[sjlevitas]

I just test drove a 330i w/auto & sp pack. The car was super, but it did not act right on takeoff. The transition from 1st - 2nd gear was not smooth. I kept stopping and starting, because I couldn't believe how sloppy it was. Once it got going it was pure joy, but takeoff was not like a jap car, more like a cheap Korean.

I'm a BMW vet. Wife has X5 and I drive a '98 540ia/sport.

[marcus330i]

Welcome to the board! Show us the pics of your BMers!

[Kao BMW]

When I first got my car on May 29, there was a little hesitation like Rachel's been describing for weeks. Now that I drove about 300 miles now it has gone away. It actually went away at about 200 miles. The car probably needed to learn.

[collinp]

I didn't notice much of a hesitation on the automatic E90s I test drove, though I concede perhaps I didn't drive them hard enough. My new E90 (SG/330i/Steptronic/Sport/Premium) has a bit of an annoying hesitation however.

I spent some time driving around today trying to characterize the behavior. The delay becomes noticeable when hard driving through city blocks with lots of lights and stop signs. Accelerating hard out of a dead or rolling stop often results in a roughly 1/4 to 1/2 second delay and then a lurch of strong power. Accelerating gently out of a stop hides the issue pretty well.

Sport Mode seems to have the strongest lurch. Drive mode exhibits the issue as well, but the smoother gearing of drive mode seems to lessen the lurch. In manual mode I only seemed to be able to cause this behavior by what I would consider improper shifting for an automatic. On a rolling stop, shifting down to M2, then M1, and then rapidly back up to M2 whilst flooring it seems to overload the tranny and cause a similar delay then lurch.

Turning off DSC and DTC (holding the button down for several seconds) seemed to have no significant effect on this issue.

The behavior really seems like an issue with the transmission, not the accelerator / engine. Placing the car in park, tapping the accelerator and listening to the engine demonstrated a very slight delay, perhaps in the range of 1/8 of a second. I also tried tapping the accelerator and listening to engine response while the car was driving in a constant gear in manual mode. This demonstrated a similar small delay. Only the most performance sensitive drivers would likely notice this. This is probably the drive by wire delay that some of the manual folks report.

I've had the BMW for about a week and have put about 400 miles on it, probably 250-300 of which is highway. Some owners report that the car seems to learn their driving style and this issue disappears shortly. So far I have seen no difference except perhaps my ability to adapt to the delay and lurch. Does an adaptive transmission really mean that the car fixes upon your driving style in the first few drives? Some posts on bimmerfest imply that it's more of a constantly adapting algorithm that picks shift tables based on driving data since your last complete stop. Also is Sport mode adaptive? Some of the wording on the BMW site implies that only Drive mode is adaptive.

I've driven an auto Acura for a couple years now and am relatively attuned to the responsiveness of an automatic. The Acura however was not drive by wire and the automatic was comparatively simple (no adaptation or manual modes). Currently my new BMW beats the Acura in every way except the acceleration from stopped.

The drive by wire delay seems to be how these cars work and I can adapt to that just fine. Maybe someday I can even get it chipped. I get the feeling though that my Steptronic is not quite working as expected. I admit I'm driving the car hard, but that's what BMWs are for, right?

- Collin

[RedFireBeemer]

If I'm not mistaken, when the gear shift is left in the normal drive mode, the car actually starts off in second gear from a dead stop, which may be another reason why it hesitates. I know when I have the gearbox in the manual mode and come to a stop, it automatically goes into second gear and stays there until you manually put it into first gear, and if it's left in second gear, thats where it wiill start off from. I think when the gearbox is placed in the sport mode, it will take off in first gear, hence much less hesitation....

[onesixeight]

This is an issue with the new 6 speed transmissions, even my 2 year old 745Li (the first car with 6sp auto box) has this hesitation. The way the adaptive transmission works is it reads the last 40 shifts the transmission makes, except if you push the throttle past a certain point. This point isn't an exact RPM, but it reads the engine load and downshifts accordingly.

In the E65/66 7-series, BMW first programmed the 7 to start in 2nd and even 3rd gear to get better gas mileage ratings and gain better marks to pass EPA emissions. Then, one of the progammings released a software for 1st and 2nd gear starts. Although it may sound like a good thing, it made the car extremely hard to drive. The car would lurch when coming to a stop because the gearing was so low that the torque converter would be fighting against the brake when coming to a stop. And taking off from a stop would be really jerky. The most recent programming uses 2nd gear stops and does a pretty reasonable job or balancing smoothness and driveability with reducing lag.

My problem with my sister's E90 325i is that it has a lot of hesitation in the 1-2 shift and almost feels like a manual car's clutch slipping. The initial throttle tip-in is okay, but I think it's due to the tranny starting in 2nd instead of 1st.

I'm sure with enough complains BMW will do something to reprogram the way the transmission selects the starting gear.

[collinp]

Originally Posted by onesixeight

My problem with my sister's E90 325i is that it has a lot of hesitation in the 1-2 shift and almost feels like a manual car's clutch slipping. The initial throttle tip-in is okay, but I think it's due to the tranny starting in 2nd instead of 1st.

I think that's kind of what I'm experiencing...

Sometimes I get what I would call a solid start. I press the accelerator, there's a tiny delay before the engine revs, then there is a bit of a delay before the car really overcomes its initial momentum and the car pulls away. The response isn't immediate, but you can tell the car is trying to take off. Sport pulls faster and harder and Drive pulls slower and smoother. This to me seems like correct behavior. It's a drive by wire automatic pulling a relatively heavy car so some hesitation here makes sense.

Now about half the time I have an issue. I press the accelerator, there's a tiny delay before the engine revs, then the car just sits there and doesn't seem to move, suddenly something catches, the car lurches and takes off with impressive power. Like you, I'd almost think its a mechanical problem like a slipping clutch, well slipping bands on the planetary or whatever, were it not for the fact that I have a lot of trouble reproducing the issue in manual mode. Therefore it seems more like a software issue in the tranny. Perhaps its something like... tranny forgets to downshift at the last stop so you're up in 3rd or something, you floor the accelerator, the car barely moves, the tranny goes "oh crap!" and slams you into 1st, but by now the engine's reving high and your off like a rocket.

Do any E90 Step owners not have this sort of issue when flooring it from a standstill?

- Collin

[onesixeight]

Originally Posted by collinp

Do any E90 Step owners not have this sort of issue when flooring it from a standstill?

- Collin

Colin,

I have the same problem when flooring it from a start. I didn't try with our car, but I tried it with the dealer demos (330 and 325) and they both have the hesitation even when starting in M1 mode. I'm sort of thinking it's something BMW did to help save gas and pass certain EPA regulations as it needed to do on the 7-series.

When I chipped my X5 4.4i with Dinan software...the first thing I noticed was how much quicker the throttle response was. I could actually chirp my heavy 22" Hartge wheels and the car got up and went much quicker than stock programming. Hopefully BMW will be able to release some factory programming that's able to cure the poor drive by wire throttle response.

-Chris

[greenscape]

Isn't this tranny brand new this year ?

[skimo]

Does anyone with manual tranny have this hesitation issue?

I have a manual 6 speed, and I noticed some "hesitation". But I want to confirm that there really is hesitation and not me being psychologically biased from reading this forum. . I noticed it when I switch gears, I press the gas and engage the clutch. Then only after a delay does the engine rev (but the clutch is already engaged) so the car jerks. So this makes hit hard for me to shift smoothly without thinking about it. To over come this, I actually have to keep my foot on the gas while switching gears (not all the way, but just to keep the engine reving while a switch). But this is not good. Anyone have this? Its my first bimmer so I am not sure what to expect.

Also, someone mentioned on another post that a new software update fixed their hesitation. I tried to find the post again but I forgot who posted it.

Thanks
Skimo

[onesixeight]

Originally Posted by greenscape

Isn't this tranny brand new this year ?

The 6-speed automatic transmission used in the new 3 is based on the same 6sp ZF automatic tranny used in the 5, 6, and 7 series. This transmission was first put into service by the E65/66 7-series.

[LEDZEP]

My car has been in the body shop for the past three weeks, so I'm learning to drive it all over again. Took it for a nice "break-in" style drive over the weekend and the hesitation seemed a bit more pronounced than I remembered... the wife drove it too, and she kept complaining about it. I wonder if that's something they could patch with software? Tomorrow I will be back in my regular commuting mode, so I'll see how it feels then. I just passed 600 miles, so I would think that the learning is over with.

[RachelS]

Try this...
If you have steptronic do this
1. Deactivate DSC by holding in the DTC button in until the "Disable Triangle" appears on the idiot light area. You will notice it in amber.
2. Drive the car in DS mode instead of D mode.

Test it first without the AC on

It is there still? this helped my mom with the car

Ryan

My mom's car has 3200 miles and she says it is still there.

My dad spoke to BMW about this and RedFireBeemer is pretty much right. I think in the next software update, they will change the shift points a bit.

[collinp]

I thought I'd post a little update on this.

I've had my 330i for about 3 weeks and 1400 miles. Thankfully my acceleration hesitation and lurch has become much less pronounced. I think two things have happened. On one hand I have learned the subtlties of the accelerator off the line. On the other hand the car just seems much less likely to pause and lurch. I haven't tried to go and tease out the issue, but I used to be caught by the issue all the time in city driving and that hasn't happened in days. The response is still not instantaneous, but its about what I'd expect for a drive by wire automatic.

- Collin

[collinp]

Yet another update...

My acceleration hesitation has gotten better as the engine has opened up after brake in. I could still reproduce it if I tried, but it generally didn't get in my way. I had also learned to wait a bit longer at stops before trying to accelerate.

Anyway, I brought my car in to get DRLs enabled the other day and mentioned the hesitation to the service department. They checked out the hesitation and said they couldn't find anything wrong or even repro the problem. To enable DRLs however they apparently needed to update my car's firmware. The checkout clerk said that they just upgraded one subsystem, but the work order says they updated the whole car. Anyway, whatever they did seems to have addressed my acceleration hesitation. It really feels like the gearing is different now. I think it downshifts to 1st much quicker. The only way I can reproduce any hesitation now is to brake then floor it while the car is still moving. All autoboxes that I have driven have some point in between gears where its not ideal to accelerate. This is radically different than before where it would literally take several seconds after the car came to a full stop before it was fully downshifted and ready to accelerate without hesitation. Anyway, I'm a happy customer now even if my dealer doesn't think they fixed anything.

- Collin

[onesixeight]

I spoke to the FSE that came down to look at my brake problem about the hesitation. He said it's completely normal and is characteristic of electronic throttle and the car starting in 2nd gear. but be reminded, this is coming from a guy who says the car moving a little after coming to a stop is normal.

[LEDZEP]

Just wondering if people are still experiencing this problem. I have gotten used to my car (acceleration, brakes, etc.) and don't much think about it anymore. But today my wife and I swapped cars, and when I got home she was complaining that she hates the accelerator! That it is so slow to respond (hesitation). One thing to note is that her current car is a Subaru Outback (soon to be replaced by the 325xiT) which has a very sensitive accelerator.

Just curious what others are or are not still experiencing - or have we all just gotten used to it.

[adsam]

I forked out the extra $8k because I knew I was getting the xtra HP and torque and when I took the 330i for a test drive I did notice this delay that everyone talks about.....having done extensive reading on these wonderful boards it seems 2 things are for sure:

1. the car after break in exhibits some improvement

2. and the forthcoming CIP 19.0 software upgrade may address this issue...and it may not..!!....

The fact that I have always wanted a car that once you touch the accelerator you are thrown back into your seat is the reason I got a 330i.....and now I am a little annoyed that I may not get it. !!!....
I placed an order just today and so am wondering if I will get the latest software when car is ready, if BMW are aware of this problem....and finally if the car learns my style and I remain at the limits posted in the manual for the car ( ie revs and speed ) can I also allow the car to learn in SPORT MODE ( steptronic ) or will it only learn in drive ???

Lots of questions and nothing but prayers that this issue is resolved by the time my car arrives and for all e90 owners, especially for those that have forked out extra for the 255HP of the 330i !

[JonnyCrash]

Do you have a manual or automatic? If you have an auto, you'll never have the instant throttle response you crave. It's a matter of the transmission not working that way: I don't think any software will fix it. If you have a manual, then this is a problem, and I would be mad as heck; I've driven a couple of 330i cars now, and while I haven't been thrown back in my seat, it has had good throttle response.

Originally Posted by adsam

I forked out the extra $8k because I knew I was getting the xtra HP and torque and when I took the 330i for a test drive I did notice this delay that everyone talks about.....having done extensive reading on these wonderful boards it seems 2 things are for sure:

1. the car after break in exhibits some improvement

2. and the forthcoming CIP 19.0 software upgrade may address this issue...and it may not..!!....

The fact that I have always wanted a car that once you touch the accelerator you are thrown back into your seat is the reason I got a 330i.....and now I am a little annoyed that I may not get it. !!!....
I placed an order just today and so am wondering if I will get the latest software when car is ready, if BMW are aware of this problem....and finally if the car learns my style and I remain at the limits posted in the manual for the car ( ie revs and speed ) can I also allow the car to learn in SPORT MODE ( steptronic ) or will it only learn in drive ???

Lots of questions and nothing but prayers that this issue is resolved by the time my car arrives and for all e90 owners, especially for those that have forked out extra for the 255HP of the 330i !

[collinp]

Originally Posted by adsam

I forked out the extra $8k because I knew I was getting the xtra HP and torque and when I took the 330i for a test drive I did notice this delay that everyone talks about.....having done extensive reading on these wonderful boards it seems 2 things are for sure:

1. the car after break in exhibits some improvement

2. and the forthcoming CIP 19.0 software upgrade may address this issue...and it may not..!!....

The fact that I have always wanted a car that once you touch the accelerator you are thrown back into your seat is the reason I got a 330i.....and now I am a little annoyed that I may not get it. !!!....
I placed an order just today and so am wondering if I will get the latest software when car is ready, if BMW are aware of this problem....and finally if the car learns my style and I remain at the limits posted in the manual for the car ( ie revs and speed ) can I also allow the car to learn in SPORT MODE ( steptronic ) or will it only learn in drive ???

Lots of questions and nothing but prayers that this issue is resolved by the time my car arrives and for all e90 owners, especially for those that have forked out extra for the 255HP of the 330i !

Oh, the whole "the car learns your driving style after the first few hundred miles" stuff is a bunch of bunk. The adaptive transmission means that it picks shift patterns based on your current driving style (say the last 40 or so shifts). The effect is very subtle, its perceptible in D. I "think" I feel it in DS, but it's hard to say.

My car still exhibits this lag issue to a certain extent. The core of the issue is that if the transmission is in the middle of downshifting and receives an input that it needs to upshift (say because you hit the accelerator) it takes some time to sort things out. You press the accelerator more because nothing is happening and then when the tranny finally settles on a gear, you're off like a rocket. Over time you adjust to how the car works and learn to ease the accelerator in these situations. Luckily if you want a spirited driving experience you can use manual mode. Manual mode can theoretically exhibit this same issue, but in reality you won't run in to it because you're in control of the gears. I think you will find that manual mode gives you a pretty satisfying "thrown back in your seat" feeling.

I'll concede that this issue is a bit disappointing. I've owned several automatics over the years (a few Toyotas, an Acura, and a couple Audis) and never ran into this sort of behavior. Yet paradoxically, I still feel that this is the greatest car I've ever owned. Go figure.

- Collin

[ZBMW]

I've only had my 335i mt two days but I noticed that when I shift and engage then floor it, there is hesitation. It's not turbo lag because the engine is around 3 or 4k rpms. Also, the accelerator is very responsive when small inputs are done.
My previous ride was a 350Z which also has an electronic accelerator and I did not get this. It might be just a matter of breakin but I'm taking it in anyway because it feels more like an electronics problem.

[GTownUDM]

Originally Posted by RachelS

I love the car - but the tranny sucks. Anyway a friend of mine went from BMW to Mercedes because of all his tranny problems

Not sure that is a good move. My MB had to have the transmission replaced after 6k miles.

I DID notice the hesitation with my coupe. I only have 200 miles on it but I think it is almost gone now.