My DIY Charge Pipe Projects Pictures

[Si-M240i]

For those that requested pictures of what I did, here they are. This set up seems to have improved still further over the a couple of days driving. definately feels better then the Riss Racing set up I had before.

[escobar929]

hmmm the only negative if you should have used a black samco hose

[Si-M240i]

Originally Posted by escobar929

hmmm the only negative if you should have used a black samco hose

Yeah, I know. I needed to get it done before it went in for it's service and the "black" pipe was special order so wold take a while for me to get one. I will order a Black one at a later date and then it will be as I wanted in the first place.

This is a very easy DIY mod and I would recommend it to anyone who wants quicker throttle response and a stronger pull lower down the rev band.

It takes out all the weak points of the stock system and leaves in the sound generator to keep a nicer sound to the engine.

1) As you can see the Samo pipe is far less restictive and more ridged.
2) The valve are far better (I used the strongest springs).
3) The shape inside the pipe at the throttle body end is far more "Progressive" and "smooth" where the size changes than the Riss one I had which is more of a "step" where the size goes from small to large.
4) With a few bits of plastic swarf cut out the inside of the standard pipe I recon it is better flowing than the Riss one.
5) The pipes that recirculate the turbo pressure are very smooth inside too, so that, must have some benefit too, I guess.

I also replaced the TMAP sensor "O" ring and the large "O" ring at the throttle body fitting. I also "squeezed" the spring clamp closed a little to make it tighter when securingt he charge pipe to the throttle body.

No leaks yet, its working really well and nothing was said at the service either

[Bullitt]

I'd recommend using a softer spring (or softest) on stock boost levels. Since the strongest spring is for holding much higher boost, the valve will not open and vent charged air properly. This can cause compressor surge, which places unnecessary stress on the turbos and create accelerated premature wear on its bearings.

Originally Posted by Si-135i

I also replaced the TMAP sensor "O" ring...

Need specs of this replacement O-ring, please.

[Si-M240i]

Originally Posted by Bullitt

I'd recommend using a softer spring (or softest) on stock boost levels. Since the strongest spring is for holding much higher boost, the valve will not open and vent charged air properly. This can cause compressor surge, which places unnecessary stress on the turbos and create accelerated premature wear on its bearings.



Need specs of this replacement O-ring, please.

I didn't get an exact match for the TMAP sensor "O" ring, but if anything it is better as it fit the groove in the Sensor better and is slightly tighter when inserted into the Charge pipe.

it's Cross section is 2.68mm (I think) if not its the closest to that as the one below is 1.78 and the one above is 3)) and the External Diameter is about 12.5mm, so the internal Diameter is approx 12mm minus 5.36 so approx 7.14.......
Sorry I can't be any more exact, but a got a few different sizes and one of them was a very good fit and I used that one.

The Cross section sizes are standard so with the above you CAN get that right.
If you deduct twice the Cross section size from 12.5mm it will give you the Internal Diameter to quote as "O" rings are done on I/D measurments and not E/D. You will notice this one will be a little "thicker" then the green one that was originally fitted, but it is a very good fit. Make sure you smear a little silicone greese on it first and twist it gently whilst you push it in.
Also, make sure you order a Ultra High Temp VITON one.

With regard to DV springs, I have the Medium ones fitted on my Riss Racing ones and the middle ones o the Forge were much softer than these. When I fitted the firmest ones, they still seemed to require slightly less vacumm / pressure to release them but the operation was much smoother with the Forge ones. After I fitted them I tested then by removing one vacumm line at a time and putting it on and off the valve a few times and could hear the valve fully opening each time at idle, so I am sure these springs are ok, unless you can inform me otherwise and I am not understanding the operation of them fully ?

I will be getting the BMW performance upgrade in 2-3 months which will run slightly higher boost, so would like to leave these springs in if at all possible. I obviously do NOT want to have any compressor stool, but only know they way I checked to see if that was likely to happen.

Please let me know if I have got it all wrong

[BoostedCosta]

nice!

[Bullitt]

Originally Posted by Si-135i

I didn't get an exact match for the TMAP sensor "O" ring, but if anything it is better as it fit the groove in the Sensor better and is slightly tighter when inserted into the Charge pipe.

it's Cross section is 2.68mm (I think) if not its the closest to that as the one below is 1.78 and the one above is 3)) and the External Diameter is about 12.5mm, so the internal Diameter is approx 12mm minus 5.36 so approx 7.14.......
Sorry I can't be any more exact, but a got a few different sizes and one of them was a very good fit and I used that one.

The Cross section sizes are standard so with the above you CAN get that right.
If you deduct twice the Cross section size from 12.5mm it will give you the Internal Diameter to quote as "O" rings are done on I/D measurments and not E/D. You will notice this one will be a little "thicker" then the green one that was originally fitted, but it is a very good fit. Make sure you smear a little silicone greese on it first and twist it gently whilst you push it in.
Also, make sure you order a Ultra High Temp VITON one.

Thanks for this.

Originally Posted by Si-135i

With regard to DV springs, I have the Medium ones fitted on my Riss Racing ones and the middle ones o the Forge were much softer than these. When I fitted the firmest ones, they still seemed to require slightly less vacumm / pressure to release them but the operation was much smoother with the Forge ones. After I fitted them I tested then by removing one vacumm line at a time and putting it on and off the valve a few times and could hear the valve fully opening each time at idle, so I am sure these springs are ok, unless you can inform me otherwise and I am not understanding the operation of them fully ?

I will be getting the BMW performance upgrade in 2-3 months which will run slightly higher boost, so would like to leave these springs in if at all possible. I obviously do NOT want to have any compressor stool, but only know they way I checked to see if that was likely to happen.

Please let me know if I have got it all wrong

This is just a guess, but the springs in the RR valves may 'feel' stiffer because they are cylindrical and do not compress as much as the Forge, which I believe are conical and thereby allowing for greater piston travel within the valve.

At any rate, the way you tested the valves by unplugging the vacuum lines will not reveal if boost is being released properly because this must be done under engine load. One of the easiest ways to check if your valves have the proper spring tension is with a boost gauge. Boost behavior should be checked during WOT and after the release of the throttle. The boost needle should not display a rapid oscillation or spike in the positive direction at throttle lift.

It's important to use springs that are soft enough for releasing boost. Otherwise, if the spring is too stiff, the valve will not open as it should for boost to escape completely. Try using a softer spring, and check its behavior with a boost gauge. If boost maxes out as it did before under WOT with the stiffer spring, you are good to leave the softer one in.

It's probably fine to leave the stiffer springs in there over a short period of time, but what's a few minutes to swap out the springs?

[Si-M240i]

Originally Posted by Bullitt

Thanks for this.


This is just a guess, but the springs in the RR valves may 'feel' stiffer because they are cylindrical and do not compress as much as the Forge, which I believe are conical and thereby allowing for greater piston travel within the valve.

At any rate, the way you tested the valves by unplugging the vacuum lines will not reveal if boost is being released properly because this must be done under engine load. One of the easiest ways to check if your valves have the proper spring tension is with a boost gauge. Boost behavior should be checked during WOT and after the release of the throttle. The boost needle should not display a rapid oscillation or spike in the positive direction at throttle lift.

It's important to use springs that are soft enough for releasing boost. Otherwise, if the spring is too stiff, the valve will not open as it should for boost to escape completely. Try using a softer spring, and check its behavior with a boost gauge. If boost maxes out as it did before under WOT with the stiffer spring, you are good to leave the softer one in.

It's probably fine to leave the stiffer springs in there over a short period of time, but what's a few minutes to swap out the springs?

Cheers for the info.

I don't have a boost gauge or access to one or a BT Scanner.
The spings are not conical in the forge, they are the same type as the Riss ones. I also tested by sucking on each valve and the forge ones still "felt" easier to operate than the Riss ones before I fitted them to the car.

How else could I tell ?

What If I removed the pipe from the valve for a few minutes and drove the car and listened for it "dumping" atmospherically ? Would it harm have the open ends of the pipes ?

I really don't want to damage my turbo's, but I wasn't that happy with how well the forge valves would seal with weaker springs as they operate backwards and have no rubber seal in the seating of the valve.

[Bullitt]

Originally Posted by Si-135i

Cheers for the info.

I don't have a boost gauge or access to one or a BT Scanner.
The spings are not conical in the forge, they are the same type as the Riss ones. I also tested by sucking on each valve and the forge ones still "felt" easier to operate than the Riss ones before I fitted them to the car.

How else could I tell ?

What If I removed the pipe from the valve for a few minutes and drove the car and listened for it "dumping" atmospherically ? Would it harm have the open ends of the pipes ?

I really don't want to damage my turbo's, but I wasn't that happy with how well the forge valves would seal with weaker springs as they operate backwards and have no rubber seal in the seating of the valve.

A boost gauge would be highly recommended. A cheap one can be obtained for under $30. Installing is easy as well since boost tubing can be routed from the hood and directly through the front window. No need to feed the line through the firewall for a simple test.

Just listening for the venting sound isn't the precise way to test. You have to hear for a fluttering sound, which may or may not be heard with the dual diverter valves. It would probably be easier to detect if it was a larger single BOV. I can't say if disconnecting the pipes is okay. It probably is, but make sure to cap off the holes where they would connect. My vote is strong for a boost gauge.

[jmunro]

What's the diameter of the charge pipe?

[Si-M240i]

Originally Posted by jmunro

What's the diameter of the charge pipe?

I had another post on this when I was building it with pictures showing it at various stages. On that one I listed the exact "Samco" part with the size included. As I can't remember off the top of my head, you should be able to find it in a search.

On another note, I had the BMW performace pack fitted last week and in that the Charge pipe is replaced with an uprated one. The BMT Technician left my own modified on on as it was still better than the upgrade one. The difference between the standard and upgrade pipe was that the bit I replaced with the SAMCO part was changed to hard plastic, but as they has to add some flex in it to allow for any movement they had to do a bit like the bellows on a squeeze box and that was more restricive then my mod.