manual vs auto - Need Advise

[Dr3K0]

First of, let me intruduce my self. My name is Andres and live Orlando FL. I have a good background on car mechanics and have being working with them since I was 10; now I have 33. I went to vocational school for electromechanics and gas engines rebuilds, then took degree on mechanical engeneer. But computers pull me out and ended being a network Admin/Engeneer.


Now to the question,

Manual vs Auto.??

Im a hard core lover of manual trannys. My previous sport cars had been manual. Im a firmer beleiver of sport cars have to be small, light , manual trannys and lots of power.

So, I was decided on a manual but went yesterday to test drive a 135i but they only had an auto. I heard good things about this tranny so i didnt hesitate to test it.

Impressions:
I fisrt floor it on regular auto and was fine, like any other auto. But then I use it on manual mode and start testing. I really got impressed. I up shift that suker flored and wast fast and not laggy, but didnt had the manual speed shift pull. Then start down shifting and I really got impressed. It went down at my will w/o hesitation. Then try up/down shift and was really more impressed. I felt like playing Grand Turismo 5 Prolog, I really see a bennefit of this tranny as a performance item on the car.


Im debating back and forth on this issue. I really miss a manual tranny but the step is realy something. I can see that tranny civilized for a normal day driving and out into manual for some action. The problem is I like action all the time. LOL!!!


I will looking to pull the trigger this comming week. All help will be appreciated.

*NOTE: I will tune the hell out of the car "within my reson". Im a sprinter type of driver with a good set of skills and concience.

I will be moding the car with pretty much what its out there. The end picture of transmission choice should be weighted thinkig on a "500whp" car with a "tuned/race" inspired attitude in a sense of the setup.




Thanks

DreX

[WhiteOne]

Drag racers seem to prefer the auto.
Road racers seem to prefer the manual.
I bought a stick shift but if they offered the 7 speed DCT I would have gotton it.
JMHO

[Saturn]

I've been driving a manual for 7 years, but this time I went with an auto. Traffic etc are a daily chore, and this is bar none the best auto I've ever driven.

I was impressed by the shift times, the smoothness etc, and I just put down a deposit for one on Friday. Go Step!

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by WhiteOne

Drag racers seem to prefer the auto.
Road racers seem to prefer the manual.
I bought a stick shift but if they offered the 7 speed DCT I would have gotton it.
JMHO

My thoughts exactly, although I would have had to test drive the DCT first to see how smooth it was around town.

A torque converter just doesn't feel right in a sporty to car IMO.

[Dr3K0]

Originally Posted by WhiteOne

Drag racers seem to prefer the auto.
Road racers seem to prefer the manual.

JMHO

I always beleive that. One of the resons for love manuals.

To share some experieces, my last sport car was a modified pontiac fiero. Was pushig arround 300hp NA. It may not seems like a lot power but the car was arround 2700 with aluminum flywheels and 17 lbs wheels. It was pretty freaking fast. Actually I was expecting my test drive be at par with the Fiero performance but the 135i fall short. Maybe due to be havyer and lot of mass in the rotating assembly. Anyway, I had a stage 4 clutchnet clutch and a 100% over stock presure plate. That thing bitted HARD! and got anoying after a while. On stop and go traffic I had sore leg some times.


My plus on a manual

Throtle response is sharp as can be
can replace the flywheel for aluminum
upgrade the clutch
tipically stronger for high HP apps
\my wife dont drive it


My plus on auto (step)
more easy going on daily driving stop and go
when desire some action it will be there with good results
it will hold all the power you can throw at it (if cand handle the internal clutches will slip) but will need a rebuild sooner that latter. Maybe expensive.


My minus on manual

on modified engines usually needs upgraded clutch and pressure plate. this leads to heavier loads on leg and tiresome on log drives.
too much pressure plate force can blow slave cylinders quite easy. "depends on the slave cylinder it self" - then needs to pulls tranny to replace.


Minus on auto

no significant mods
have to put $1600 for it :/



As time pass by, I have a different vision of car performance. Now days is about tech. A manual tranny is just same tech as always has been. Now days we have DCT to replace that and in a basic sence the feel should be close to a step. Paddle shift your way in to fun, not clutch shift clutch.



Now, the better numbers seems to favor the manual. On all reviews manual performs "better". But thats is on stock car and is not fair. In a manual you can use a ssk and do the cdv delete and will perform wonderfully; as I have read in here.


Should be good to have imput from somebody that have drive both (manual and auto) and the manual having a ssk and cdv delete. On similar power mods.



Cheers

DreX

[bimmerboy]

The auto is faster than the manual due to the fact it holds boost between shifts, as well as delivering pretty quick shifts for an auto.... Check around, and the fastest 135s are all autos. It all comes down to user preference. If you don't care for the added driving experience that the manual gives, def. get the auto. It is faster and easier to live with around town.

[JohnL135I]

Originally Posted by bimmerboy

The auto is faster than the manual due to the fact it holds boost between shifts, as well as delivering pretty quick shifts for an auto.... Check around, and the fastest 135s are all autos. It all comes down to user preference. If you don't care for the added driving experience that the manual gives, def. get the auto. It is faster and easier to live with around town.

+1

[yandy]

I test drove both, went ahead and got the 6MT and have not looked back since. I got the car because it was fast, fun and exciting to drive. I'm not looking to set any world records at the drag strip. I do go and race autox, 1/8 mile, 1/4 mile, road track but do it for fun. If you just love the experience of driving go Manual. If you want the car cause its easy to drive and are looking at setting any kind of records or are really competitive at the drag then go Auto.

The AUTO just would not give me the experience I was looking for in a fun car to drive.

My 2 cents.

[bmwzone]

Originally Posted by Saturn

I've been driving a manual for 7 years, but this time I went with an auto. Traffic etc are a daily chore, and this is bar none the best auto I've ever driven.

I was impressed by the shift times, the smoothness etc, and I just put down a deposit for one on Friday. Go Step!

LOL - this reminds me of the old Ford Fairlane comercial from 1967 - hey it's an auto but you can shift it like a manual too.

Some things never change. Benz makes a 7 speed auto in the C class and AMG's - give it a whirl.

I hear the space shuttle is auto too -

[Saturn]

Originally Posted by bmwzone

LOL - this reminds me of the old Ford Fairlane comercial from 1967 - hey it's an auto but you can shift it like a manual too.

Some things never change. Benz makes a 7 speed auto in the C class and AMG's - give it a whirl.

I hear the space shuttle is auto too -

I suggest you answer the OP's questions or keep your opinion to yourself.

Every time a 'which transmission do you prefer' post comes up you get someone who starts bashing the other tranny, came up in every MT vs MDCT thread on M3post as well. Way to bring the same crap here.
Grow up.

[scorcherjf]

Originally Posted by yandyr

The AUTO just would not give me the experience I was looking for in a fun car to drive.

+1

Doesn't matter how fast the auto shifts, it simply wouldn't be as much fun on a track and would lack the sporty "feel" on the streets.

[white911]

1st - I chose the manual even though it is my daily driver.
2nd - I chose the car as an occasional track car as back up to the 911.

If the car had a DSG or other non-torque converter gear box, the choice might have been harder. There is no escaping the additional weight associated with a torque converter.

My wife and I both prefer manuals and have driven a few of these 'paddle shifting' torque converter equipped cars on the track and still prefer the manual transmissions. That said, this car, like the Porsche Turbo, is the perfect car for this particular automatic. Massive amounts of torque and the tranny has a good brain and decent shifting maps. Left foot braking is the perfect skill to learn with this auto.

On the other hand - this car has so much torque that it is easy to drive in the worst of traffic with a manual transmission. I know Orlando traffic can be bad; but, it is certainly no worse then DC. The only issue I have with it is the CDV and the delay associated with it. I would certainly not go for a performance clutch since the one that came with the car has no problem with the torque and a heavier clutch would probably make me like the car less in traffic.

[zbladejr]

The choice is a difficult one if you are going to dwell on absolute straight line performance. However, here's my experience. Bought the 6MT. Put in JB2 and dual cone. Not the smoothest shifting car of all time (maybe need to do CDV), from first to second, otherwise pretty perfect. Drove it for 6 months or so. Friend came by with Dinan and catless dowpipes with step. That car pulled harder than mine - an insane feeling on a straight back road. But, when all said and done, I really missed shifting with the manual - the whole process.

I too think that modern sports cars should be about technology as much as speed, but after 20 years on a manual, I don't even know if the M3's DCT would make me switch.

Try to drive a manual and a step back to back - take the extra time, make sure you're 100% happy - this is the one decision you don't want to re-think as the car goes into accelarated depreciation......pun intended...lol

Good luck with the decision

[Ender_]

The 6MT sells this car...I drove the auto and wasn't "blown away" by the 135i, started looking at other cars, Audi, STi, etc... Came back to BMW just before making my dission and down payment on the Audi and they had a 6MT to drive...took it out for 15min and owned a 135i about an hour later.

I'll say it again the 6MT with the N54 is what makes this car great!

[Lester]

There is no 'wrong' choice here, only what is best for your particular lifestyle. However - you can pay for a 6MT and use the savings for some performance upgrades.

[esses]

My opinion:
If you must have your 1 now, get the 6MT.
If you can wait, wait for the dual clutch (MY2011, I think - its been discussed on these boards so you can search for it).

[singular]

I'm also a hard-core manual guy that made the switch to step with my 135, due to the occasional 2-hour traffic jam I get stuck in.

At first not having a clutch bugged me, but after about three months I don't really miss it.

As others have pointed out, the step gear changes are instantaneous and on demand. No loss in boost. The paddles are at your finger-tips, so no need to reach. So, theoretically, it's faster. But the difference might not be noticeable for 95% of drivers.

The only place where I do miss a clutch is launch. The 135 step should have a launch control the way the 2010 Z4 has. Now that would make a great mod...

[InsaneSkippy]

Absolutely love having the manual transmission. It was the toughest choice when ordering my car, but in the end I'm SO glad I chose the way I did.

EDIT: Just noticed you're from Orlando. What part of town?

[M3R1]

My commute to work is less than 10 minutes. My only car/truck that was an auto was an SRT8 Jeep. Although fast and consistant at the track there was a level of connection to the vehicle that I missed. I traded it in for a 6 speed E46 M, and now have a 6 spd 135.

If you have a long commute comprised of mostly stop and go traffic you might consider an auto. otherwise, well get the manual...

My worthless opinion...

[Dr3K0]

Originally Posted by InsaneSkippy

Absolutely love having the manual transmission. It was the toughest choice when ordering my car, but in the end I'm SO glad I chose the way I did.

EDIT: Just noticed you're from Orlando. What part of town?

Right now I live in wedgefield, but I will move to my new home located on avalon park by the end of June.

Did you test drive the step??

Thanks

DreX

[Dr3K0]

Well my commute is 30 to 45 min depending on traffic. I make my way thru traffic to make time. Sometimes there is more traffic than usual and the stop and go is somewhat anoying. I hate that kind of traffic. Is not something that will deny a manual tranny, but the step puts me on a hard spot.

I see the step as a nice piece but its hard to let go a manual. Most of my cars has been manual and the autos were just plain weak. Thinking on modifying the car and increase power a manual gets less productive. Usually 1st gear turns useless, 2nd its tricky to hookup hard. Its fun to fish tail the car but in reality control is everything.

This time im looking for a really controlable machine. My Fiero was a lot of fun but in a race it was really touchy not to spin the tires, basically i lunched @ 2k and use 3/4 throttle at most. More than that it just burned the rubber. Its fun but not so efficient. But when lunched properly it was a rocket. LOL

I love all the dynamics of manual transmission. Makes a car alive. But the step on manual mode its just amaizing. Its like a video game, easy to drive. LOL. I beleive used properly will be killer on a road track. But having a torqe converter is what is taking me away from the step.

I debate back and forth between both.

Decisions. :/



DreX

[Haywood]

It is a tough decision. I drove both; the manual first and then the step. The step is the best I've ever driven. If you are going to track your car, I would definitely go for the manual. I chose the auto because I have a bad back and the clutch would kill me. I live in the DC area and do alot of stop and go driving. That being said, I do miss the feel of a manual in a sports car like this. I don't think you can go wrong. I know that there are hardcore manual fans out there, but what BMW and Porsche have being doing with DCT, there may not be a reason to chose a manual in the future.