TC Kline, Vorshlag, Kosei K1, Z1's and 38 lbs. of unsprung weight...

[aisthetes]

Originally Posted by MINI135i

Here is my start point for the track, and with a smooth surfaced local track I don't vary too much at all from the start point:

REAR:
Near full stiff rebound
Near full stiff compression

FRONT:
Near full stiff rebound
Half stiff compression

With Autocross I tend to adjust a bit more, depending grip levels and surface smoothness:

I use the rebound to balance the grip of the car whether it be front or rear bias. It is nice to be able to adjust with the twist of a knob. I like to keep the rebound as high as grip limits allow for good slalom transitions, however compromise is the name of the game depending on the course that is set up for the day.

The rougher the surface the more I dial down the compression to avoid "skipping the tires" over bumps and thus loosing grip.

Nothing really new or ground breaking here. Most of my AX National Champion buddies kinda suggest same thing, they just drive a tiny, tiny bit faster though

Sounds reasonable. I agree on the rebound settings being key in in the setup, with compression dictated by track conditions. I love this thread, because I plan on the same coilover and camber plate setup, plus M3 suspension parts, so your feedback is well received and much appreciated.

I know you mentioned you're an avid autocrosser, but have you tried this setup on a road course? We have some fast tracks here on the West coast where high speed sweepers demand a neutral handling car to be quick. I'm wondering with your large F-R spring rate spread and full stiff rear suspension settings if the rear end would be planted at 100mph in a right hand turn, or be loose. Check J Tyler's vids at Buttonwillow to see how loose the 1 can get on one of these tracks. With my factory setup, it's rock solid at speed, but it's not stiff enough and certainly gives up the tight cornering bias advantage you have in auto-x. There, I'm fighting understeer with no camber adjustment.

[MINI135i]

I would expect those settings to work well in a 100 mph sweeper but I would have to try it and see how it feels before I'd make any final judgments.

We have a fast uphill compression turn (turn #7) here at High Plains Raceway http://www.highplainsraceway.com/ima...map-large3.gif where we hold about 80 mph if I recall. One has to stay on the accelerator all the way through or things get ugly. The car does fine through turn #7 but there is a "less than set" feeling present in the rear with the stock rear bushings. I really think the M3 bushings are going to make the car feel more planted on the track. If you watch the video (which starts on the back straight between #3 and #4) I posted earlier in this thread http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQ8x6k-zYJI you can hear all four tires squealing through turn #7 as the car compresses and moves sideways/forward. Everything holds well through the whole turn though. Back end does come out on #8, but that is a very slow turn and I am hard on the accelerator making it swing around.

The car can touch 140 mph indicated (speedo is probably 5-7 mph fast at that speed) on the back straight but braking gets aggressive going into turn #4 and one tries to carry as much speed through #4 as possible, making the whole #4,#5 complex very challenging to get just right. Not sure how fast we go through #4 but it is more of a kink and not a sweeper anyway.

I have driven a lot of different cars and this set up on the 135i is really quite manageable on the track.

[bradford]

Originally Posted by MINI135i

Had my BMW dealership do it for me....

BTW what was their reaction when you asked about this? Did you discuss warranty concerns at all?

[aisthetes]

Great vids!

High Plain's track map reminds me of Willow Springs - very high speed, indeed. Your car looked well planted, no question. I'm on the same Star Specs, but otherwise stock, so I know you're pushing it by the squealing! I too notice the rear suspension "wobble" from the stock subframe bushing, where you just have to trust that the car will grip, which it does, but it's not very confidence inspiring. It'll be the first to go when I get into mine.

Your Youtube vid notes that you're running aftermarket brake pads as well. Which ones, and do you run them full time or swap?

[m3bs]

Still running 235/40-17 all around?

[MINI135i]

Suspension never seems to be an issue with my dealership or any that I know of. I think they realize the suspension is just a bolt on that is completely reversible and doesn't cause any engine issues.

Hawk HT-10's with Motul RBF 600. HT-10's only for track.

Yep still running 235/40/17 Z1's on all four corners. Apex 18x9.5 et 62 are on the way, 275 or 285 on the rear should be feasible!

[bradford]

Originally Posted by MINI135i

400/800 should be nice for the track and manageable on the street.

I might go into the 800 range also as things progress.

Did you ever go to the higher spring rates, Mini?

I'm monitoring your progress because I'd like to try to stick with the stock rear bar too. After having a very stiff bar in the rear of Audis that I've owned in the past, I'm well-versed in the ill effects of the e-differential systems and big rear ARBs.

I'm still leaning towards 400/800 or maybe even 400/850ish to account for the lack of stiffer rear bar...

[MINI135i]

Have not changed the spring rates yet.

I really think the 400/800 range is going to be great for the car with the M3 rear bushings. I would not hesitate if I were you.

I am going to be testing the new Apex wheels with the Dunlop Z1 275's on the rear soon (once warm weather returns). Want to see how the current spring set up feels with the added tire width. Then probably more spring after that.

I am tempted to put a 245/285 V710 R-compound set up on the new Apex wheels but that will have to come later when I get another set

I agree with not messing with the rear bar. I have always found it is very problematic with putting down power if you bulk up that rear bar. Autocross simply won't allow it. Track can be more forgiving in that arena depending on set up but with a good spring and adjustable shocks in the rear I still find no need for a bigger rear bar on the track.

[MINI135i]

Well Frankenstein does live!!! (autocross / track set up only, so not looking for street beauty here, so please refrain ).

Got the rear 18x9.5 et62 APEX wheels and shod them with a 275/35/18 Dunlop Z1 (48 lbs. total, full tread). I can't say enough GOOD about this wheel. APEX has literally made the perfect wheel for the 135i...A big thank you!!

Now for most, just purchase the front APEX wheel that matches, use camber plates and you are good to run a 255/35/18 up front.

I, on the other hand, had a bunch of 17x8.5 et40 Kosei K1's, so I thought I would put them to good use. After some comparison with other Dunlop Z1 255's on an 8.5 wheel I realized that the 245 on an 8.5 wheel is basically the same width due to the fact a 255 needs to be on a 9 inch wheel to take advantage of the extra rubber width.

With this known, I thought I'd save some bucks keeping it 17 inch up front. So now I am running a Dunlop Z1 245/40/17 on the Kosei 17x8.5 et40 with near 3 degrees negative camber up front. The total diameter is 24.7 inches compared to the 255 which is 25 inches. The Kosei set up weighs 44 lbs full tread with the 245's.

Firmed up the dampers and went out for a test drive and the grip is phenomenal!! The grip is huge compared to the 235 set up! I can put power down like never before.

With the new rear M3 bushings, super grip from the HUGE tires, good camber up front, adjustable coilovers and big front bar, this baby is really feeling like it should!! The rear end just "sets" into a corner like never before, surely a combination of the big tires and M3 bushings.

I should be autocrossing this month if weather holds out to put it to the real test, but it is nothing short of amazing right now! Took a crappy cell phone picture so you can see the beast:

[bradford]

Nice.

I am DYING to get my car reworked but I'm trying to wait til the weather turns.

I've got four Apex wheels in boxes sitting 2 feet from me, Nitto NT-01s waiting at the shop, the full M3 conversion on the way from HPA, and I just need to pull the trigger on some coilovers.

I suspect I am going to be one giddy mofo when this stuff gets on the car. =)

[Eddy@ApexWheels]

Sweet!

I've been coming into this thread for months just checking things out, and what do I see today? Apex wheels on the back of your 1 series!

It's nice getting 275's back there huh?

Function over Form, is where it's at!

Originally Posted by MINI135i

Well Frankenstein does live!!! (autocross / track set up only, so not looking for street beauty here, so please refrain ).

Got the rear 18x9.5 et62 APEX wheels and shod them with a 275/35/18 Dunlop Z1 (48 lbs. total). I can't say enough GOOD about this wheel. APEX has literally made the perfect wheel for the 135i...A big thank you!!

Now for most, just purchase the front APEX wheel that matches, use camber plates and you are good to run a 255/35/18 up front.

I, on the other hand, had a bunch of 17x8.5 et40 Kosei K1's, so I thought I would put them to good use. After some comparison with other Dunlop Z1 255's on an 8.5 wheel I realized that the 245 on an 8.5 wheel is basically the same width due to the fact a 255 needs to be on a 9 inch wheel to take advantage of the extra rubber width.

With this known, I thought I'd save some bucks keeping it 17 inch up front. So now I am running a Dunlop Z1 245/40/17 on the Kosei 17x8.5 et40 with near 3 degrees negative camber up front. The total diameter is 24.7 compared to the 255 which is 25 inches. The Kosei set up weighs 44 lbs with the 245's.

Firmed up the dampers and went out for a test drive and the grip is phenomenal!! The grip is huge compared to the 235 set up! I can put power down like never before.

With the new rear M3 bushings, super grip from the HUGE tires, good camber up front, adjustable coilovers and big front bar, this baby is really feeling like it should!! The rear end just "sets" into a corner like never before, surely a combination of the big tires and M3 bushings.

I should be autocrossing this month if weather holds out to put it to the real test, but it is nothing short of amazing right now! Took a crappy cell phone picture so you can see the beast:

[m3bs]

If you get a chance, check your front tire-to-strut clearance. With my 235/Kosei setup, I'm at about 1mm with the Cross coilovers.

[MINI135i]

Originally Posted by m3bs

If you get a chance, check your front tire-to-strut clearance. With my 235/Kosei setup, I'm at about 1mm with the Cross coilovers.

I have a few mm of clearance with the TC Kline strut with the 245's. No spacers were used, the Kosei's are just bolt up. Without negative camber they would rub on inner the lip and plastic tab of the fender upon hard compression. I am pretty sure I should be able to back off to 1.8 degrees negative when needed and still be fine.
The full tread Dunlop Z1 235's needed a little negative camber too so they would not rub under hard compression and they ran at 1.8 degrees negative no problem.

Here is a picture of the 245's:

[RaceTime]

Originally Posted by MINI135i

Well Frankenstein does live!!! (autocross / track set up only, so not looking for street beauty here, so please refrain ).

Got the rear 18x9.5 et62 APEX wheels and shod them with a 275/35/18 Dunlop Z1 (48 lbs. total, full tread). I can't say enough GOOD about this wheel. APEX has literally made the perfect wheel for the 135i...A big thank you!!

Now for most, just purchase the front APEX wheel that matches, use camber plates and you are good to run a 255/35/18 up front.

I, on the other hand, had a bunch of 17x8.5 et40 Kosei K1's, so I thought I would put them to good use. After some comparison with other Dunlop Z1 255's on an 8.5 wheel I realized that the 245 on an 8.5 wheel is basically the same width due to the fact a 255 needs to be on a 9 inch wheel to take advantage of the extra rubber width.

With this known, I thought I'd save some bucks keeping it 17 inch up front. So now I am running a Dunlop Z1 245/40/17 on the Kosei 17x8.5 et40 with near 3 degrees negative camber up front. The total diameter is 24.7 inches compared to the 255 which is 25 inches. The Kosei set up weighs 44 lbs full tread with the 245's.

Firmed up the dampers and went out for a test drive and the grip is phenomenal!! The grip is huge compared to the 235 set up! I can put power down like never before.

With the new rear M3 bushings, super grip from the HUGE tires, good camber up front, adjustable coilovers and big front bar, this baby is really feeling like it should!! The rear end just "sets" into a corner like never before, surely a combination of the big tires and M3 bushings.

I should be autocrossing this month if weather holds out to put it to the real test, but it is nothing short of amazing right now! Took a crappy cell phone picture so you can see the beast:

NICELY DONE! Hmmm... this season will be a good one. Did you know that Mark Baer has put together one of the lightweight M3's on 285's for BSP this year?

I am tempted to put on the M3 rear bushings and a H&R rear sway at the same time... It sounds like the rear bushings are a must, huh?

I did take a sawsall to the muffler and just put back 2 mandrel bends and out the rear bumper. It is a good way to lose around 35 pounds over the rear axel. I dont think it will be too loud...we will have to see at the event for sound check.

[larryn]

Awesome writeup! Now I can't wait to get mine out there. Roads are so sandy here, that even on good days, it's tough to push it. However, on the occasions since I've done the 255/275 setup, and it was a clear on ramp, holy moly, that thing does corner.

[MINI135i]

Originally Posted by RaceTime

NICELY DONE! Hmmm... this season will be a good one. Did you know that Mark Baer has put together one of the lightweight M3's on 285's for BSP this year?

I am tempted to put on the M3 rear bushings and a H&R rear sway at the same time... It sounds like the rear bushings are a must, huh?


I did take a sawsall to the muffler and just put back 2 mandrel bends and out the rear bumper. It is a good way to lose around 35 pounds over the rear axel. I dont think it will be too loud...we will have to see at the event for sound check.

Oh good, I am glad Mark is moving that very fast M3 out of STU this year, it will make my life easier He was the only BMW that trophied in STU at Nationals which was cool. My goal is to try to put the 135i in the STU trophies, however my schedule has not allowed National attendance the last couple of years, hopefully I'll get out there this year. We should have some great fun with the BMW AS class this year! See ya there!

And yes, the rear bushings are a must

[and 1]

Originally Posted by aisthetes

I love this thread! Thanks to Mini's real world experimentation and Orb's specific knowledge and insight, the 135i's suspension quirks are finally getting solved to unlock the car's performance potential.

Thank you both for sharing and enlightening.

+1

[P90Puma]

Great thread. </necropost>