ER Charge Pipe pop-out problem, need advise ASAP

[toni8284]

Hi,

I just came back from NJMP today.

at the last seesion, I got an engine malfunction and I found out the clamp is broken.

I attached it.




Can anyone tell me where can I got a replacement?

And the mechanic at the track help me put the plastic end back and re-tight the clamp up.

But you can see the clamp on the bottom left, it's broken.

I have another track day tomorrow, do you think I will be OK with the current condition?

Thanks for the input.

[fboutlaw]

I would pull the nut off, put a larger nut around the part that split to hold it in place, then add a large washer and put the original nut back on. That should hold until you get a replacement.

Now boost leak is one of my favorite issues (which is how this issue will present). The issue you are seeing should be minimal with the fix above. I was missing a gasket and at one point completely had the inlet from my intercooler separate from the pipe that feeds it. I could still drive on the track. Eventually though, your system won't be able to compensate and you'll end up with error code 0x30FF. That's boost leak and it means the engine can no longer control boost pressure with the waste gates or the blow off valve. The car will go into a low boost mode first, then if you keep pushing it, it can go into limp mode. If you have your pipe separate, I'd expect that to happen. The car is still 100% drivable, but you just won't have any power. When you cool down the car, reconnect the pipes, and re-start it, it should be back to normal until you piss the car off again.

Long story short.
- You can likely fix this for a track day with a large washer and a nut to fix that split shaft.
- If you have access to your boost pressure, turn it down for the track day
- If you can't fix the mechanics, the car is still drivable on the track, but if you go into reduced power mode, back off and come back to the pits and have it cool down. You'll still be able to go out again temporarily or get the car home.

Good luck.

[toni8284]

Originally Posted by fboutlaw

I would pull the nut off, put a larger nut around the part that split to hold it in place, then add a large washer and put the original nut back on. That should hold until you get a replacement.

Now boost leak is one of my favorite issues (which is how this issue will present). The issue you are seeing should be minimal with the fix above. I was missing a gasket and at one point completely had the inlet from my intercooler separate from the pipe that feeds it. I could still drive on the track. Eventually though, your system won't be able to compensate and you'll end up with error code 0x30FF. That's boost leak and it means the engine can no longer control boost pressure with the waste gates or the blow off valve. The car will go into a low boost mode first, then if you keep pushing it, it can go into limp mode. If you have your pipe separate, I'd expect that to happen. The car is still 100% drivable, but you just won't have any power. When you cool down the car, reconnect the pipes, and re-start it, it should be back to normal until you piss the car off again.

Long story short.
- You can likely fix this for a track day with a large washer and a nut to fix that split shaft.
- If you have access to your boost pressure, turn it down for the track day
- If you can't fix the mechanics, the car is still drivable on the track, but if you go into reduced power mode, back off and come back to the pits and have it cool down. You'll still be able to go out again temporarily or get the car home.

Good luck.

Thank you so much for the reply.

I feel a lot better now.

If I understand correct, remove the nut, get the larger nut in there first, then put the washer in, and finally put the original nut back, am I correct?

[fboutlaw]

Originally Posted by toni8284

Thank you so much for the reply.

I feel a lot better now.

If I understand correct, remove the nut, get the larger nut in there first, then put the washer in, and finally put the original nut back, am I correct?

That would be my hack, yes.

Old:
[orig. nut][split collar]

New:
[orig. nut][washer that holds new nut on collar][collar bent back into place][large nut around collar preventing split].

[tracer bullet]

Sounds like a clever fix, I like it. Toni - Yeah, the idea is that the larger nut will keep those two pieces from flaring apart from each other, which will allow the smaller nut to hold things tight. You might have to use some pliers or something first however to get those two pieces together but it should work.

I would bet that someone at that track would know where to find a new clamp. They may have a garage at the track with some parts laying around, or know of a local shop - possibly a car parts store or a race shop, that would have them too. If you absolutely can't find something and have to order one, I like www.mcmaster.com for these kinds of things. By the way you are looking for a "t-bolt" clamp, a normal clamp from a Lowes / Home Depot won't do it. You probably know that though but just to be sure.

Hope you get it fixed and have fun! I am still thoroughly enjoying your old car

[robertm]

I believe that's called a T-bolt clamp. Most automotive stores will carry something similar.

You want to tighten it but not as much as you did. Looks like it was so tight it failed.

[robertm]

Originally Posted by fboutlaw

I would pull the nut off, put a larger nut around the part that split to hold it in place, then add a large washer and put the original nut back on. That should hold until you get a replacement.


Now boost leak is one of my favorite issues (which is how this issue will present). The issue you are seeing should be minimal with the fix above. I was missing a gasket and at one point completely had the inlet from my intercooler separate from the pipe that feeds it. I could still drive on the track. Eventually though, your system won't be able to compensate and you'll end up with error code 0x30FF. That's boost leak and it means the engine can no longer control boost pressure with the waste gates or the blow off valve. The car will go into a low boost mode first, then if you keep pushing it, it can go into limp mode. If you have your pipe separate, I'd expect that to happen. The car is still 100% drivable, but you just won't have any power. When you cool down the car, reconnect the pipes, and re-start it, it should be back to normal until you piss the car off again.


Long story short.

- You can likely fix this for a track day with a large washer and a nut to fix that split shaft.

- If you have access to your boost pressure, turn it down for the track day

- If you can't fix the mechanics, the car is still drivable on the track, but if you go into reduced power mode, back off and come back to the pits and have it cool down. You'll still be able to go out again temporarily or get the car home.


Good luck.

I had something very similar happen on track. First time the engine fault symbol came on and had no turbos at all (it felt like). Limped around track then turned car off/on and everything was fine. Second time no engine fault symbol but engine started running really bad and had no turbo boost. Same thing, off/on and everything was fine. I suspect I have a cracked or leaking charge pipe. I didn't see anything but I have a charge pipe sitting in the garage waiting to go one. Sound about right? Haven't gotten around to looking for codes yet.

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by robertm

I had something very similar happen on track. First time the engine fault symbol came on and had no turbos at all (it felt like). Limped around track then turned car off/on and everything was fine. Second time no engine fault symbol but engine started running really bad and had no turbo boost. Same thing, off/on and everything was fine. I suspect I have a cracked or leaking charge pipe. I didn't see anything but I have a charge pipe sitting in the garage waiting to go one. Sound about right? Haven't gotten around to looking for codes yet.

let me know when you find out... I am still on the OEM.

[TXmtrhed]

Originally Posted by robertm

I had something very similar happen on track. First time the engine fault symbol came on and had no turbos at all (it felt like). Limped around track then turned car off/on and everything was fine. Second time no engine fault symbol but engine started running really bad and had no turbo boost. Same thing, off/on and everything was fine. I suspect I have a cracked or leaking charge pipe. I didn't see anything but I have a charge pipe sitting in the garage waiting to go one. Sound about right? Haven't gotten around to looking for codes yet.

If your charge pipe is broken you should have no boost at any time and won't until it's replaced. Probably something else caused you to go into limp mode. I've had both problems at different times at the track - broken charge pipe last year and the engine going into limp mode earlier this month at CoTA. I suspect the CoTA limp mode may have come from a brief oil starvation as it happened while going through T11 (hairpin left).

BTW, still running OEM charge pipe.

[TXmtrhed]

I forgot to add that the OP appears to be missing a cap under the nut that would keep the clamp from spreading.

[fboutlaw]

Originally Posted by robertm

I had something very similar happen on track. First time the engine fault symbol came on and had no turbos at all (it felt like). Limped around track then turned car off/on and everything was fine. Second time no engine fault symbol but engine started running really bad and had no turbo boost. Same thing, off/on and everything was fine. I suspect I have a cracked or leaking charge pipe. I didn't see anything but I have a charge pipe sitting in the garage waiting to go one. Sound about right? Haven't gotten around to looking for codes yet.

1. Check your codes. What you described could be a multitude of things to throw the engine into a reduced power mode.

2. Diagnose: Don't "suspect" things then buy replacement parts to fix things that aren't broken. I looked up my code (30FF), which is boost leak. Went for likely suspects (Charge pipe, BOV), and they didn't fix the underlying issue. Then I tightened up the solenoids per forum advice. Didn't fix it. Then finally just ripped components off the car and found the missing seal. This would have cost me $18 to fix if I had properly diagnosed the problem, and I wouldn't have a BOV that makes it sound like I'm in a F&F movie.

3. Replace broken parts with BMW parts or OEM. Aftermarket parts are really hit or miss and at least to me. Don't get me wrong, I've dumped something like 20k into my car, but if I could do it again, I'd stick to BMW parts if at all possible.

[robertm]

Originally Posted by fboutlaw

1. Check your codes. What you described could be a multitude of things to throw the engine into a reduced power mode.


2. Diagnose: Don't "suspect" things then buy replacement parts to fix things that aren't broken. I looked up my code (30FF), which is boost leak. Went for likely suspects (Charge pipe, BOV), and they didn't fix the underlying issue. Then I tightened up the solenoids per forum advice. Didn't fix it. Then finally just ripped components off the car and found the missing seal. This would have cost me $18 to fix if I had properly diagnosed the problem, and I wouldn't have a BOV that makes it sound like I'm in a F&F movie.

3. Replace broken parts with BMW parts or OEM. Aftermarket parts are really hit or miss and at least to me. Don't get me wrong, I've dumped something like 20k into my car, but if I could do it again, I'd stick to BMW parts if at all possible.

Honestly it will be a long while until I take the car back out on track again. I maybe take it out for 2-3 sessions a year. The charge pipe has been sitting on my shelf for prob 6 months so I'll probably throw it on before I go out again. If I have issue again I'll take a more serious approach. This isn't my track car and it has zero issues on the street so I just haven't delved to deeply into find the issue.


Agreed though throwing parts at it is never a good approach!

What seal was missing on your car?

[fboutlaw]

Originally Posted by robertm

Honestly it will be a long while until I take the car back out on track again. I maybe take it out for 2-3 sessions a year. The charge pipe has been sitting on my shelf for prob 6 months so I'll probably throw it on before I go out again. If I have issue again I'll take a more serious approach. This isn't my track car and it has zero issues on the street so I just haven't delved to deeply into find the issue.


Agreed though throwing parts at it is never a good approach!

What seal was missing on your car?

Part 3. 11617791470

Never installed from factory or some garage messed with me.

[toni8284]

Originally Posted by TXmtrhed

I forgot to add that the OP appears to be missing a cap under the nut that would keep the clamp from spreading.

I think the cap is broken and can't be found.

[toni8284]

Originally Posted by Ian///M

The ER clamps are way better than stock. The clamp has been over tightened. Many BMW parts are rubbish such as the CP and FMIC.

Should I contact ER for replacement clamp or somewhere else I can find the similar part?

[fboutlaw]

Originally Posted by Ian///M

That's a one-time clamp, has to be cut off to remove

Part 17 is the only 1 time clamp in the picture. I was answering the question of what part was missing on my own car for my own issue.

For Part 17, which is the one that's messed up on OP's car (aftermarket version), you can actually buy a replacement part from BMW that is not a one time use clamp, which will fit around the hose you have right now. It's a nice one that applies even pressure around the clamp.

For OP, short term fix listed above.
Medium term, get a clamp from an auto parts store.
Long term, get the BMW replacement part for item #17. It would allow you to swap back to stock CP and BOV if need be in the future as well.

[E30 Racer]

Originally Posted by toni8284

Should I contact ER for replacement clamp or somewhere else I can find the similar part?

The ER charge pipe has a lifetime warranty. I'd give them a call to see if that includes the clamps. That said, it has clearly been over tightened...

[fboutlaw]

Originally Posted by Ian///M

I disagree, the in-flow to the FMIC is a one-time clamp. I have changed it and I know.

You're talking top of the accordion. I'm talking bottom.

[toni8284]

All,

I got the part from ER today.

I replaced the both clamps on the CP.

I have 2 questions

1) How do I know if I over-tighted again on the clamp? Can you tell me from the pic below?



2) on the pipe goes into the silicone, I cant push the pipe into the silicone anymore, does it create any problem or turbo lose?



I didn't install it at the first time, so I dont remember how it was before.