Track guys: square vs. staggered?

[Jcp135]

anyone with 285/30/18 all around with 18*10 et 25 on stock suspension???

[robertm]

Originally Posted by Jcp135

anyone with 285/30/18 all around with 18*10 et 25 on stock suspension???

With camber plates up frt there's a pretty good chance they will!

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by Jcp135

anyone with 285/30/18 all around with 18*10 et 25 on stock suspension???

Yes. BF Goodrich R1

[fastauto]

I run the ec-7. The setup I have is a 9.5 and 10.5 with a 265f and 285r. On track they have been great. That being said when the tires go I am getting arc-8's in a square 10 wide setup. I will aim to run 275's all around. The square feels very neutral and I can rotate tires. I do not think giving up a tiny rear grip to gain the pros of tire rotation will make a difference. FYI i am on coils and run -3 camber in the front.

[Splinterz88]

I have run both square and staggered on stock suspension. EC-7 9.5 with 265/35/18 PSS and then sometimes EC7 10.5 285/35/18 in the rears. I have found with the square setup the car is more neutral and understeer is less noticeable. Towards the end of last track season I tried the staggered setup on same track 2 different weekends. The car is easier to rotate with the square setup, but I felt I needed more traction coming out of the turns. With the staggered I did not feel the need for more traction and my data show faster corner exit speeds.

Granted this season I will be installing camber plates and will test this out.

[fastauto]

Originally Posted by Splinterz88

I have run both square and staggered on stock suspension. EC-7 9.5 with 265/35/18 PSS and then sometimes EC7 10.5 285/35/18 in the rears. I have found with the square setup the car is more neutral and understeer is less noticeable. Towards the end of last track season I tried the staggered setup on same track 2 different weekends. The car is easier to rotate with the square setup, but I felt I needed more traction coming out of the turns. With the staggered I did not feel the need for more traction and my data show faster corner exit speeds.

Granted this season I will be installing camber plates and will test this out.

do you have data that compares the lap times in total of running square vs. staggered? what does the difference look like?

[Splinterz88]

Originally Posted by fastauto

do you have data that compares the lap times in total of running square vs. staggered? what does the difference look like?

Granted I am not a pro driver and these were taken at a DE so I am dealing with traffic.

NJMP Thunderbolt 0.42-0.63 seconds faster on staggered
Summit Point Main .61-.89 seconds faster on staggered

[fastauto]

Originally Posted by Splinterz88

Granted I am not a pro driver and these were taken at a DE so I am dealing with traffic.

NJMP Thunderbolt 0.42-0.63 seconds faster on staggered
Summit Point Main .61-.89 seconds faster on staggered

Who do you run with? I run with nasa and find myself at NJMP often (or as often as I can). Would love to see a black 1m in person and run with one.

[Splinterz88]

I run primarily with PCA RTR, Del Val BMWCCA, PCA Schattenbaum. This coming season will probably run with PCA RTR and PCA NNJR though.

[MDORPHN]

Originally Posted by fastauto

Who do you run with? I run with nasa and find myself at NJMP often (or as often as I can). Would love to see a black 1m in person and run with one.

I'm planning to get up to NJMP early in the Spring as Thunderbolt is on the schedule for this year's One Lap of America and I haven't run it in a couple of years.

Haven't yet looked at the schedule, but I'll probably do a NASA, DelVal or NJ Chapter HPDE as I've instructed with them in the past.

Neil

[fastauto]

Originally Posted by MDORPHN

I'm planning to get up to NJMP early in the Spring as Thunderbolt is on the schedule for this year's One Lap of America and I haven't run it in a couple of years.

Haven't yet looked at the schedule, but I'll probably do a NASA, DelVal or NJ Chapter HPDE as I've instructed with them in the past.

Neil

Awesome. Please keep me posted when you do this. I will 100% make it a point to attend that event.

[fastauto]

Originally Posted by Splinterz88

I run primarily with PCA RTR, Del Val BMWCCA, PCA Schattenbaum. This coming season will probably run with PCA RTR and PCA NNJR though.

A friend of mine runs with PCA Schattenbaum from time to time. From what I told the events they hold are great and they are a fraction of the cost of some of the NASA events. I really need to start running with BMW clubs as I always end up with a NASA or an SCDA.

[1swift1]

Hey guys,
So, I went with a square setup: 275/35/18 RE-11s on the ARC-8 18x9.5et22.

I also used Vorshlag camber plates with a moderately aggressive setup (initial Camber L/R -0.97/-0.88 and went to -1.82/-1.83).

I waited forever to buy the camber plates, because I thought it would help avoid rubbing. Well, I rub on the fender liners when my wheels are about 70% from full lock. It's really annoying, but I do like the increased responsiveness at turn in. I haven't tracked yet. I like the grip, but again, haven't really pushed them that hard yet.

I wonder if trying 275/30/18 next time would avoid rubbing?

[TXmtrhed]

After running a square setup for a year I went to a staggered setup (265-285/35/18 RS3) to gain more traction on exit. Very happy with the results, car seems more balanced, had no problem rotating the car with a throttle lift and in addition to being able to apply power sooner the rear was easier to catch on oversteer.

The rears always wore faster than the fronts so I don't think I'm giving up much in the ability to rotate my tires. Besides the RS3's wear like iron and will heat-cycle out long before wearing out.

[fastauto]

Originally Posted by TXmtrhed

After running a square setup for a year I went to a staggered setup (265-285/35/18 RS3) to gain more traction on exit. Very happy with the results, car seems more balanced, had no problem rotating the car with a throttle lift and in addition to being able to apply power sooner the rear was easier to catch on oversteer.

The rears always wore faster than the fronts so I don't think I'm giving up much in the ability to rotate my tires. Besides the RS3's wear like iron and will heat-cycle out long before wearing out.

You like the RS-3's?

[TXmtrhed]

Originally Posted by fastauto

You like the RS-3's?

Yes, they are clearly slower than the NT-01's most of my e46 track buddies run but the NT-01's are corded after 3-4 weekends while the RS-3's last at least 3X as long (but heat cycled out). I'm cheap and I'm trying to really take the RS-3's to my best times possible before going to more expensive treads. So until I stop improving I'll stay with them.

Tires work well in hot ambient temps, survive 25 min sessions if the pressures are set correctly and have predictable breakaway. But watch out in cold ambient temps, until the tires warm up they are very slippy. I did a no throttle spin on a parade lap at 30 mph on cold tires.