COBB N55 Stage 1+ FMIC or Stage 2 DP Comparison?

bmw0bsession · 04-21-2013, 09:04 PM

I was doing some research and I have not found any real comparison to the Cobb stage 1+ FMIC Sport or the Stage 2 Sport with DP. I found the PDF below that breaks down the gains on both OTS Maps but I see a better percentage gain from the Stage 1+ FMIC. Anyone out there have any experience with these maps and can really share some information in regards to which map gave you the best gains and performance? For the record I live in L.A and we only have 91 Octane.

Here is the PDF
https://static.cobbtuning.com/cobbtu...AccessPORT.pdf

TheRuss · 04-22-2013, 07:18 AM

Hmm, I'd be interested in this also. I'd always thought DPs would offer the biggest gain of the two, but saw a post stating the opposite recently.

alexmtl_135i · 04-22-2013, 10:18 AM

Same here.

Mikey135 · 04-22-2013, 11:42 AM

I cant compare them both on my car but between myself and a friend. I started with the stage 2 and he started with stage 1+ and we did a lot of pulls against eachother and it was almost no difference at all. It came down to shifting or who gunned it first. However that was in Feb where it was nice and cool. Once it starts heating up you will see the stage 2 slow down more compared to the stage 1+ after repeated pulls. Since it is starting to warm up I would go with the stage 1+ over the stage 2.

Freon · 04-22-2013, 12:01 PM

I'd trust what Cobb is showing as gains. They know what they're doing.

It does seem counter intuitive compared to gains on other turbo cars, but some other turbo cars run a lot more boost from the factory. A tuned N54 goes from about 8psi on the factory tune to 12-16psi peak depending on how aggressive it is. A tuned STI or EVO might go from 14psi to 18-21psi peak. That's a lot more load on the intercooler to nearly double factory boost levels, so it does make some sense.

Also, the BMW intercooler doesn't have a very good cross section for flow. Charge air flows into the narrow end. Other designs have the charge air flow into the long side (like a Subaru design) or have a large side (Mitsu). That combined with the tube and fin design means a lot of pressure drop and restriction.

Keep in mind the turbo means your exhaust and intake systems are effectively coupled together. Reducing restriction on either side is good. Reducing intake system restriction will reduce the backpressure on the exhaust to reach the same boost.

GeeRam · 04-22-2013, 12:17 PM

Isn't it also because for the N55 and the issues with CEL on cat-less DP, Cobb's DP for which they have designed the Stage 2 for is a catted version, so gains over a cat-less DP on N54's etc., won't be anything like the same.

Stan.mac · 04-22-2013, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikey135

I cant compare them both on my car but between myself and a friend. I started with the stage 2 and he started with stage 1+ and we did a lot of pulls against eachother and it was almost no difference at all. It came down to shifting or who gunned it first. However that was in Feb where it was nice and cool. Once it starts heating up you will see the stage 2 slow down more compared to the stage 1+ after repeated pulls. Since it is starting to warm up I would go with the stage 1+ over the stage 2.

You make a really good point. I recently upgraded to the Cobb Stage 2 and love it; but my next mod will be a FMIC.

bmw0bsession · 04-22-2013, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikey135

I cant compare them both on my car but between myself and a friend. I started with the stage 2 and he started with stage 1+ and we did a lot of pulls against eachother and it was almost no difference at all. It came down to shifting or who gunned it first. However that was in Feb where it was nice and cool. Once it starts heating up you will see the stage 2 slow down more compared to the stage 1+ after repeated pulls. Since it is starting to warm up I would go with the stage 1+ over the stage 2.

That is interesting and I did not take into consideration the Temperature. My FMIC arrives soon so I guess I will try that out when it does. I just wonder if I will be able to clear the CEL in Stage 1+ with the Cobb AP. I believe the Stage 2 clears the CEL Right?

Mikey135 · 04-22-2013, 01:37 PM

When my friend had just his stage 1+ he never had any issues the the CEL. I am no expert on the matter for sure but I have never really heard of people with problems with the CEL in stage 1+ at all. Stage 2/2+ you are more likely to run into problems, yet unlikely. I never had any but once my friend went 2+ the CEL would come on once in a while. Reflashing the tune would solve his problem though.

foghat · 04-22-2013, 01:54 PM

If you use the cobb maps built for dp's you should not get any cels (due to dp).

04-21-2013, 09:04 PM	#1
bmw0bsession Captain 82 Rep 847 Posts Drives: 2011 135i M Sport Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Burbank, CA iTrader: (3) Garage List 2011 BMW 135i [0.00]	COBB N55 Stage 1+ FMIC or Stage 2 DP Comparison? I was doing some research and I have not found any real comparison to the Cobb stage 1+ FMIC Sport or the Stage 2 Sport with DP. I found the PDF below that breaks down the gains on both OTS Maps but I see a better percentage gain from the Stage 1+ FMIC. Anyone out there have any experience with these maps and can really share some information in regards to which map gave you the best gains and performance? For the record I live in L.A and we only have 91 Octane. Here is the PDF https://static.cobbtuning.com/cobbtu...AccessPORT.pdf __________________ BMW Performance Kidney Grille, CF Lip Spoiler, CF Diffusser, Blackline LCI Tailights, Magnaflow Full Exhaust, BMS Intake, Jb4 w/ E85, Meth Injection, BMS DP, VRSF 5" Intercooler, CP-E Charge Pipe, KW CS Coilover, M3 Subframe Bushings, VMR VB3 Wheels, Stage 2 Fuel Pump, M3 Control Arms, Dinan Camber Plates, Pure Stage 2.
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04-22-2013, 07:18 AM	#2
TheRuss Lieutenant 28 Rep 408 Posts Drives: BMW 135i Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: South West, UK iTrader: (0)	Hmm, I'd be interested in this also. I'd always thought DPs would offer the biggest gain of the two, but saw a post stating the opposite recently.
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04-22-2013, 10:18 AM	#3
alexmtl_135i First Lieutenant 31 Rep 371 Posts Drives: 2013 C63 Coupe P31 Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Montreal, Canada iTrader: (0)	Same here.
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04-22-2013, 11:42 AM	#4
Mikey135 Enlisted Member 2 Rep 42 Posts Drives: 135i Cobb stage 1 Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: OKC iTrader: (0)	I cant compare them both on my car but between myself and a friend. I started with the stage 2 and he started with stage 1+ and we did a lot of pulls against eachother and it was almost no difference at all. It came down to shifting or who gunned it first. However that was in Feb where it was nice and cool. Once it starts heating up you will see the stage 2 slow down more compared to the stage 1+ after repeated pulls. Since it is starting to warm up I would go with the stage 1+ over the stage 2.
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04-22-2013, 12:01 PM	#5
Freon Major 81 Rep 1,051 Posts Drives: 2009 135i Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Indianapolis iTrader: (3)	I'd trust what Cobb is showing as gains. They know what they're doing. It does seem counter intuitive compared to gains on other turbo cars, but some other turbo cars run a lot more boost from the factory. A tuned N54 goes from about 8psi on the factory tune to 12-16psi peak depending on how aggressive it is. A tuned STI or EVO might go from 14psi to 18-21psi peak. That's a lot more load on the intercooler to nearly double factory boost levels, so it does make some sense. Also, the BMW intercooler doesn't have a very good cross section for flow. Charge air flows into the narrow end. Other designs have the charge air flow into the long side (like a Subaru design) or have a large side (Mitsu). That combined with the tube and fin design means a lot of pressure drop and restriction. Keep in mind the turbo means your exhaust and intake systems are effectively coupled together. Reducing restriction on either side is good. Reducing intake system restriction will reduce the backpressure on the exhaust to reach the same boost. __________________ 2009 BMW 135i 6MT Sport, AFE intake, Cobb AP, Apex 18x8.5+9.5, 255/275 PSS
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04-22-2013, 12:17 PM	#6
GeeRam Major 195 Rep 1,317 Posts Drives: X5 40d SE Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Berkshire,UK iTrader: (0)	Isn't it also because for the N55 and the issues with CEL on cat-less DP, Cobb's DP for which they have designed the Stage 2 for is a catted version, so gains over a cat-less DP on N54's etc., won't be anything like the same. __________________ 2017 X5 4.0dSE ~ Atlas Cedar:Ind.Amaro Brown Merino&Piano Blk, Sport Auto, DHP, Comfort seats, Cold weather pack, HK audio, Electric towbar, Sun protection glass.
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04-22-2013, 01:37 PM	#9
Mikey135 Enlisted Member 2 Rep 42 Posts Drives: 135i Cobb stage 1 Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: OKC iTrader: (0)	When my friend had just his stage 1+ he never had any issues the the CEL. I am no expert on the matter for sure but I have never really heard of people with problems with the CEL in stage 1+ at all. Stage 2/2+ you are more likely to run into problems, yet unlikely. I never had any but once my friend went 2+ the CEL would come on once in a while. Reflashing the tune would solve his problem though.
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04-22-2013, 01:54 PM	#10
foghat Captain 59 Rep 913 Posts Drives: 2008 135i Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Great White North iTrader: (1)	If you use the cobb maps built for dp's you should not get any cels (due to dp).
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