BMW 1 Series Coupe Forum / 1 Series Convertible Forum (1M / tii / 135i / 128i / Coupe / Cabrio / Hatchback) (BMW E82 E88 128i 130i 135i)
 





 

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      02-29-2008, 08:36 AM   #111
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Originally Posted by larryn View Post
I am glad I did a home equity line on this one. Pay off in a few years, deduct the interest, and lower interest rate.
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There is no doubt that I will purchase the car :biggrin:
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      02-29-2008, 09:21 AM   #112
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Sorry, but you guys are killing me!

The dollar is in the dumper, BMW can't give away cars because some of you have gotten toooo comfortable with the low monthly payments of a lease. This is not a entry level car like the 318ti, it's $40k+

:biggrin:
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      02-29-2008, 09:50 AM   #113
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I'm sure glad we have a bunch of know it alls around here....
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      02-29-2008, 09:28 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by NJKSC27 View Post
yes plus tax, fees, and firsts month....more like 600
2007 Mcoupe
$564/month out the door. $3K down. 36months, 12K/month. MSRP was $56K.

Or you could have bought the same car for $45K. Yes, a $55K Mcoupe for $45K out the door.
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      02-29-2008, 09:32 PM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chriskurn View Post
Sorry, but you guys are killing me!

The dollar is in the dumper, BMW can't give away cars because some of you have gotten toooo comfortable with the low monthly payments of a lease. This is not a entry level car like the 318ti, it's $40k+

:biggrin:
Actually it is an entry level car for BMW. The problem with most is that some feel BMW is overcharging for this lease compared to other BMW models which cost more.

The dollar being low affects all BMW models and not just the 135.

BMW thing it can make money on this car in the initial offering. I bet the lease rates drop significantly in the following model years.
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      02-29-2008, 09:39 PM   #116
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I'm sure glad we have a bunch of know it alls around here....
I'm not saying I have all the answers.
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      02-29-2008, 09:43 PM   #117
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[quote=silversprint;72890]Actually it is an entry level car for BMW. The problem with most is that some feel BMW is overcharging for this lease compared to other BMW models which cost more.

The dollar being low affects all BMW models and not just the 135.

True...I also agree that BMW is overcharging for the lease, but I also didn't expect BMW to give the car away given that it's brand new.


I think the wait for my car is making me crazy! :eyebulge:
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      02-29-2008, 09:48 PM   #118
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How can a 135i be $600+/mo. to lease when you can get an Inifiniti G35 for $349/mo. with $3K down? Am I missing something? :iono:
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      02-29-2008, 10:01 PM   #119
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Originally Posted by mjovic View Post
How can a 135i be $600+/mo. to lease when you can get an Inifiniti G35 for $349/mo. with $3K down? Am I missing something? :iono:
Residuals, MF, and dealer kickbacks. The G35 has 'em, the 135i doesn't.
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      02-29-2008, 10:12 PM   #120
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Originally Posted by MPower View Post
Residuals, MF, and dealer kickbacks. The G35 has 'em, the 135i doesn't.
the only thing on the G35 sedan right now is 500 cash back for previous customers of Infiniti Financial.

these cars are so cheap right now cause the market is forcing dealers to sell cars below invoice into hold back.....even 3 series.
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      02-29-2008, 10:14 PM   #121
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Originally Posted by mjovic View Post
How can a 135i be $600+/mo. to lease when you can get an Inifiniti G35 for $349/mo. with $3K down? Am I missing something? :iono:
Its an Infiniti. I'm not trying to insult Infiniti, they make great cars, but in terms of brand value and US market share, Infiniti is on the low end of the luxury market.

The G35 is the Infiniti equivalent to the 3-series, so it really makes more sense to compare it to the lease deals for say the 328.
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      02-29-2008, 10:22 PM   #122
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Originally Posted by NJKSC27 View Post
the only thing on the G35 sedan right now is 500 cash back for previous customers of Infiniti Financial.
No, no, no... I mean that the dealership gets paid by Infiniti to lease the G35 even at invoice. BMW does the same thing for the 3ers (hence one of the reasons why 3er lease deals are better than the 1ers). Think of it as a subsidy given by Infiniti to its dealers for shifting units off the lot.

What does that mean? It means that dealership is willing to sell cars below MSRP without worrying about their profits.
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      02-29-2008, 10:25 PM   #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPower View Post
No, no, no... I mean that the dealership gets paid by Infiniti to lease the G35 even at invoice. BMW does the same thing for the 3ers (hence one of the reasons why 3er lease deals are better than the 1ers). Think of it as a subsidy given by Infiniti to its dealers for shifting units off the lot.

What does that mean? It means that dealership is willing to sell cars below MSRP without worrying about their profits.
oh yes of course

the incentives are outrageous
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      03-01-2008, 02:35 AM   #124
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Quote:
The G35 is the Infiniti equivalent to the 3-series, so it really makes more sense to compare it to the lease deals for say the 328.
Uh, no. It is comparable to the 335i, that is its market competition. If there were a G25, then I would agree that the 328 is the comparison.

Quote:
I'm not saying I have all the answers.
That's funny, how did you know you were one of the people I was referencing?

I'm glad so many people had all this foresight AFTER the lease residuals were released. I expected higher than normal, and took it for what its worth. I think that the top out price for the 135i is around $43K-$45K depending on exact options, which is where the 335i lease starts. So for all intensive purposes, I figured the lease rate would be within $50 to $100 a month of that to be fair. Now suddenly, the rates are out and my $100 top end is not close (we're talking $240 per month difference between the 1 and 3 at the same price point).
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      03-01-2008, 07:00 AM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjovic View Post
How can a 135i be $600+/mo. to lease when you can get an Inifiniti G35 for $349/mo. with $3K down? Am I missing something? :iono:

YES....you are missing the point that Infinity (Nissan) is writing down the cost of the car OUT OF THEIR POCKET.

The cost of money is the cost of money. BMW is setting the residual value.

BMW is not charging a Money Factor greater than the interest rate and BMW is setting a reasonable residual value. This ='s the lease rate.

To get the 135i to a lower lease rate BMW can only do 3 things.

1. Decrease the money factor (which loses them money)
2. Increase the residual (which loses them money)
3. Decrease the cost of the car (which loses them money)

The 135i is a low margin car for BMW (this is well stated all over the media and by BMW itself), so if they do any of the above 3 to reduce the lease payment then they will LOSE MONEY on the sale of the cars.

The reason the 135i is a low margin car is one of three factors:

1. Production cost. Somewhere "we 1 Series fans" think it's cheaper to make than the 3 series even though most of the car is a 3 series

2. Lower price point to attract new market segment

3. Weak US Dollar

Seriously this car is roughly 6K cheaper than a 3 Series (option for option). It's mostly a 3 Series car and made at the same plant. Does it not stand to reason that 6K is PROFIT on a 3 Series and thus the 6K lower cost on car is gives BMW WAY LESS room to play with profit numbers on the 1 Series.

QUESTION: Do some Car Manufactures lose money on car sales?

YES...when they have to keep production up or have too many of a model on the lot. They will sell at cost or slight loss to move cars.

Now,there are only 8000-10000 1's coming to the US and very few of them will be 135's. Followed by ALL of the 1's coming in seem to be pre-ordered filled. (hell they are getting sticker plus in certain markets)

What makes anyone think that BMW will offer incentivized deals (at the cost of profit to BMW) NOW or in the next year or next or next.

Unless the production increases dramatically, the demand goes down and the US dollar get closer to the EURO there isn't going to be "cheap " 1 Series leases.

Even if the demand goes down they will lower US production numbers, not GIVE CARS AWAY so the pissed off "cheap lease guys" get a better deal.

SORRY

Now, the Fed continuing to lower rates will have an effect on the money factor over time. If the cars hold there resale values this will also increase the residual values over time. Both of these will effect the lease rates. The residuals could go lower and then you would have a negative effect and actually increase lease rates.


Either way, if you are price shopping a payment the 335i is a better deal (BMW has more to play with in this car and is incentivizing it threw more attractive lease rates) or some other car companies offering.
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      03-01-2008, 07:19 AM   #126
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002s - you made some good points in that post.

Ford found themselves in a bit of a pickle a few years back, they had fixed costs for producing Mercury Cougars in the Flat Rock plant that they couldn't get out of. They lost less money by building and then selling the Cougars at a steep discount than they would have lost by not building them at all. It's a crazy mixed up world.
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      03-01-2008, 07:38 AM   #127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atr_hugo View Post
002s - you made some good points in that post.

Ford found themselves in a bit of a pickle a few years back, they had fixed costs for producing Mercury Cougars in the Flat Rock plant that they couldn't get out of. They lost less money by building and then selling the Cougars at a steep discount than they would have lost by not building them at all. It's a crazy mixed up world.
Exactly. The cost to keep a plant idle is sometimes more than selling the product for a loss. This is why plants close and companies go out of business unless they can increase price or lower cost (HELLO CHINA....:wink

The funny part of this thread is "some" believe than BMW has a master plan to screw the "cheap lease guy" when they see cars costing $$$$$ more leasing for MUCH LESS. This isn't how financing works or what BMW is doing.
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      03-14-2008, 12:55 PM   #128
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For canadian folks

Went to a dealer last night, got those prices. Please note the 'horrible' lease and finance rate.

128i
Sport Package
Sunroof
USB Integration
Metallic Paint
Leasing on 48mo: 550$ with 10 000$ cash down (7.5% / yr)
Financing on 60mo: 729$ with 10 000$ cash down (8.5% / yr)

135i
M Sport Package
Sunroof
USB Integration
Metallic Paint
Leasing on 48mo: 712$ with 10 000$ cash down (7.5%)
Financing on 60mo: 882$ with 10 000$ cash down (8.5%)

The rates are horrible, not to mention the fact that the 1 serie price will NOT be adjusted with the CDN$ rate.

128i base MSRP in Canada: 33 900 CDN$ (34 346 US$ using current rate)
128i base MSRP in US: 28 211 CDN$ (28 600 US$)
So Canadians are getting screwed by more than 5000$ for the same exact car.

135i base MSRP in Canada: 41 700 CDN$ (42 240 US$)
135i base MSRP in US: 34 400 CDN$ (34 900 US$)
So Canadians are getting raped by more than 6000$ for the same exact car.

Even worse, handling & shipping is 2195$ in Canada. 750$ in the US.

So overall, for Canadians, expect to pay between 6000-7000$ more, just because we live about 100km too far away from US borders (I'm in Vancouver). + terrible % rate.

What is BMW trying to accomplish with those numbers?
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      03-15-2008, 01:59 PM   #129
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People keep claiming that you shouldn't make a large, if any, DP if you are getting into a lease. This is true if you don't intend to keep the car. If you buy the car at the end of the lease, you end up paying for the car for the came length of time (5 -6 yrs), the payments are lower throughout and you only pay slightly more due to the taxes. More importantly you don't lose the DP.
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      05-15-2008, 12:39 PM   #130
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.0031 = about 7.44% . Just a little high for me.
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