CPO nightmare, having problems with BMW of Mt. Laurel NJ

[feeshta]

Originally Posted by mtowle182

jesus christ now suspension damage? this is fucked

Agreed

[chris82]

Originally Posted by feeshta

By way of an update, BMW of Mount Laurel has agreed to powder coat all 4 wheels now, so thankfully they are taking care of me on that point.

Unfortunately I recently found more damage caused by an apparently massive pothole strike during the previous owner's tenure, which also was likely the culprit on the damaged headlight. This past weekend I installed an Ohlins R&T suspension system on the car, and found that the right front shock mount was badly mushroomed, and showed evidence of having been repaired as the alignment tab had been cut off in an apparent attempt to get the car back into alignment. Here is a picture of the damage matched up with the Dinan camber plates for perspective on the extent of the damage.



I'm worried that this means the inside of the shock tower is similarly damaged. I could not see any obvious signs of this, but I had no way of accurately measuring things. The bearings in this mount were also completely full of sand, having been exposed more than usual to the elements by the bend it seems. The steering would give an occasional grumble that I had been worried about, but that seems to be fixed now. Anyone have any advice here?



P.S. I just have to give the Ohlins a big thumbs up. The install was a bit of a pain in the ass, but the end result is hugely satisfying. I don't even have the car aligned yet and the difference in ride and handling is striking. It rides worlds better than stock, and the handling is not even in the same league.

I just checked out their yelp page here: http://www.yelp.com/biz/bmw-of-mount...l-mount-laurel

Quite a few bad reviews of their service, vehicles, staff, and service departments. It looks like they have a customer service rep responding to some though, so maybe you would have some luck putting a review up along with pictures like the broken shock mount.

Hopefully they do SOMETHING to compensate you because fixing problems that should have been fixed before you even bought the car is not enough.

This sounds like a dealership that needs a meeting with the BBB and BMWNA

[EMWOLB]

This thread is interesting for a couple of good tidbits of information. I'm surprised that some of you don't know or understand them.

First, do not make any modifications to your car while it is under warranty. I don't care if it is as minor as changing the valve stems caps. All it does is give the dealer an excuse to deny any warranty claims. Yes you can yell and scream about your "rights" and whatever else you might come up with, and you might even win? But ask yourself is it worth the stress and strain on your emotions and waste of time?

Next don't run any car through a car wash. You are just asking for trouble. You have minimum wage workers pushing vehicles through these places as fast as they humanly can. They aren't going to take any special care of your ride. The only way to wash your rides is by hand using a bucket of water, a mitt, and a hose. Wheels should always be cleaned by hand using a car wash soap.

When you buy a car or anything, you should make several visits to all the dealers. Go in with the intention you want to buy a new vehicle and have a "pretend" trade with you. If you are observant, you can quickly learn a lot about how you'll get treated and how good a deal you'll get. In the same vein, check out all possible sources of information about a dealer. Perhaps Yelp?

The CPO is all crap. Dealers are rolling the dice that the car doesn't have any problems, and they won't have to layout any money for the warranty. What most dealers will do is a cursory inspection and wash the car. They just don't have the time and labor to perform a 200 point or whatever inspection. If you do have interest in a CPO, take it to someone for a second opinion. You'll have to spend some money too. Also note that Consumer Reports estimates at least 20% of the car on the road have some sort of damage. either mechanical or structural.

Finally the BBB is mostly a waste of time. They are understaffed, and they can't do anything legally to resolve issues. On their site, they'll give good reviews of businesses no longer in business. BMWNA is even a bigger waste of time. They have demonstrated over the years they'll do anything to dismiss your claim. I guess they figure they have a "lock" on the market and a new generation of suckers will buy the Ultimate Driving Machine.

Even though a used car is the best way to save money, it is often not a good idea with German vehicles considering issues with them. My advice is to try and buy new and get an extended warranty. I always buy new, and I buy from any dealer anywhere looking to pick up a "new" car left in inventory when the new model comes out.

[feeshta]

Originally Posted by EMWOLB

This thread is interesting for a couple of good tidbits of information. I'm surprised that some of you don't know or understand them.

First, do not make any modifications to your car while it is under warranty. I don't care if it is as minor as changing the valve stems caps. All it does is give the dealer an excuse to deny any warranty claims. Yes you can yell and scream about your "rights" and whatever else you might come up with, and you might even win? But ask yourself is it worth the stress and strain on your emotions and waste of time?

Next don't run any car through a car wash. You are just asking for trouble. You have minimum wage workers pushing vehicles through these places as fast as they humanly can. They aren't going to take any special care of your ride. The only way to wash your rides is by hand using a bucket of water, a mitt, and a hose. Wheels should always be cleaned by hand using a car wash soap.

When you buy a car or anything, you should make several visits to all the dealers. Go in with the intention you want to buy a new vehicle and have a "pretend" trade with you. If you are observant, you can quickly learn a lot about how you'll get treated and how good a deal you'll get. In the same vein, check out all possible sources of information about a dealer. Perhaps Yelp?

The CPO is all crap. Dealers are rolling the dice that the car doesn't have any problems, and they won't have to layout any money for the warranty. What most dealers will do is a cursory inspection and wash the car. They just don't have the time and labor to perform a 200 point or whatever inspection. If you do have interest in a CPO, take it to someone for a second opinion. You'll have to spend some money too. Also note that Consumer Reports estimates at least 20% of the car on the road have some sort of damage. either mechanical or structural.

Finally the BBB is mostly a waste of time. They are understaffed, and they can't do anything legally to resolve issues. On their site, they'll give good reviews of businesses no longer in business. BMWNA is even a bigger waste of time. They have demonstrated over the years they'll do anything to dismiss your claim. I guess they figure they have a "lock" on the market and a new generation of suckers will buy the Ultimate Driving Machine.

Even though a used car is the best way to save money, it is often not a good idea with German vehicles considering issues with them. My advice is to try and buy new and get an extended warranty. I always buy new, and I buy from any dealer anywhere looking to pick up a "new" car left in inventory when the new model comes out.

Thanks Dad.

[mr.fabulous]

Originally Posted by EMWOLB

The CPO is all crap. Dealers are rolling the dice that the car doesn't have any problems, and they won't have to layout any money for the warranty. What most dealers will do is a cursory inspection and wash the car. They just don't have the time and labor to perform a 200 point or whatever inspection.

CPO is nothing more than a very limited extended warranty. I'm told it adds about $2K to the price of the car. My E36 was CPO, and it paid for itself. No need yet with my E82 (~18mos CPO remaining), we'll see what happens.

[feeshta]

Originally Posted by mr.fabulous

CPO is nothing more than a very limited extended warranty. I'm told it adds about $2K to the price of the car. My E36 was CPO, and it paid for itself. No need yet with my E82 (~18mos CPO remaining), we'll see what happens.

Well, the CPO has already paid for itself in my case on the lights. I would have missed that problem had I bought the car privately, and been out nearly 3K to repair it. It's also covering the cost of the powder-coating on the wheels as well, which would run me about $700 to have done myself, and is providing a loaner car through that process. all told it has probably added up to well over 4K in value since I bought the car.

In the end it has paid to go with the CPO, even if it's a pain in the ass to get things covered. Without that warranty I would have been up the creek without a paddle.

All I really care about moving forward is the power train warranty. The car has 44,700 miles on it at the moment, and the bumper to bumper portion of the warranty expires at 45K. that's why I went ahead with the suspension work. If there is actual damage to the shock tower I will attempt to get that covered due to the fact that it is pretty clearly preexisting, given the fact that I discovered it during the process of installing the Ohlins, and the fact that the dealership told me a pothole was what caused the damage to the lights in the first place.

[EMWOLB]

Originally Posted by feeshta

Well, the CPO has already paid for itself in my case on the lights. I would have missed that problem had I bought the car privately, and been out nearly 3K to repair it. It's also covering the cost of the powder-coating on the wheels as well, which would run me about $700 to have done myself, and is providing a loaner car through that process. all told it has probably added up to well over 4K in value since I bought the car.

In the end it has paid to go with the CPO, even if it's a pain in the ass to get things covered. Without that warranty I would have been up the creek without a paddle.

All I really care about moving forward is the power train warranty. The car has 44,700 miles on it at the moment, and the bumper to bumper portion of the warranty expires at 45K. that's why I went ahead with the suspension work. If there is actual damage to the shock tower I will attempt to get that covered due to the fact that it is pretty clearly preexisting, given the fact that I discovered it during the process of installing the Ohlins, and the fact that the dealership told me a pothole was what caused the damage to the lights in the first place.

The CPO wasn't free. The price of the car was jacked up to cover it. Next, you can't know what sort of problems you would have encountered buying your car elsewhere, so your rationalization is all hot air.

The dealer isn't going to cover any suspension damage. You decided to modify the suspension, and hitting potholes is considered owner abuse or wear and tear not covered under any warranty.

Yes son it is time you realize it is you against the world.

[feeshta]

Originally Posted by EMWOLB

The CPO wasn't free. The price of the car was jacked up to cover it. Next, you can't know what sort of problems you would have encountered buying your car elsewhere, so your rationalization is all hot air.

The dealer isn't going to cover any suspension damage. You decided to modify the suspension, and hitting potholes is considered owner abuse or wear and tear not covered under any warranty.

Yes son it is time you realize it is you against the world.

The dealership already acknowledged that the damage to the headlights was caused by pothole damage prior to my ownership of the car. They would not have covered the headlight if they didn't. As such, I already have an admission of damage prior to the suspension modifications, and documentation of reporting of the issues less than two weeks after taking delivery. There is a chance they will cover it, although I would not bet on it.

The cost of the CPO warranty was considered in my comments above, which should have been obvious. Also, I'm betting you really enjoy pissing in other people's food, don't you?

[EMWOLB]

Well there are two sides to every story. We've only heard your side.

One thing is for sure you aren't very tactful and get easily pissed off. I never get pissed off. Usually only losers do. Also I think you are a very slow learner.

If I were the dealer, from my experiences so far dealing with you, I wouldn't be inclined to go out of my way for you. Dealer goodwill or goodwill with any business entity is an intangible thing. It is something that is fostered between two parties through civil negotiation. Anger and screaming kills any chance of it happening.

[edisapimp]

Originally Posted by EMWOLB

Well there are two sides to every story. We've only heard your side.

One thing is for sure you aren't very tactful and get easily pissed off. I never get pissed off. Usually only losers do. Also I think you are a very slow learner.

If I were the dealer, from my experiences so far dealing with you, I wouldn't be inclined to go out of my way for you. Dealer goodwill or goodwill with any business entity is an intangible thing. It is something that is fostered between two parties through civil negotiation. Anger and screaming kills any chance of it happening.

Good thing you're not a dealer, or a business owner of any kind then, because you'd probably be out of business pretty quickly. There is no "goodwill" here, the dealership sold him a car with a warranty that expresses and implies 1.) The car was inspected and deemed to be completely satisfactory, safe, and in working order, 2.) If it is not as such, it will be repaired under the agreeement.

Please tell me where, as a seller, when you promise a buyer something, and it's not what you promised (and furthermore also agreed that any defects will be corrected [read: warranty]), you correcting the issue is "goodwill"?

I must disagree with you on this topic, and I think when one shells out the extra money for peace of mind, one expects results, and it's not unreasonable to be upset when the expectations are not met.

Originally Posted by EMWOLB

This thread is interesting for a couple of good tidbits of information. I'm surprised that some of you don't know or understand them.

First, do not make any modifications to your car while it is under warranty. I don't care if it is as minor as changing the valve stems caps. All it does is give the dealer an excuse to deny any warranty claims. Yes you can yell and scream about your "rights" and whatever else you might come up with, and you might even win? But ask yourself is it worth the stress and strain on your emotions and waste of time?

Everyone knows you are rolling the dice when you modify your car, that said; I took my car to a dealership more or less FBO (minus re-flashing the ECU to stock) for the wastegate rattle, and my turbos were replaced for $0. The dealership's job is not to try to screw you out of the repairs for known issues, it's to complete the repairs and develop a relationship with the customer. It's called "service." I can say to you with assurance that should the day come when I actually buy a new BMW, I will go to the dealership that worked on my car, they've earned my business, and they probably don't even know it.

Originally Posted by EMWOLB

Next don't run any car through a car wash. You are just asking for trouble. You have minimum wage workers pushing vehicles through these places as fast as they humanly can. They aren't going to take any special care of your ride. The only way to wash your rides is by hand using a bucket of water, a mitt, and a hose. Wheels should always be cleaned by hand using a car wash soap.

Disagree again. The car washes where I live are brushless, and they exercise extreme caution when they wash people's cars inside and out. No surprise here, Long Island women can be extremely nasty if you mess up their stuff. It's sad to admit, but the squeaky wheel gets the grease. The people who own these cars on the Miracle mile - bentley, range, aston, jag - you might not believe this, but they aren't getting in their Prada blouses and then getting the bucket and soap out of the garage. If you go to an $8 car wash, yeah you're gonna get swirls and who knows what else - but if you care about your car and your time is worth anything to you - you're paying someone to do it.

Originally Posted by EMWOLB

When you buy a car or anything, you should make several visits to all the dealers. Go in with the intention you want to buy a new vehicle and have a "pretend" trade with you. If you are observant, you can quickly learn a lot about how you'll get treated and how good a deal you'll get. In the same vein, check out all possible sources of information about a dealer. Perhaps Yelp?

Who the hell has time for that? Let's not forget the OP bought his car from a place CPO, he took it to the dealership he bought it from, I think anyone would probably do the same.

Originally Posted by EMWOLB

The CPO is all crap. Dealers are rolling the dice that the car doesn't have any problems, and they won't have to layout any money for the warranty. What most dealers will do is a cursory inspection and wash the car. They just don't have the time and labor to perform a 200 point or whatever inspection. If you do have interest in a CPO, take it to someone for a second opinion. You'll have to spend some money too. Also note that Consumer Reports estimates at least 20% of the car on the road have some sort of damage. either mechanical or structural.

I agree with you completely. I've only ever purchased a car private party because I think CPO is a scam.

Originally Posted by EMWOLB

Finally the BBB is mostly a waste of time. They are understaffed, and they can't do anything legally to resolve issues. On their site, they'll give good reviews of businesses no longer in business. BMWNA is even a bigger waste of time. They have demonstrated over the years they'll do anything to dismiss your claim. I guess they figure they have a "lock" on the market and a new generation of suckers will buy the Ultimate Driving Machine.

Couldn't agree more.

Originally Posted by EMWOLB

Even though a used car is the best way to save money, it is often not a good idea with German vehicles considering issues with them. My advice is to try and buy new and get an extended warranty. I always buy new, and I buy from any dealer anywhere looking to pick up a "new" car left in inventory when the new model comes out.

Disagree. To generalize that "all" of any country's exports are inherently unreliable is.. how shall I say this.. dumb.

More important that country of origin is service records and the care of the owners. If the person took care of the car and can prove it, then I would feel comfortable buying it. If it were the car with the greatest reputation in history for reliability, let's say, a gleaming white Toyota Corolla, but the tires were bald, brakes squeaking, oil black, windshield wipers shredded, and the owner had no records at all, I would steer clear of it.

[feeshta]

Originally Posted by EMWOLB

Well there are two sides to every story. We've only heard your side.

One thing is for sure you aren't very tactful and get easily pissed off. I never get pissed off. Usually only losers do. Also I think you are a very slow learner.

If I were the dealer, from my experiences so far dealing with you, I wouldn't be inclined to go out of my way for you. Dealer goodwill or goodwill with any business entity is an intangible thing. It is something that is fostered between two parties through civil negotiation. Anger and screaming kills any chance of it happening.

I'm really not sure what your problem is. You make assumptions about things that are simply false, and seem to have nothing to add to the discussion other than criticizing the decisions of others. I never screamed at anyone in this process. In point of fact, the last time I screamed at anyone was probably in my early teens. That simply is not how things work for me. I was cordial and polite throughout the process with the exception of a negative reaction to an extremely rude dealership employee after he called me a liar and suggested that I was attempting to defraud his dealership, but I never yelled at him. The worst I did was tell him he was full of shit, because he was. The things he was saying were so without merit that there is nothing else that you could call it, and I'm not just talking about his accusations against me, I'm talking about his suggestions for what may have caused the problem in the first place, which were laughably off the wall.

Personally I believe that his whole act was an attempt to scare me off, so that I would not pursue my claim and the dealership would not have to suffer the negative consequences of their lack of diligence.

Part of the problem was the fact that I was apparently given faulty information by a local dealership, but honestly that had nothing to do with the clash experienced during that first call, as he never denied their claims of a broken motor mount, he simply accused me of having caused the damage myself.

It's pretty funny seeing you make accusations about my supposed lack of tact, considering who is making those accusations. You are exactly the kind of person who gives BMW owners a bad name.

[EMWOLB]

Originally Posted by feeshta

I'm really not sure what your problem is. You make assumptions about things that are simply false, and seem to have nothing to add to the discussion other than criticizing the decisions of others. I never screamed at anyone in this process. In point of fact, the last time I screamed at anyone was probably in my early teens. That simply is not how things work for me. I was cordial and polite throughout the process with the exception of a negative reaction to an extremely rude dealership employee after he called me a liar and suggested that I was attempting to defraud his dealership, but I never yelled at him. The worst I did was tell him he was full of shit, because he was. The things he was saying were so without merit that there is nothing else that you could call it, and I'm not just talking about his accusations against me, I'm talking about his suggestions for what may have caused the problem in the first place, which were laughably off the wall.

Personally I believe that his whole act was an attempt to scare me off, so that I would not pursue my claim and the dealership would not have to suffer the negative consequences of their lack of diligence.

Part of the problem was the fact that I was apparently given faulty information by a local dealership, but honestly that had nothing to do with the clash experienced during that first call, as he never denied their claims of a broken motor mount, he simply accused me of having caused the damage myself.

It's pretty funny seeing you make accusations about my supposed lack of tact, considering who is making those accusations. You are exactly the kind of person who gives BMW owners a bad name.

Read your initial post about your interaction with the dealer. Again, you have a volatile personality and either a bad memory or Alzheimers.

Next you should read the CPO warranty. All of you seem to think any issues you find with your purchase should be repaired by the dealer. I guarantee you'll always get some push back from the dealer. I don't have to prove this, because this is exactly what you have experienced.

I'll try to explain it to you. Items of wear and tear or due to abuse by the owner are never covered by any warranty. Nearly all the problems you have brought up could have been due to mistreatment of the vehicle by YOU. Do you think any dealer is just going to repair every problem you have?

And we come to goodwill. It is important to have some sort of rapport with the people you do business with. Many times the dealer won't give you an argument about something and go ahead and fix it simply because they like you. Also what are you going to do if the dealer won't fix it? Complain to BMW? Sue the dealer?

I know many of you don't like Consumer Reports, but for those of you who have an open mind read the April 2014 issue 0n page 21, about extended warranties. CR thought they were a waste of money for most vehicles. The exceptions were Mercedes Benz and BMW. German cars have extremely expensive repair costs. I've had a lot of experience with these vehicles over the years, and some of these vehicles can put a huge hole in your wallet.

I'm going to briefly mention one problem MB owners have had. It's the infamous balance shaft debacle. The problem was due to a manufacturing defect, and the repair cost was nearly $6,000! Mercedes acknowledged the defect, but the problem was they didn't know precisely which vehicle were affected, or when the it would show up. Unfortunately, it often showed up outside the warranty. Sometimes because of goodwill, Mercedes would fix it. Often they wouldn't. Finally a class action was lodged against the company. The plaintiffs won it, but it took years!

In conclusion, I can see most of you are very young and inexperienced in business and how things really work in the world.

[feeshta]

Originally Posted by EMWOLB

Read your initial post about your interaction with the dealer. Again, you have a volatile personality and either a bad memory or Alzheimers.

Next you should read the CPO warranty. All of you seem to think any issues you find with your purchase should be repaired by the dealer. I guarantee you'll always get some push back from the dealer. I don't have to prove this, because this is exactly what you have experienced.

I'll try to explain it to you. Items of wear and tear or due to abuse by the owner are never covered by any warranty. Nearly all the problems you have brought up could have been due to mistreatment of the vehicle by YOU. Do you think any dealer is just going to repair every problem you have?

And we come to goodwill. It is important to have some sort of rapport with the people you do business with. Many times the dealer won't give you an argument about something and go ahead and fix it simply because they like you. Also what are you going to do if the dealer won't fix it? Complain to BMW? Sue the dealer?

I know many of you don't like Consumer Reports, but for those of you who have an open mind read the April 2014 issue 0n page 21, about extended warranties. CR thought they were a waste of money for most vehicles. The exceptions were Mercedes Benz and BMW. German cars have extremely expensive repair costs. I've had a lot of experience with these vehicles over the years, and some of these vehicles can put a huge hole in your wallet.

I'm going to briefly mention one problem MB owners have had. It's the infamous balance shaft debacle. The problem was due to a manufacturing defect, and the repair cost was nearly $6,000! Mercedes acknowledged the defect, but the problem was they didn't know precisely which vehicle were affected, or when the it would show up. Unfortunately, it often showed up outside the warranty. Sometimes because of goodwill, Mercedes would fix it. Often they wouldn't. Finally a class action was lodged against the company. The plaintiffs won it, but it took years!

In conclusion, I can see most of you are very young and inexperienced in business and how things really work in the world.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about when it comes to my interactions with the dealership, or anyone else for that matter. For me, "completely losing my temper" means breaking with polite and cordial conversation, not yelling and screaming. People who know me would tell you that I am a very even tempered person, almost to the point of boring. I don't lose my temper easily at all. All of my conversations save that first one have been very polite and cordial, as they always are, and that first conversation started that way before it was ruined by an extremely impolite employee at the other end. It was that person that was the one doing the screaming, not me, I simply let him know what I felt about how he was behaving and the ridiculous lies he was spouting as he tried to convince me that my installation of M3 control arms completely voided my warranty, etc, which is absolutely false. I'm honestly shocked that this person has a job in customer service, he was impossible to deal with. Like I said, the only conclusion I can come to is that he was intentionally rude in an attempt to get me to go away. I can't imagine anyone consistently behaving in this manner retaining their job.

On the point of "items of wear and tear". Headlight housings and the metal bodies of Shock mounts are not "items of wear and tear". They are in fact covered under the warranty for failure. In this case, the problem was damage, which is not normally covered, but I was able to prove to the dealership through documentation that the damage predated my ownership of the vehicle. If the bushings had been worn out, then you would have a point about wear and tear, but the rubber is actually fine. It was the metal body of the shock mount that was bent. This damage was extremely difficult or impossible to see without taking things apart, so it is not all that surprising that it was missed by their inspection, but it absolutely was. The removal of the alignment tab and the amount of grime built up inside pretty clearly establish that this happened long ago. I can also say this with confidence because I know that nothing happened to the car while it was in my possession that could have caused damage of such an extent. The worst it has seen during my ownership is a minor pothole or two.

In any case, that is a moot point now. I already had purchased new shock mounts as a preventative maintenance meassure, and a more thorough inspection last night satisfied me that the shock tower itself is actually straight, so it appears nothing further needs to be done at this point other than getting the wheels refinished. In that case the dealership immediately acknowledged their mistake, there was just some minor disagreement on how it should be rectified. Thankfully they did the right thing and will have the wheels repaired in an appropriate manner. That result was accomplished through cultivating "good will" with the dealership, and I didn't need any lessons from you in order to achieve it.

[IEDEI]

Original poster: don't even bother replying to EMWOLB...he's just a troll looking for bait.....zero credibility.

[135TX]

Originally Posted by IEDEI

Original poster: don't even bother replying to EMWOLB...he's just a troll looking for bait.....zero credibility.

plus he drives a 235i so that completely negates all credibility he might have had!

[Ultimateone]

Don't feed the troll seriously, not worth it.

[Ed P]

Originally Posted by EMWOLB

This thread is interesting for a couple of good tidbits of information. I'm surprised that some of you don't know or understand them.

First, do not make any modifications to your car while it is under warranty. I don't care if it is as minor as changing the valve stems caps. All it does is give the dealer an excuse to deny any warranty claims. Yes you can yell and scream about your "rights" and whatever else you might come up with, and you might even win? But ask yourself is it worth the stress and strain on your emotions and waste of time?

Next don't run any car through a car wash. You are just asking for trouble. You have minimum wage workers pushing vehicles through these places as fast as they humanly can. They aren't going to take any special care of your ride. The only way to wash your rides is by hand using a bucket of water, a mitt, and a hose. Wheels should always be cleaned by hand using a car wash soap.

When you buy a car or anything, you should make several visits to all the dealers. Go in with the intention you want to buy a new vehicle and have a "pretend" trade with you. If you are observant, you can quickly learn a lot about how you'll get treated and how good a deal you'll get. In the same vein, check out all possible sources of information about a dealer. Perhaps Yelp?

The CPO is all crap. Dealers are rolling the dice that the car doesn't have any problems, and they won't have to layout any money for the warranty. What most dealers will do is a cursory inspection and wash the car. They just don't have the time and labor to perform a 200 point or whatever inspection. If you do have interest in a CPO, take it to someone for a second opinion. You'll have to spend some money too. Also note that Consumer Reports estimates at least 20% of the car on the road have some sort of damage. either mechanical or structural.

Finally the BBB is mostly a waste of time. They are understaffed, and they can't do anything legally to resolve issues. On their site, they'll give good reviews of businesses no longer in business. BMWNA is even a bigger waste of time. They have demonstrated over the years they'll do anything to dismiss your claim. I guess they figure they have a "lock" on the market and a new generation of suckers will buy the Ultimate Driving Machine.

Even though a used car is the best way to save money, it is often not a good idea with German vehicles considering issues with them. My advice is to try and buy new and get an extended warranty. I always buy new, and I buy from any dealer anywhere looking to pick up a "new" car left in inventory when the new model comes out.

I love people like you, thanks!

Thanks to people like you, last July I bought my CPO (full warranty through end of 2018), 2013, 3300 miles, loaded, 135i M-Sport for $12K under sticker.