[THE JEDI]

Got a few words for ya extended maintenance plan 6 yrs 100,000. ..simple fix...okay buh bye my work here is done...back to Mt Olympus in my BMW chariot of course

[climkt]

i have driven both cars in singapore- is250 auto and e20i manual and auto.
The running cost for lexus may be comparable to bmw but i think the jap car will be more reliable in the long term. definitely is250 looks better in the flesh when you compare it to stock e90. the the lexus interior material quality is as good or not better than bmw. the is250 rear is really claustrophobic with the rear sloping roof line- it is a 5 seater but can only seat 4 adults. the centre reat seat sits on top of a transmission tunnel and is really hard and high. i doubt most people can sit on this hard area of the rear seat for more than 30 min. my head was literally touching the roof- i am 1.85m tall! the singapore version has a foot operated parking brake whilst the UK and Australia versions have a conventional handbrake. paddle shift in the lexus did not feel as sporty as a manual car but car was remarkably refined and quiet.
i would love the manual version of the lexus (not available in singapore) but the lack of a 5 seater capacity is a turn off for me as a family guy.

[akhbhaat]

Originally Posted by lux.sh

lol. true that. Who dumps in a 300hp motor to a car and mate it to an autotragic only?
Rumor is that 6spd will be available in 2nd or 3rd year production IS though. like the previous generation trend.

Except nobody will buy the 6 speed, which is probably why Lexus didn't include one in the first place. They know their product better than anyone else - and they definitely know that their car does not drive like a legitimate sport sedan, even if they don't come out and say it.

[e46e90]

I loved my 2000 E46 and put 98,000 miles on it, and then gave it to my mom to get the E90 xi, which I needed for snow. I've been incredibly impressed with the E46 reliability and the repair expenses did NOT exceed my prior expenses for the Acura or Hondas. I also drove the Lexus but I just couldn't do it after driving the BMW for 6 years...the BMW is the state of the art driving experience. It's too good!

[lux.sh]

Originally Posted by akhbhaat

they definitely know that their car does not drive like a legitimate sport sedan, even if they don't come out and say it.

It does drive like a legitimate sport sedan in my opinion.
Despite the fact that real-life "feel" of the car might seem terrible to us, road test data created by professionals say IS350 is a performer.. not so far behind E90.

[akhbhaat]

Originally Posted by lux.sh

It does drive like a legitimate sport sedan in my opinion.
Despite the fact that real-life "feel" of the car might seem terrible to us, road test data created by professionals say IS350 is a performer.. not so far behind E90.

"Perform" and "drive" are two different things.

The IS350 is a good performer. I'd go so far as to say that the power it has over the 330i give it the edge at the track, even though it's probably a bit slower through the corners. Remember, it takes a skilled driver to effectively utilize corners - but anybody can mash the throttle.

This doesn't change the fact that the steering is completely lifeless and badly overboosted.

Just as an aside: the manual trans sold very poorly on the IS300 (which, unlike the IS350, actually was a fairly sporty drive). I see no reason why the same wouldn't happen with the updated version. People simply don't walk into a Lexus showroom looking for a sports car (or a sedan masquerading as a sports car)...Lexus has realized this and has adapted the second generation IS to suit. It's obviously working; look at how many they've sold already, especially when compared to the first car.

[foofighter]

they gone so far as to campaign their IS in the ALMS GT class running an automatic tranny similar to the one that's equipped on the road car.

I was this close "||" to buying an IS350...but having already owned an 06 GS300 my wife encouraged me to look at the 330 and consider it. Here I am waiting for its arrival.

[Aija]

Originally Posted by lux.sh

lol, it was kind of funny how you said "they are much better than my current car". Something about it sounded really funny. I mean IS250/325i better feel much more "car" than the mitsu eclipse. Eclipse = crap. (I made a mistake buying one myself 4 years ago. Sold it in 4 months). DSMs can be made to go really fast for just few $$ though.

Back on topic, you need reliability. Lexus stands for reliability. forget what all the people in this thread claiming "100k and still reliable bmw machine". National statistics proved that BMWs aren't the most reliable machines in this world. Don't fall into some stories told by people online. You'll hear that kind of crap everywhere on the web. I heard all about them stories, bought my BMW and guess what, reliability my ass. Do a search and see countless people with E90s having reliability problems in this forum alone. Reliability reports show bmw reliability improved but still far behind lexus. I personally only owned japanese vehicles before this BMW(first one). Yes, this one is not reliable. It already made several trips to the dealership. All electrical. LAME. Some can be stupid as fancy-non-functional cup holder not working. You hear BMW owners being so proud of hitting 100k, they better realize there are MANY MANY MANY more japanese car owners hitting 100k like its nothing, and hitting 200/300k and still running strong, just lower compression readings, thats all.


You don't buy BMW thinking about reliability. You buy BMW for performance and pure driving pleasure.

I strongly agree. Our family buys BMW/Lexus and i can assure you lexus (even honda/acura in this case) have far better reliabilities then the BMW. Our commuter car, 2000 Lexus ES broke 160k miles with only one minor problem (taillight) which is now replaced with the 2005 Lexus ES which currently has 34,000 miles. Now, our 1999 BMW 740il is anything but reliable and the 2004 E46 330 i consider "average" at best for reliability (we have had some problems with it). DOnt even get me started with the 2003 Mercedez E-class (second week of ownership and it wont start up....wtf?)

You buy a BMW for fun pleasures and you buy lexus for a bland dependable luxurious comfortable car

[voltron1011]

Here's a good example of Toyota's quality over the last few years:

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll...605310340/1148

Also, don't forget about the transmission failures on the Avalon. The oil sludging problems in the Camry, RAV4, and Sienna. In fact, a lot of Toyota motors have oil problems that cause the motors to seize up.
One of my coworkers had his RAV4 motor seize up and throw a rod due to sludge and low oil pressure. Toyota refused to pay for a new motor because they didn't honor FRAM oil filters as legitimate filter for their motors. Long story short: FRAMs attorney's went after Toyota and got them to replace the motor.

My point here is that no company is immune to problems.
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/autom...ta_engine.html

[lux.sh]

Originally Posted by voltron1011

Here's a good example of Toyota's quality over the last few years:

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll...605310340/1148

Also, don't forget about the transmission failures on the Avalon. The oil sludging problems in the Camry, RAV4, and Sienna. In fact, a lot of Toyota motors have oil problems that cause the motors to seize up.
One of my coworkers had his RAV4 motor seize up and throw a rod due to sludge and low oil pressure. Toyota refused to pay for a new motor because they didn't honor FRAM oil filters as legitimate filter for their motors. Long story short: FRAMs attorney's went after Toyota and got them to replace the motor.

My point here is that no company is immune to problems.
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/autom...ta_engine.html

Who doesn't know that nothing is perfect in this world?
We are talking about general statistics and common reliability issue as in general here.
No one ever claimed japanese vehicles = no problems.

Lexus reliability > BMW reliability. Period. I don't understand why people are arguing this point.

[zamboni]

It sounds funny but all cars mfg is using the 3 series as benchmark, why don't they come up with their own design instead of copying BMW ?

[rishid]

Thanks for the responses.. just making my decision harder
but more informed

One question, I might end up buying a car early next year. So say I get a used 2006 E90, can I buy an extended warranty? and if so how long do I have?

Thanks

[F32Fleet]

Originally Posted by rishid

Thanks for the responses.. just making my decision harder
but more informed

One question, I might end up buying a car early next year. So say I get a used 2006 E90, can I buy an extended warranty? and if so how long do I have?

Thanks

Extended warranty can be purchased at any time prior to the expiration of the current warranty.

[F32Fleet]

Originally Posted by zamboni

It sounds funny but all cars mfg is using the 3 series as benchmark, why don't they come up with their own design instead of copying BMW ?

Competitors don't try to copy BMW, they try to incorporate some of the attributes of a BMW into their own brand/product niche.

[gos]

Originally Posted by climkt

the lack of a 5 seater capacity is a turn off for me as a family guy.

Us Americans are too large to fit in the back of that car at all. My calves won't squeeze between the back of the driver's seat, and the front of the rear seats.

The "first" lexus I would consider would be the GS sedan, and those start significantly more expensive than the 3-series BMW.

--gos

[foofighter]

Originally Posted by gos

Us Americans are too large to fit in the back of that car at all. My calves won't squeeze between the back of the driver's seat, and the front of the rear seats.

The "first" lexus I would consider would be the GS sedan, and those start significantly more expensive than the 3-series BMW.

--gos

i got mine 6 months after the release and it was still in "demand" and got it for 45k (fully loaded) not that much more than a fully loaded 330

[HiKai335i]

I sympathize with your situation. I drove the IS350/250, 325i/330i, and G35and liked them all. I just liked the combination of power and driving experience of the 330i. But they were very close. It's a shame that BMW lacks the reliability of the Japanese car makers.

[TH_e90]

If you just keep the car for 4-5 years, there is no doubt that the e90 will be cheaper to own. The driving pleasure and enjoyment that this car will provide to you during those years is also priceless. Go for the bimmer!

[needashower]

If reliability is your primary concern, make no mistake, the Lexus will be more reliable. History has proven this.

Most people on this board are willing to give a little in reliablity to obtain a car with more spirit. Are you one of them?

[Asiann]

Originally Posted by needashower

If reliability is your primary concern, make no mistake, the Lexus will be more reliable. History has proven this.

Most people on this board are willing to give a little in reliablity to obtain a car with more spirit. Are you one of them?

I converted from a Japanese auto to the German for reliability and the spirit. The 3 series is legendary and that is not without saying hard to come by these days. I still have my Maxima which is still going after 9 years and 120,00 across the US and the Army. I only had to replace the right front axel when it went bad and I had extended warranty which covered what I paid for in the beginning.

[lux.sh]

Originally Posted by Socom

Competitors don't try to copy BMW, they try to incorporate some of the attributes of a BMW into their own brand/product niche.

very well said. very very very well said.

Copying is stupid.
Getting ideas from others and making it even better is smart.

[tctic]

Reliability stats mainly comes from the consumers. It is very probable that BMW owners expect much more from their cars than say a Japanese car owner on average. If BMW owers have a higher expectation of their cars, the reliability stats will go down. Second point is BMW owners probably puts more stress on the car than an average Japanese car. So even if the average reliability of a BMW is lower than a Japanese car, it is very understandable. Lastly, stats are stats, they have their limitations and biases most of the time. You can't just argue purely based on numbers and isolated cases.