Engine-Transmission Speculation Roundup

[hoefx]

Reading through all the available information I am expecting the following options for NA:

125i = 218hp N52
130i = 265hp(272?) N52
123d = 204hp M47TU2D20

Possibly 135i (M?) 306hp N54

Standard 6sp manual w/ Auto option
No DCT

Any other speculation?

[bum944]

Originally Posted by hoefx

Reading through all the available information I am expecting the following options for NA:

125i = 218hp N52
130i = 265hp(272?) N52
123d = 204hp M47TU2D20

Possibly 135i (M?) 306hp N54

Standard 6sp manual w/ Auto option
No DCT

Any other speculation?

My dream car would be a 6-sp diesel coupe for myself and an auto diesel convertible for the wifey, but BMW doesn't make a clean enough diesel yet and unless gas prices stay at $3+, I doubt there will be enough demand.

[BForbes]

My speculations are as follows:

128i- 230hp
135i- 300hp
1er diesel at some point

[ghotman906]

Originally Posted by onehots2k

My speculations are as follows:

128i- 230hp
135i- 300hp
1er diesel at some point

I agree with u....

[123d]

Originally Posted by onehots2k

My speculations are as follows:

128i- 230hp
135i- 300hp
1er diesel at some point

Originally Posted by ghotman906

I agree with u....

I agree too.... but I don't think the deisel will be much later (maybe with the convertable), or even right a launch. Then the 135i will be replaced with the M version and the 128i will be replaced with the 130i (making room for the 125i/123i (turbo 2.0l))

[spudw]

What I think they will launch:
128i- 230hp
135i- 300hp

To be followed by:
128i Cabrio
135i Cabrio
123d- 204hp

What I would prefer to see:
123d- 204hp
128i- 230hp
130i- 260hp
M1- 340hp, normally aspirated
128i Cabrio
130i Cabrio

For me the sweet spot would be a 130i Coupé...

[BForbes]

Your preference is VERY understandable. But there needs to be more than a 30hp difference between the a 128i and 130i. ESPECIALLY when there would more than likely be a 5-6k difference between them. BMW has been forced to play the hp game. My dads $45,000 2004 325ci convertible only has a 192hp. I mean on paper it looks bad but its still one rockin car. Soo balanced and what not. 230hp should be a real hoot!

[Propagator]

Originally Posted by spudwest

What I think they will launch:
128i- 230hp
135i- 300hp

To be followed by:
128i Cabrio
135i Cabrio
123d- 204hp

Yup, that would be my guess too.

I don't see how they will stop making the 135i when the M1 rolls in, unless the price of the 135i is jacked up be over $40K with mandatory M-sports package and what not. You just can't replace a $35K car with a $45K car regardless of HP ratings you know.

[hoefx]

Advevo just posted some new pics in the other forum. This is the second clear shot of the intercooler from the twin turbo. I guess now we just have to wait in see what its called!

I would have preferred a 260hp N52, I guess now I just need to figure out where im going to get the extra money!

[WolfsburgerMitFries]

I'd prefer to see a 120si offering.
And really, its time for the dual clutch gearbox. Seriously.

[Propagator]

Those of us that want the 260HP N54 are pretty much screwed. I don't really see any way that we will get that unless one of the two things happen.

1. BMW moves to 3 model line up for the 1 and the 3, like the 5. This will allow them to position the 260HP motor as the middle one.

2. Competition gets so fierce that BMW needs to make 260HP a base engine.

There is a slight chance that 1 would happen, if the 1 turned out to be a smashing hit. 2, snow balls chance in hell.

[hector]

[quote=spinzero;3066]Those of us that want the 260HP N54 are pretty much screwed.quote]
+1

[hoefx]

Can someone explain why BMW moved to x28 from x25?

[hector]

Originally Posted by hoefx

Can someone explain why BMW moved to x28 from x25?

more power

[hoefx]

Originally Posted by hector

more power

Sorry... I should have been more specific. I was talking just about the naming convention. I don't understand why they started calling the base 3.0L motor a 328 instead of 325 in the 3-series? They are already making a 125i hatch, so why are they going to call the coupe a 128i?

[hector]

Originally Posted by hoefx

Sorry... I should have been more specific. I was talking just about the naming convention. I don't understand why they started calling the base 3.0L motor a 328 instead of 325 in the 3-series? They are already making a 125i hatch, so why are they going to call the coupe a 128i?

both the base and top models moved up in power so the 325 became 328 and the 330 became 335. r u sure that there is a 125? in which country(ies) is that available?

[Propagator]

Originally Posted by hoefx

Sorry... I should have been more specific. I was talking just about the naming convention. I don't understand why they started calling the base 3.0L motor a 328 instead of 325 in the 3-series? They are already making a 125i hatch, so why are they going to call the coupe a 128i?

It's all just a marketing scheme, at least in the US. x25, x28, x30, they are the same 3.0L N53 engines with varying degrees of tune. And by this I mean something as simple as different intake manifolds and different ECU coding.

Really, it should cost BMW next to nothing to upgrade x25 (210HP) to x28 (230HP) and to x30 (255HP). The R&D is all but done. The only reason that BMW intentionally detunes the N53, by killing the top end torque of an otherwise beautifully revving engine, is to have a pricing hierarchy.

So when BMW introduced the 335i one year after E90 debuted, with pricing that was only around $2K higher than the first year 330i, the only way to maintain a sensible two model lineup was to ditch both the 330i and the 325i. They couldn't make the 330i base model, since then the price of it will have to drop to low $30K, and that would've enraged the first year 330i owners who paid around $40K for theirs. They couldn't leave the 325i as the base, since the gap between the 325i and the 335i was just too big.

So they picked the middle number, 28, with a HP rating that is pretty much the average of the 325i and 330i, with the pricing that is also the average of the two. Pure marketing, nothing less, nothing more.

And of course the 1 is stuck with the same scheme with the 3, since BMW will not go for a three model line up for the 1, and the 128i is the only choice at this point for two model linup that includes the 135i.

[ecoBMW]

Originally Posted by spinzero

It's all just a marketing scheme, at least in the US. x25, x28, x30, they are the same 3.0L N53 engines with varying degrees of tune. And by this I mean something as simple as different intake manifolds and different ECU coding.

Really, it should cost BMW next to nothing to upgrade x25 (210HP) to x28 (230HP) and to x30 (255HP). The R&D is all but done. The only reason that BMW intentionally detunes the N53, by killing the top end torque of an otherwise beautifully revving engine, is to have a pricing hierarchy.

So when BMW introduced the 335i one year after E90 debuted, with pricing that was only around $2K higher than the first year 330i, the only way to maintain a sensible two model lineup was to ditch both the 330i and the 325i. They couldn't make the 330i base model, since then the price of it will have to drop to low $30K, and that would've enraged the first year 330i owners who paid around $40K for theirs. They couldn't leave the 325i as the base, since the gap between the 325i and the 335i was just too big.

So they picked the middle number, 28, with a HP rating that is pretty much the average of the 325i and 330i, with the pricing that is also the average of the two. Pure marketing, nothing less, nothing more.

And of course the 1 is stuck with the same scheme with the 3, since BMW will not go for a three model line up for the 1, and the 128i is the only choice at this point for two model linup that includes the 135i.

They pulled the same marketing scheme with the E36 and E46 generations. The first year of the new generation they start off with a couple options on engine size to choose from, then after 2 or 3 years they bump both up with more power to keep the buyers interested to keep that generation alive while they work on the ///M version for that generation and R&D for the next new generation, hence the E90 and now the 1 series.

They could have started the new 1 series off with the 23 and 28 claiming the 1 series is their entry level car with a smaller motor to meet the needs of a certain demographic, then moved on to the 25 and 30, then the 28 with twin turbos and a 35 with twin turbos as well.

I glad BMW made a smart move by introducing the new 1 series with the 28 and 35 engines. That means they will have to increase the power in a couple years on both, if they keep this new 1 series generation alive for 4 or 6 years before moving on to the next 1 series generation. There very well could be a ///M version of this car in a few years time. The media and marketing department is just hyping up their audience by throwing around the ///M word. I would expect a ZHP (performance package) option for sure.

We shall see how it all plays out. I know I'm excited for a revival of a lightweight driver's BMW!

[hector]

[quote=ecoBMW;3101]


I glad BMW made a smart move by introducing the new 1 series with the 28 and 35 engines. That means they will have to increase the power in a couple years on both, if they keep this new 1 series generation alive for 4 or 6 years before moving on to the next 1 series generation. quote]
don't forget that the 1er is a late intro. to the U.S. it's already in actuality at mid-model cycle so i wouldn't be surprised if the models that we get remain unchanged until the redesign in 2011 or so.

[ecoBMW]

hector,

Good point! So the 118i, 120i and 130i were the starter engine options, plus the available diesel engine 120d for this new 1 series in Europe?

[Propagator]

Originally Posted by hector

don't forget that the 1er is a late intro. to the U.S. it's already in actuality at mid-model cycle so i wouldn't be surprised if the models that we get remain unchanged until the redesign in 2011 or so.

That's a good point. We are already 3 years behind Europe in getting the 1. I would expect around 1 year delay for getting the next generation, assuming that the current gen does decently in the US. So the coupe we are getting is likely to be short lived compared to the typical BMW model cycles.

[BForbes]

Thank you BMW for bringing the booost.