enclosure with one of the woofers available in our Level One package. We have systems which can be ordered with three different ID models, including the IDMAX, the JL W3 and W6, and the Morel Ultimo and Ultimo SC. Are you seriously trying to say that this enclosure isn't capable of supporting a woofer that is part of a "seriously powerful setup"? Are are you just saying that using the ID woofer in a high-powered aftermarket system might be the wrong choice (which I agree with - we only use the ID woofer in Level One).


In response to another question, we have been a supporting vendor of Bimmerpost for some time, and we would be listed as a supporting 1Addicts vendor if the program existed. We pay the Supporting Vendor fees every month to have the opportunity to offer our products on Bimmerpost, and we have received permission to talk about our 1-series products on 1Addicts, even though the system doesn't show us as a 'vendor" in the 1Addicts section.
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      10-13-2011, 11:25 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VP Electricity View Post
We've used the ID10 in the E90 Level One sub-add package since day one. We use a 250W amp. Why? Because 250W is what the speaker's voice coil is rated to handle electrically, and because Arc makes a fan-cooled micro-sized amp with some internal circuitry to let it work well with the Top HiFi system. I have no idea if the suspension makes noise when running it at higher power levels (actually, what it would make noise at is higher excursions, which is also enclosure-dependent), and I suspect the designer didn't care either, since the Pe is 250W RMS, but I can say this: E90 owners get plenty of low-end output with 250W in our Level One system, and the transfer from the E90 trunk to the cabin isn't any easier than it is in the E82.
Agreed. I didn't mean to sound critical and perhaps I could have worded it better. The point I was trying to make is that your setup seems to be oriented towards complimenting a fairly moderate system - and one that's aimed at SQ rather than SPL - obviously. As you've mentioned -this is a stage 1 upgrade...

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Originally Posted by VP Electricity View Post
We've done plenty - plenty - of fully-upgraded amplified systems with the ID10 in the E90 sedan, and it works very well. The only time I would suggest adding this to stock speakers is if you have the Top HiFi (Logic 7 or harman/kardon) system. Even then, I'm pretty critical of that system, and our upgrades sound better.
Yup. I started with the Stock setup and it is woeful...


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Originally Posted by VP Electricity View Post
Now, comparing an ID10 to a 10W6 is kind of apples-and-oranges - and I am sure no one meant to make such a comparison. You don't buy a W6 unless you are looking for a LOT of bass output. We work with both lines here, we are a dealer for both, and the W6 is a totally different animal than the ID series.
As you say, I never meant to compare them as anything more than a way to illustrate that there are indeed WIDELY varying levels of Audio Setups and to say that what you have listed is not really anything like what's in my car..

Quote:
Originally Posted by VP Electricity View Post
I can't quite figure out what you're trying to say here. We're talking about an enclosure, and also an enclosure with one of the woofers available in our Level One package. We have systems which can be ordered with three different ID models, including the IDMAX, the JL W3 and W6, and the Morel Ultimo and Ultimo SC. Are you seriously trying to say that this enclosure isn't capable of supporting a woofer that is part of a "seriously powerful setup"? Are are you just saying that using the ID woofer in a high-powered aftermarket system might be the wrong choice (which I agree with - we only use the ID woofer in Level One).
Yes. I was specifically talking about the enclosure/woofer combination. You had not previously mentioned the IDMAX or the JL Subs and I actually questioned whether or not a 10w6 would fit with regard to mounting depth. A question which you did not specifically answer but if you do a higher level system that includes it then I guess the answer is yes...

Just to re-iterate: I wasn't questioning or criticising the enclosure or Sub - more commenting that if you like the sound of my system then THAT COMBINATION is probably not your cup of tea... Apples and Oranges - as you said earlier...
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      10-19-2011, 08:03 PM   #25
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Well, sounds like we agree on half of it. You assumed that the Level One package which I described was the only application, but it's not, so we cleared that up. I'll make that more clear in future, thanks.
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      10-31-2011, 10:52 AM   #26
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      12-09-2011, 02:41 AM   #27
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I must have missed these comments months ago. Some great discussion in here. From the looks of it, the ID10 isn't for me, as I want something more powerful. I want something along the line of Angus' (Harlequin) setup, as it has more than enough bass
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      12-20-2011, 11:30 PM   #28
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Sounds like a project for me!
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      12-22-2011, 12:58 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMW86 View Post
I must have missed these comments months ago. Some great discussion in here. From the looks of it, the ID10 isn't for me, as I want something more powerful. I want something along the line of Angus' (Harlequin) setup, as it has more than enough bass
If you haven't heard the ID, I'm not sure how you "know" this, frankly.
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      12-22-2011, 01:09 AM   #30
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If you haven't heard the ID, I'm not sure how you "know" this, frankly.
I'm waiting for a reply to an email I sent you on 12 December 2011 regarding some packages.
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      01-01-2013, 10:24 PM   #31
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Bumping this old thread, trying to order amp, loaded sub, and harnesses. Emails and PMs sent multiple times. Thnx
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      01-05-2013, 06:29 AM   #32
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I'm actually pretty curious about the costs/setup for my car as well. '12 with HK audio, so the install *should* be pretty simple if i'm reading this right.
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      01-09-2013, 10:46 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by 1&done
Bumping this old thread, trying to order amp, loaded sub, and harnesses. Emails and PMs sent multiple times. Thnx
Sorry about that. We've been having some problems with emails getting lost when linked from the site. Working on that. And PMs don't always work so great. Try sending an email directly to us at musicarnw at gmail dot com.
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      01-10-2013, 12:15 AM   #34
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If I want to come by the shop and check you guys out, is there anyway to hear an upgraded 1 series musicar system? My car has the "hi-fi" system and it has been a bit disappointing (only had the car 2 months). My last E90 had the Logic7 system and it actually didn't sound too bad, but this one isn't so great.
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      01-10-2013, 12:37 AM   #35
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Sure. We'd love to have you come by. Always nice to meet a forum member in the area. We don't have a 1er readily available, and Ken just traded in his E91. Perhaps we can coordinate a time to have one of our local customers come by and meet with us. Shoot us an email and we'll set something up.
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      01-10-2013, 12:48 AM   #36
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I'm actually pretty curious about the costs/setup for my car as well. '12 with HK audio, so the install *should* be pretty simple if i'm reading this right.
You can email us for info on different packages and costs. In case you haven't seen it, here's a video showing EXACTLY what it takes to put one of these packages in an HK equipped E82:

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=790113
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      01-10-2013, 01:24 PM   #37
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If I went stage 2 (car has Hi-Fi now) will my bass response get a lot better or do I really need the trunk sub too? Was debating on stage 2, delete the rear speakers and add sub. Might sell off a couple of my assault rifles I'm not using since prices are ridiculous now and spend the cash on something I would actually use!
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      01-10-2013, 10:01 PM   #38
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If I went stage 2 (car has Hi-Fi now) will my bass response get a lot better or do I really need the trunk sub too? Was debating on stage 2, delete the rear speakers and add sub. Might sell off a couple of my assault rifles I'm not using since prices are ridiculous now and spend the cash on something I would actually use!
Dude...a couple your assault rifles? You must have quite the arsenal.

Yes...bass is definitely improved with our Level 2 systems, even without the trunk sub. There are a few questions that we ask when making recommendations. What type of music do you listen to? What is your reference for a complete sound system (i.e, what kind of systems have you had in the past that you've really liked, home and car)? Things like that. But you really want to talk to Ken (VP Electricity)... he can get you sorted and answer any and all questions you may have. Try giving us a call or shooting us an email.
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      01-10-2013, 10:15 PM   #39
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Cool. I've been spoiled with high end home audio. Mostly tube amps by Cary audio, Audio Research, Quicksilver and the like. Proac speakers, Magnepans, etc. Currently running a whole home "in wall" system with Triad speakers, which are made in Portland and some large solid state amps made by a small direct company called Emotiva.

I quit spending big bucks on car audio years ago after a large theft. Last big car stuff I've had was 15 years ago or more. Back then I always ran Linear Power amps and Boston Acoustics Pro series separates. Been many years since I've upgraded a car system though!
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      01-10-2013, 11:19 PM   #40
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I'm very impressed with the 8" SWS subs running off a XD700/5. My last car had a 12" JLW3 so I was expecting to be disappointed. You gotta add the spacer though, that improves the output by a lot.

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      02-11-2013, 11:27 PM   #41
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Sorry about that. We've been having some problems with emails getting lost when linked from the site. Working on that. And PMs don't always work so great. Try sending an email directly to us at musicarnw at gmail dot com.
Email sent
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