Meth not fully flowing?

[jbarzelatto]

Hello!

I have a bmw 135i n55 e82 6 speed manual FBO+meth with a turbo upgrade. Im having a couple of issues I would like some help with.

First has to do with the METH FLOW. In my logs, meth does not go all the way 100% when I WOT. I have never seen my meth numbers on 100, and I rode in my friends car and his does hit 100.

I originally got the BMS kit but I have changed parts over time thiking it would solve it, but no. I also tried turning the screw on the top of the pump to increase the flow, but this didnt work either. Below are a couple of my latest logs showing wot but not the meth flowing 100%.










Terry said that any value over 30 is OK and is full meth flow, but I am not sure about this. I have seen videos online and all ofthem reach 100%.

Please help. Any advice is very welcome.

[bmw0bsession]

What kind of tank do you have? Also, is your nozzle flush with the inside of the CP? I had this issue because there was air in the line. I have a 2.25 gallon tank and had the sump facing the front of the car. I turned it around so that the sump was facing the rear and during acceleration it would always have meth over the fluid line. when it was facing the front and the liquid would slush around it would catch air. Turn your tank around, I am sure it is this simple as I had the same issue.

[bmw0bsession]

Also, purge your line for about 2-3 minutes. It takes a while to get the air out and never let your tank get so low that air can get in when the fluids slush around. If you do you will have to purge each time you fill up

[TUN3D]

jbarzelatto > Single or dual nozzle?

[PeterPure]

Originally Posted by TUN3D

jbarzelatto > Single or dual nozzle?

Why does this matter?

[PeterPure]

Originally Posted by bmw0bsession

What kind of tank do you have? Also, is your nozzle flush with the inside of the CP? I had this issue because there was air in the line. I have a 2.25 gallon tank and had the sump facing the front of the car. I turned it around so that the sump was facing the rear and during acceleration it would always have meth over the fluid line. when it was facing the front and the liquid would slush around it would catch air. Turn your tank around, I am sure it is this simple as I had the same issue.

I did not have many issues with meth flow over the last 10 months. However once i ran the tank nearly empty it took me a while to figure out that priming the system takes more than 10 seconds.

My pump also faces the front of the car. However i do keep the tank topped up as good as i can. But its a good tip.

[TUN3D]

Darkhold > It matters, as well as the size of the nozzles. I've been using Meth, specifically the BMS kit, for the past 3-4 years. Not only have I run it on my car, but I've also done a couple installs. Initially, and the best results I've seen, have been with the trunk mount and single nozzle CM7-CM10. The system is pretty much designed for that setup...in terms of giving you a 100% reading.

That said, flow is not as accurate and clean-cut as you might think. Take the windshield setup for instance. I ran this for a few months just to test it out. It would always put out 50% flow -- no matter what. I contacted Terry. He indicated that on the WW kit...50% translates into 100% flow.

When I went dual nozzles (CM10 + CM7), my flow never went above 75-90% reading. So, I contacted Terry again. He told me anything above the 60% value was full flow. I adjusted my pump as well...still had the same reading.

The point is, that for whatever reason(s), flow can vary -- it doesn't mean your not spraying properly.

Check out some of my early logs and see what Russell said in reference to the flow:
http://www.n54tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22094

[TUN3D]

jbarzelatto > What I would do, is connect a 3' test line from the "output" part of the solenoid.....into a bucket (outside of the car). Then purge it, and see what the flow is like. It should be strong as hell and steady. If it is, then you're alright.

I've had this problem sporadically. If Terry told you you're good...then trust my friend.

What's your avg_ign looking like? Didn't see it on the logs.

[PeterPure]

Originally Posted by TUN3D

Darkhold > It matters, as well as the size of the nozzles. I've been using Meth, specifically the BMS kit, for the past 3-4 years. Not only have I run it on my car, but I've also done a couple installs. Initially, and the best results I've seen, have been with the trunk mount and single nozzle CM7-CM10. The system is pretty much designed for that setup...in terms of giving you a 100% reading.

That said, flow is not as accurate and clean-cut as you might think. Take the windshield setup for instance. I ran this for a few months just to test it out. It would always put out 50% flow -- no matter what. I contacted Terry. He indicated that on the WW kit...50% translates into 100% flow.

When I went dual nozzles (CM10 + CM7), my flow never went above 75-90% reading. So, I contacted Terry again. He told me anything above the 60% value was full flow. I adjusted my pump as well...still had the same reading.

The point is, that for whatever reason(s), flow can vary -- it doesn't mean your not spraying properly.

Check out some of my early logs and see what Russell said in reference to the flow:
http://www.n54tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22094" rel="ugc" target="_blank">http://<a href="http://www.n54tech.c...hp?t=22094</a>

Tnx for the info. I am running cm7/cm5 dual nozzle. These still show 100% flow always. I have been seeing 75-90% flow previously after i ran the tank empty and didnt prime enough. Once i primed long enough it went back to 100. Did not know the flow reading came from the pump current draw.

Well if you put the nozzles in a transparent bottle you can visually confirm they flow good when primimg. That should be enough.

[jbarzelatto]

Originally Posted by bmw0bsession

What kind of tank do you have? Also, is your nozzle flush with the inside of the CP? I had this issue because there was air in the line. I have a 2.25 gallon tank and had the sump facing the front of the car. I turned it around so that the sump was facing the rear and during acceleration it would always have meth over the fluid line. when it was facing the front and the liquid would slush around it would catch air. Turn your tank around, I am sure it is this simple as I had the same issue.

I have the largest tank that Devilsown has, its a big square box, which I want to change because its just too big, its the 6 gallon tank. Then as far as the nozzle, I drilled the hole myself, so its not 100% flush. I am thinking about getting a chargpipe with the meth bungs. but I do know that it is well primed. What i notice differently comparing to my friend, is that when he primes, the meth comes out really hard from the hose. the hose even shakes. I dont have this same power output, and I dont know why.

[jbarzelatto]

Originally Posted by TUN3D

jbarzelatto > What I would do, is connect a 3' test line from the "output" part of the solenoid.....into a bucket (outside of the car). Then purge it, and see what the flow is like. It should be strong as hell and steady. If it is, then you're alright.

I've had this problem sporadically. If Terry told you you're good...then trust my friend.

What's your avg_ign looking like? Didn't see it on the logs.

my avg ign is ok, but not he best. i think you can see it now on the datazip file.
http://datazap.me/u/jbarzelatto/vtt-map-6-back-end-meth

Terry did tell me the same thing that it is full flow, and i believe him hes the expert ofcorse, but why do the rest read 100%?

Its really weird.

[TUN3D]

jbarzelatto > It is weird bro. I can't really tell you what the answer is. In running Meth for several years, I would have 1-2 month periods that it would be at %90 percent or below. Then out of no where, it would go back to 100% on its own -- no rhyme or reason. I learned to deal with it over time. I'm freakin' OCD man, when I tell you that I tried EVERYTHING -- believe me.

One thing I would recommend, if it really bothers you, is to clean out the system well and reinstall the line. One thing I found, is that the BMS tank (or any tank) needs to be cleaned thoroughly before install. It sometimes has plastic shavings inside that can clog the line/system. Another thing I did, was install filters coming out of the tank (before the main-line) and before the solenoid. I also replaced the line. I bought "Devil's Own" tubing which is very good and kink-free. Make sure your tubing is very secure and strapped down properly (free-slowing and little to no right angles). I used a shit-ton of tie wraps. Don't over tighten to the point that it constricts the line...but definitely make sure it has NO movement whatsoever -- it helps to prevent air bubbles from forming.

Post some pics of the install, pump location, tank, line...whatever you have so I can take a look. Here's an example of how I had my setup...



How did you run your line? Underneath the car or inside the cabin? Have you tested the current on the pump?

[TUN3D]

jbarzelatto > That pic was of my Aquamist install, but it's exactly how I had the BMS. The pump would be inside the battery tray and tank would be directly above it.

[TUN3D]

jbarzelatto > Also, not sure that you're logging correctly. Took a look at the datazap graph, the entire time...it looks like your in 4-6 gear. Also, you're letting off prematurely.

To log properly, you need to be in 3rd gear at about 2500 RPM, then go WOT. Take it to about 6500 RPM (don't hit the kick-down switch), and shift into 4th gear (WOT) for about 2 seconds.

The way you're logging is not conducive to good stats/numbers for tuning.

[jbarzelatto]

Hello. Here are some more logs with that instruction. Tony told me the same thing, i didnt know this was the way to log for a manual car (3rd gear around 1800 rmp, all the way to red line) he didnt mention to continue on 4th gear for a second, but there is one of the logs i do this.

http://datazap.me/u/jbarzelatto/3rd-...d-vargas-turbo


as far as the meth instalation, i have mine installed exactly like your, the pump in the same position too. For the lines, I actually bought devils own stainless steel line kit so I am waiting for that to arrive to install it. The only thing that I have not tested and i did buy used, was the pump. But how exactly can i test if the pump is working the way it should be? i ran my lines inside the car but when i get the stainless i might run it under the car. so how can i test the pump exactly? any way to measure the strength of the squirt? if you see my logs, meth is kinda slow in my opinion. i press the gas WOT and it takes a while for meth to start flowing, but i might be wrong.

thanks and best regards!

[jbarzelatto]

in my datazip, please make sure you see all the logs as i usually attach 3 of them.

[TUN3D]

jbarzelatto > The log looks way better. From now on, always do it that way. It's actually the best way to log all our cars (AT & MT). The reason why you want to shift into another gear (4th in this instance), is so that you can see "post-shift timing drops". Some cars/tunes do it...others do not (It's pretty common though). Good to always log it.

As an example, while 3rd gear might be strong...when you shift...the car goes to shit and runs terrible. Ideally, it should pull strong even after the shift. In the real world, when racing -- you WILL shift. Anyways, just keep an eye on that.

Running the line inside the car is probably what's causing your issue. Most likely, it' being crushed at some point, thus the low flow. Also, there might be a leak. I recommend you remove it immediately and stop spraying. Under the car is the best way of doing it.

[TUN3D]

jbarzelatto > Also, as a rule-of-thumb, If I see flow issues after an install, I flush the system and use rubbing alcohol for a few days. You can't smell meth if there's a leak, however, you can detect that somethings wrong very easily with alcohol. The smell will tell you.

[jbarzelatto]

Whats up! Thanks for the tips. I run 50/50 meth and water and I can definitly smell when it has leaked. I know I dont have a leak though inside, but you might be right about the route of the hose might have some pressure. this is why i am upgrading to the stainless steel lines and runing them under the car, just waiting on one part to arrive.

also, the hose that I used I bought at a local Lowes, so the diameter INSIDE might be different. Outside is perfect because it fits perfect in all the fittings.

I will post logs as soon as i get those installed. i also thought maybe it was the pressure on the pump. I had never regulated that top screw it has on the top. but part of the stainless steel kit is changin the pump head, which has this screw. i wonder if the pressure comes adjusted from the top part they sent.

[jbarzelatto]

well, i finally finished installing everything. I even got a new CHARGEPIPE with the proper meth bungs, since last CP I drilled the holes myself and the nozzle was not flush with the CP. Now it is, and now I also have the stainless steel, etc... But my IAT keeps rising! I also have a FMIC installed obviously. Please help me determine why the heck the temp rises so much!



Below is a datazap with some logs

http://datazap.me/u/jbarzelatto/fmic...ata=1-4-5-6-16