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      11-09-2009, 02:54 PM   #1
tnorton776
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Update on n52 ticking: *>Important<* information

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...=13504&page=44

Ticking Noise SBSI B 11 09 07 -N52 Engine HVA System
________________________________________
The ticking noise is a known problem with the N52 (3.0L) engine fitted to e90 series vehicle. I have the problem with my 3 series wagon which now has 68K miles. I only get the problem if I travel short journey's, most of my driving is 30 mile min. so I don't here the noise very often. The real fix is to change the cylinder head, my dealer said because I reported it during the warranty period they would repair it if the SB fix does not work, so far it does.

This Service Information bulletin supersedes SI 11 09 07 dated April 2008.

designates changes to this revision

SUBJECT
Intermittent Hydraulic Valve Adjuster (HVA): "Ticking" or "Rattling" Noises


MODEL
All E82, E83, E85, E86, E88, E60, E61, E70, E90, E91, E92, and E93 with the N51, N52 or N52K engines


SITUATION
An occasional ticking or rattling noise from the HVA elements may occur during cold engine starts or frequent short-distance driving.

CAUSE
In these situations, the HVA elements may not yet have been supplied with sufficient amounts of air-free oil. This condition will not cause any damage to the engine, and usually remedies itself with a longer driving distance or operating times at full operating temperature.

CORRECTION
In the event of a customer complaint, please perform the following the HVA bleeding procedure.

PROCEDURE
Important notes:

The bleed time may take anywhere from between two minutes and (in rare cases) to a maximum of 30 minutes. This procedure is to be performed on a level surface with the vehicle stationary, and in a properly ventilated area.

Procedure preconditions:

Engine oil level correct neither underfilled nor overfilled

Engine running at operating temperature

Bring the engine up to an operating speed (no load) of 2000-3000 rpm and maintain this condition for three minutes (bleeding procedure).

Let the engine idle for 15-30 seconds and reevaluate whether the noise is still present or not.

Engine quiet procedure is finished.

Engine noise is still present repeat the procedure; perform steps #1 and #2 up to a maximum of 5 times.

Only if the noise remains after performing the bleeding procedure 5 times: proceed by performing the procedure for a final time, also at an engine operating speed of 2000-3000 rpm, but for a total time duration of 15 minutes.

WARRANTY INFORMATION
Covered under the terms of the BMW New Vehicle Limited Warranty.




(1) 11-12-7-591-617 N52 Cylinder head with valve
(1) 11-12-9-391-547 Set of Alu. screws F Cylinder
(1) 11-12-7-548-799 Bolt cylinder head
(1) 11-12-0-392-547 set of alu. screws
(3) 11-12-7-521-167 ASS-Stud Bolt
(2) 11-36-7-524-954 Collar Screw
(1) 11-12-7-555-757 Cylinder head gasket
(1) 11-12-7-548-921 Gasket set cylinder head
(1) 11-12-0-409-288 set of alu. screws
(2) 13-62-7-530-413 Torx screw
(2) 11-12-7-529-997 Torx Screw
(6) 33-32-6-768-354 Hex screw with collar
(1) 11-42-7-566-327 Set oil-filter Elem
(7) 07-51-0-017-954 Motor oil SW30
(1) 82-14-1-467-704 Antifreeze
(1) 22-11-0-392-551 Set of Alu. screws

September 2009

This Service Information bulletin supersedes SI B11 09 07 dated January 2009.

SUBJECT
Intermittent Hydraulic Valve Adjuster (HVA) Noise

MODEL
All E82, E83, E88, E85, E86, E60, E61, E70, E90, E91, E92 and E93 vehicles with N51, N52 or N52K engines produced approximately up to November 31st 2008; refer to cylinder head casting identification attachment.


SITUATION
An occasional ticking or rattling noise from the camshaft hydraulic valve lifters (HVA) may occur during cold engine starts, due to frequent short-distance driving, or the noise may occur for an extended period of time even though the engine is at operating temperature.

Improved parts were phased into production beginning on 10/1/2008 and fully implemented on November 31st 2008.

CORRECTION
Do not perform the bleeding procedure that was previously provided in SI B11 09 07 which has now been deleted.

All vehicles produced between 10/1/2008 and 11/31/2008 must have each vehicle's cylinder head casting number identified before hydraulic valve lifters (HVA) replacement, due to staggered implementation. Refer to the attachment for the casting number location. Vehicles produced after 11/31/2008 have already been fitted with improved parts. Vehicles produced prior to 10/1/2008 will require the new parts.

Improved Casting Numbers

N51 (B30)
7588277.01

N52 (B30)
7588273.01

N52K (B30)
7588271.01

A cylinder head casting number that does not match will require replacement of the 12 exhaust camshaft hydraulic valve lifters (HVA) as per Repair Instruction RA 11 33 050, Removing and installing/replacing all rocker arms. Only the exhaust camshaft and rocker arms have to be removed in order to replace the hydraulic valve lifters. Do not remove or replace any intake camshaft valve train components.

PARTS INFORMATION
Part Number
Description
Quantity

11 33 7 605 330
Hydraulic Valve Lifter (HVA)
12

Refer to EPC for additional gaskets, seals and bolts, as required by the Repair Instructions.

WARRANTY INFORMATION
Covered under the terms of the BMW New Vehicle Limited Warranty, or the Certified Pre-Owned program.

Please refer to the latest KSD for the applicable Main or Associated labor allowance for the specific model.

Defect Code:
11 33 93 39 00


Labor Operation:
Labor Allowance:
Description:

00 58 248
Refer to KSD
Replace exhaust camshaft hydraulic valve lifters (HVA)

*Main Work

or

00 58 827
Refer to KSD
Replace exhaust camshaft hydraulic valve lifters (HVA)

+ Associated Work

Note: The following explanations will spell out the correct use of the work times.

Main Work:
Use this labor operation number when the only repair performed is the listed warranty
repair.


OR


+Associated Work:
Use this labor operation number when other repairs or services are performed along with the listed warranty repair.
Under no circumstances should both labor operation numbers be claimed. Attempts to claim both times will result in an unnecessary delay in claim processing and payment.




(1) 11-12-7-591-617 N52 Cylinder head with valve
(1) 11-12-9-391-547 Set of Alu. screws F Cylinder
(1) 11-12-7-548-799 Bolt cylinder head
(1) 11-12-0-392-547 set of alu. screws
(3) 11-12-7-521-167 ASS-Stud Bolt
(2) 11-36-7-524-954 Collar Screw
(1) 11-12-7-555-757 Cylinder head gasket
(1) 11-12-7-548-921 Gasket set cylinder head
(1) 11-12-0-409-288 set of alu. screws
(2) 13-62-7-530-413 Torx screw
(2) 11-12-7-529-997 Torx Screw
(6) 33-32-6-768-354 Hex screw with collar
(1) 11-42-7-566-327 Set oil-filter Elem
(7) 07-51-0-017-954 Motor oil SW30
(1) 82-14-1-467-704 Antifreeze
(1) 22-11-0-392-551 Set of Alu. screws

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...=13504&page=44

According to the Report of the House of Representatives which accompanied the law (House Report No. 93-1197, 93d Cong 2d Sess.) the Magnuson-Moss act was enacted by Congress in response to the widespread misuse by merchants of express warranties and disclaimers. The legislative history indicates that the purpose of the Act is to make warranties on consumer products more readily understood and enforceable and to provide the Federal Trade Commission with means to better protect consumers.[1]

The statute is remedial in nature and is intended to protect consumers from deceptive warranty practices. Consumer products are not required to have warranties, but if one is given, it must comply with the Magnuson-Moss Act.

[edit] Definitions used
The Magnuson-Moss Act contains many definitions:

A "consumer" is a buyer of consumer goods for personal use. A buyer of consumer products for resale is not a consumer.
A "supplier" is any person engaged in the business of making a consumer product directly or indirectly available to consumers.
A "warrantor" is any supplier or other person who gives or offers a written warranty or who has some obligation under an implied warranty.
A "consumer product" is generally any tangible personal property for sale and that is normally used for personal, family, or household purposes. It is important to note that the determination whether a good is a consumer product requires a factual finding, on a case-by-case basis. Najran Co. for General Contracting and Trading v. Fleetwood Enterprises, Inc., 659 F. Supp. 1081 (S.D. Ga. 1986).
A "written warranty" (also called an express warranty) is any written promise made in connection with the sale of a consumer product by a supplier to a consumer that relates to the material and/or workmanship and that affirms that the product is defect-free or will meet a certain standard of performance over a specified time.
An "implied warranty" is defined in state law. The Magnuson-Moss Act simply provides limitations on disclaimers and provides a remedy for their violation.
Designations:
A "full warranty" is one that meets the federal minimum standards for a warranty. Such warranties must be "conspicuously designated" as full warranties. If each of the following five statements is true about your warranty's terms and conditions, it is a "full" warranty:
You do not limit the duration of implied warranties.
You provide warranty service to anyone who owns the product during the warranty period; that is, you do not limit coverage to first purchasers.
You provide warranty service free of charge, including such costs as returning the product or removing and reinstalling the product when necessary.
You provide, at the consumer's choice, either a replacement or a full refund if, after a reasonable number of tries, you are unable to repair the product.
You do not require consumers to perform any duty as a precondition for receiving service, except notifying you that service is needed, unless you can demonstrate that the duty is reasonable.
A "limited warranty" is one that does not meet the federal minimums. Such warranties must be "conspicuously designated" as limited warranties.
A "multiple warranty" is part full and part limited.
A "service contract" is different from a warranty because service contracts do not affirm the quality or workmanship of a consumer product. A service contract is a written instrument in which a supplier agrees to perform, over a fixed period of time or for a specified duration, services relating to the maintenance or repair, or both, of a consumer product. Agreements that meet the statutory definition of service contracts, but are sold and regulated under state law as contracts of insurance, do not come under the Act's provisions.
[edit] Requirements
The Act provides that any warrantor warranting a consumer product to a consumer by means of a written warranty must disclose, fully and conspicuously, in simple and readily understood language, the terms and conditions of the warranty to the extent required by rules of the Federal Trade Commission. The FTC has enacted regulations governing the disclosure of written consumer product warranty terms and conditions on consumer products actually costing the consumer more than $15. The Rules can be found at 16 C.F.R. Part 700.

Under the terms of the Act, ambiguous statements in a warranty are construed against the drafter of the warranty.

Likewise, service contracts must fully, clearly, and conspicuously disclose their terms and conditions in simple and readily understood language.

Warrantors cannot require that only branded parts be used with the product in order to retain the warranty.[2] This is commonly referred to as the "tie-in sales" provisions[3], and is frequently mentioned in the context of third-party computer parts, such as memory and hard drives.

[edit] Full Warranty Requirements
Under a full warranty, in the case of a defect, malfunction, or failure to conform with the written warranty, the warrantor:

must, as a minimum, remedy the consumer product within a reasonable time and without charge;
may not impose any limitation on the duration of any implied warranty on the product;
may not exclude or limit consequential damages for a breach of any written or implied warranty on the product, unless the exclusion or limitation conspicuously appears on the face of the warranty; and
if the product, or a component part, contains a defect or malfunction, must permit the consumer to elect either a refund or replacement without charge, after a reasonable number of repair attempts.
In addition, the warrantor may not impose any duty, other than notification, upon any consumer, as a condition of securing the repair of any consumer product that malfunctions, is defective, or does not conform to the written warranty. However, the warrantor may require consumers to return a defective item to its place of purchase for repair.

The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act (P.L. 93-637) is a United States federal law (15 U.S.C. 2301 et seq.). Enacted in 1975, it is the federal statute that governs warranties on consumer products.

The Act was sponsored by Senator Warren G. Magnuson of Washington and Congressman John E. Moss of California, both Democrats.
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      11-09-2009, 05:23 PM   #2
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thanks for the info mate, i also get a ticking noise but thought it was normal, will have to double check now
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      11-09-2009, 05:50 PM   #3
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I actually found out about this by accident. I followed a girl in her 135i convertible because I wanted to complement her on her 19" CSL rims. She said to me "Hear that ticking noise? Get it fixed. I got mine fixed. It's something to do with air in 'somewhere' and they need to bleed it out".

So, I went into my dealer and got it fixed. Easy.
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      11-09-2009, 06:11 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cozza View Post
I actually found out about this by accident. I followed a girl in her 135i convertible because I wanted to complement her on her 19" CSL rims. She said to me "Hear that ticking noise? Get it fixed. I got mine fixed. It's something to do with air in 'somewhere' and they need to bleed it out".

So, I went into my dealer and got it fixed. Easy.

CORRECTION
Do not perform the bleeding procedure that was previously provided in SI B11 09 07 which has now been deleted.
According the service bulletin, the bleed procedure should have been discontinued at all bmw dealers (but it appears they are still trying to not attack the real issue and playing games.)

The bleed is a band aid temporary fix but not a solution. the Intermittent hydraulic valve adjuster and lifters are defective and can cause excessive wear and tear inside your engine if you do not have BMW replace with the improved parts. The ticking and clicking is actually metal rubbing on metal and also not lubing the top half of your engine correctly... This SHOULD be a major recall from BMW, but it appears that they dont want to be out several million dollars for their own faulty part.
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      11-09-2009, 06:14 PM   #5
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It also appears that even vehicles with the n52 manufactured as late as june of 09 STILL have the older part and ticking/air/not getting lubed properly problem. So be very weary and demand BMW look into this issue. We pay way too much for these cars to be lacking quality in critical areas like this.
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      11-09-2009, 08:47 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tnorton776 View Post
CORRECTION
Do not perform the bleeding procedure that was previously provided in SI B11 09 07 which has now been deleted.
According the service bulletin, the bleed procedure should have been discontinued at all bmw dealers (but it appears they are still trying to not attack the real issue and playing games.)

The bleed is a band aid temporary fix but not a solution. the Intermittent hydraulic valve adjuster and lifters are defective and can cause excessive wear and tear inside your engine if you do not have BMW replace with the improved parts. The ticking and clicking is actually metal rubbing on metal and also not lubing the top half of your engine correctly... This SHOULD be a major recall from BMW, but it appears that they dont want to be out several million dollars for their own faulty part.
Bugger! So what do we do?
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      11-09-2009, 10:18 PM   #7
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What we do is we demand accountability from BMW for our 30 - 60k extremely expensive cars, and any and all defects must be corrected at BMW's cost. Perhaps in the future they will be more careful when desigining parts.
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      11-09-2009, 10:31 PM   #8
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I had a ticking noise around a year ago now, which varied with the revs (ie faster when i reved it faster), is this similar to what others have experience. dealer told me it can happen due to lots of short trips, took it for a decent drive and i've never had it again.
anything to worry about?
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      11-11-2009, 05:58 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jksgoh View Post
I had a ticking noise around a year ago now, which varied with the revs (ie faster when i reved it faster), is this similar to what others have experience. dealer told me it can happen due to lots of short trips, took it for a decent drive and i've never had it again.
anything to worry about?
Sounds identical to the problem I experienced with 130i e 87. At first BMW said it was failed cat which was replaced.. noise persisted , after a few more months of procrastination ( head off , lifters replaced etc) and referring the tech guys to the info in these threads BMW replaced the engine. Tech guys were great but BMW Australia still havent told me what the problem was or why it occured. Dont want to know/acknowledge there is an issue.

The tech said they found metal shavings in the oil which to my non mechanical mind indicates this "ticking" problem is fairly serious. Bombs tick before they go off.....

I do a few track days and was up front with BMW about this given all the data logging these days and the tech guys said the engine still should not have failed.

New enging feels much stonger so I am keeping it for now...... but wont be buying another BMW which is a pity as I love the 130i package and would have upgraded to the 135i. Priced as a premium product but fail to deliver on quality.
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      11-11-2009, 10:06 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by tnorton776 View Post
It also appears that even vehicles with the n52 manufactured as late as june of 09 STILL have the older part and ticking/air/not getting lubed properly problem......
What is your source of this information?
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      11-12-2009, 06:22 AM   #11
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phiberglass, did you have the same above mentioned symptoms? and how did they diagnose it?
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      11-13-2009, 09:49 AM   #12
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Just called my SA and made an appt. I told them about this issue right around my first oil change and they said it was normal when the car gets close to needing an oil change.

Car goes in Tuesday .
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      11-16-2009, 03:59 AM   #13
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My car is left at the dealorship tonight, so they can cold start it tomorrow morning and check this issue out.
I left them with the information above... hopefully it will be resolved.
Thanks for the info!
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      11-16-2009, 12:57 PM   #14
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What is your source of this information?
"tnorton776 It also appears that even vehicles with the n52 manufactured as late as june of 09 STILL have the older part and ticking/air/not getting lubed properly problem."

Bump....once again, what is the source of your information?
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      11-20-2009, 11:27 AM   #15
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Well my SA has said the sound is normal. That's not flying with me so they had to order some parts for other issues and are going to look at it again when it goes back next week.

Should I call BMW NA? Take it to another dealership?
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      11-21-2009, 05:25 PM   #16
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They are going to look at it again next week when a few other parts come in. I told my SA that it wasnt going to fly and he said i understand. We will see.
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      11-30-2009, 01:38 PM   #17
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Has anyone had their lifters/rockers replaced yet due to the ticking issue? Did it fix the problem? My 2008 X3 with the N52 engine has the ticking noise which will disappear if driven at highway speeds for a while, but returns when driving a short trip.
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      12-01-2009, 09:27 PM   #18
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Also, I don't baby the car either as reported. I do drive around 80-90 freeway a few days a week, and often shift around 3k, but I open the car up at least a few times a week for a good amount of time.
Is shifting around 3k being hard on the car? I wouldn't think so...I mean its not exactly going for a Sunday drive either but I've heard of guys who keep the needle pegged at 5k+ all the time...
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      12-02-2009, 12:17 PM   #19
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Not at all, that's just my usually shift point on my daily commute and around town. I open it up at least a few times a week, and that's where your last sentence comes into play.
I'm sorry, I re-read your original post again and you were very clear the first time. My bad.

I just think its strange. My Honda Civic ticks all the time and apparantly it just needed a valve adjustment. I don't have the maintenance schedule in front of me but I heard that Honda does it as part of their scheduled maintenance. But this same ticking in the N52 is different and more serious than a simple valve adjustment?
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      12-10-2009, 06:05 AM   #20
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i have the same ticking noise coming from the engine bay ... only in the morning when first started up its fairly loud and noticeable .... its gone by the time i get to work (15 - 20 mins later) my car is 2 weeks / 1000km's old now.....

i will book it of for a oil change @ 2000 and get em to check it out then ....

anyone had it fixed PROPERLY yet??
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      12-11-2009, 01:23 PM   #21
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Well, my car is being serviced now for this. Same problem, the hydrolic lifters. I don't know why BMW is so reluctant to issue a recall for this. They really should.

If I hadn't have seen these postings on the board, I would have never thought much about the ticking noise. I thought it was just an occasional quirk.

If you hear the ticking, take your car in. Perhaps the more people that complain, the more likely they will issue a formal recall.
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      12-22-2009, 11:20 PM   #22
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I would like to know what this noise sounds like exactly?
I believe I have heard a ticking noise that is intermittent after only a few minutes after driving the car.
Its possible that this noise talked about in this thread is what im experiencing? Does anyone have a good example of what this sound is like, how often it ticks and so forth? A sound clip would be best.
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