BMW 1///M. Who's going to step up?

[BMW86]

I have no doubt the 1M will surpass everyones expectations. It will be a beast. Look at how many positive reviews the 135i received across the world. It was widely received as one of the best cars BMW has made in a long time. The 1M will be on a whole new level. This will be the new ultimate driver enthusiast car that BMW makes.

I think whatever price point it comes out at it will be worth it. M cars are always designed with one thing in mind, perfection. The question is whether it's a wise move to trade up to one for those of us who've already own a 1er. I really need to see the specs on paper because at the moment I'm only speculating. Who am I kidding? The 1M is going to be a 135i on steroids! At least we have some time to start saving our pennies.

[sparoz]

Originally Posted by bmw135fan

IMO, not worth getting the M1 over a second hand M3 is the price is similar. The M3 looks better, the engine screams, does not have a cheap interior like the 1, and the new 1 hatch will come out in a year after you get your M1. 2 years too late bringing it out I say.

I guess that's the same argument with 335i vs 135i. It all changes depending on personal preference, life cycle, and ambitions. The price does not matter to a lot of people. The fact that you can afford a car that is more expensive doesn't mean that is the choice because different cars have different characteristics. To someone like amk, M3 Sedan makes perfect sense, and Zender's M3 Coupe. To me when I bought the 135i, that was the perfect choice. By the time the 1M comes out, a second hand M3 should be cheaper than a brand new 1M.

Originally Posted by BMW86

The 1M is going to be a 135i on steroids! At least we have some time to start saving our pennies.

I say it would be more like a muscled up 135 en pointe.

[BBK]

Originally Posted by BMW86

I have no doubt the 1M will surpass everyones expectations. It will be a beast. Look at how many positive reviews the 135i received across the world. It was widely received as one of the best cars BMW has made in a long time. The 1M will be on a whole new level. This will be the new ultimate driver enthusiast car that BMW makes.

I think whatever price point it comes out at it will be worth it. M cars are always designed with one thing in mind, perfection. The question is whether it's a wise move to trade up to one for those of us who've already own a 1er. I really need to see the specs on paper because at the moment I'm only speculating. Who am I kidding? The 1M is going to be a 135i on steroids! At least we have some time to start saving our pennies.

Unfortunately the 1m has a level (m3) that it cannot exceed. That isn't perfection...

If it is to be a 'real' M car then it would outperform all other M cars available because it is smaller and lighter. And we all know this won't happen. I just worry that BMW are talking rather than doing. They compared the 135 to the 2002... Now they are comparing the 1M to the E30 M3...

[chylld]

Originally Posted by sparoz

Deposit paid

Originally Posted by Taymaishu

I shall be going to an M1 once my lease is up.

Wish I could say I'd be joining you guys, but my next car must have 4 doors since it'll be around that time Most probably eyeing an E90 M3

[Zuzu]

Originally Posted by BBK

Unfortunately the 1m has a level (m3) that it cannot exceed. That isn't perfection...

If it is to be a 'real' M car then it would outperform all other M cars available because it is smaller and lighter. And we all know this won't happen. I just worry that BMW are talking rather than doing. They compared the 135 to the 2002... Now they are comparing the 1M to the E30 M3...

As it has been said before mate.. EVERYTHING to date about REAL performance figures for the 1M are really only speculation as BMW hasn't released any hard data stats to date..

My judgement is reserved until I see the BMW official performance/mod figures.

[dontask]

Man, that video really excites!

[sparoz]

Originally Posted by BBK

Unfortunately the 1m has a level (m3) that it cannot exceed. That isn't perfection...

If it is to be a 'real' M car then it would outperform all other M cars available because it is smaller and lighter. And we all know this won't happen. I just worry that BMW are talking rather than doing. They compared the 135 to the 2002... Now they are comparing the 1M to the E30 M3...

+1 I don't think it will compare really, unless they can shave the weight down. That's all marketing talk. However, I would think track performance will come very very close to the M3.

Originally Posted by chylld

Wish I could say I'd be joining you guys, but my next car must have 4 doors since it'll be around that time Most probably eyeing an E90 M3

Get a X5 as well - we are around that time too, and we are changing the other to a X5. You don't need 2 cars to have four doors!

[zenderm3]

Originally Posted by sparoz

+1 I don't think it will compare really, unless they can shave the weight down. That's all marketing talk. However, I would think track performance will come very very close to the M3.



Get a X5 as well - we are around that time too, and we are changing the other to a X5. You don't need 2 cars to have four doors!

sparoz mate - biggest performance (difference) will be the interface between the steering wheel and the drivers seat

I know that is the biggest thing hindering my M3! lol (It doesn't need mods... just a better driver!) hahah

[BBK]

Originally Posted by Zuzu

As it has been said before mate.. EVERYTHING to date about REAL performance figures for the 1M are really only speculation as BMW hasn't released any hard data stats to date..

My judgement is reserved until I see the BMW official performance/mod figures.

I owe you a beer if the 1M outperforms than the current M3 (In 1/4mile and track)

[chylld]

Originally Posted by BBK

I owe you a beer if the 1M outperforms than the current M3 (In 1/4mile and track)

I think you'll be owing a lot of beers...

[zenderm3]

Originally Posted by chylld

I think you'll be owing a lot of beers...

Gents - The reality is that both cars are great cars... the new 1M, the current M3... It wouldn't surprise me if the 1M will beat the M3 in certain areas...

In the end though, they are different cars and will have different "advantages" - comparing I think is mute - I think we can all agree that we wouldn't mind having the 1M and the M3 in our garages.

Can't we all just get along

PS. I do realise that this is all friendly debate... (just racking up my post count!)

PPS. My M3 is just sex on wheels

[sparoz]

Originally Posted by BBK

I owe you a beer if the 1M outperforms than the current M3 (In 1/4mile and track)

Hey, that's an empty offer!!!! We know it won't beat the m3 in 1/4mile!

[BMW86]

The 135i is comparable to the M3 in terms of raw power and speed. This is due to the fact that we have an FI engine 3.0litre engine and the M3 has an NA V8 and weighs more. This is where the similarities end because the the M3 excels in all other areas. It is an M car and it has typical M characteristics which make it better, most notably in the handling department.

There are many of us who have exploited the potential of the 135i. We have modified it, chipped it to make it faster in a straight line, added sway bars, coilovers, wider tyres, LSD, etc and we can argue that this is almost as good as an M3. The reality is in terms of performance criteria, a well rounded modified 135i can compete with the current M3. M badge or no M badge, they are not too far apart. That is the beauty of the 135i.

Think of the 1M as BMW transforming the current 135i into a true M car. When comparing the 135i to the M3, the weakness has never been the engine, it has been all the other components which make it a true M car.

Imagine if the current M3 was exactly the same car, same body, same suspension, same everything.... but it didn't have the V8. Instead it was equipped with the N54 engine fully tuned comparable to what a JB3 does. That car would live up to the hype. Yes the haters will say it won't because it's not NA, it's not raw but times are changing, out with the old and in with the new. FI is here to stay and copious amounts of torque down low is the trend. I for one am not complaining.

So therefore, what we do know for sure is that:
1. The engine will exceed or at least be on par with a modified N54 (which I already think was worthy of being in the current M3 pumping out 400hp).
2. The engine will be FI so we can extract even more ponies out of it.
3. It will have the same M characteristics as every other M made meaning it will handle like a dream.
4. It will weigh less than the M3.

I can't see how this car won't out perform the M3. Even if it doesn't, being FI we can tune it and it'll be even faster with the necessary suspension to support it.

[Guran]

Originally Posted by spdrcr

BMW really need to do something about the weight in their cars. If the 1M is any heavier than the 135i they have gone the wrong way in my opinion. The best thing they could do would be to take 200kg off the kerb weight.

My 135i was pretty quick but ultimately uninvolving to drive on the track. The Lotus has been a revelation in comparison. I'd really like to see BMW build something lightweight.

I am seriously considering selling my 135i because it is not a car that I find engaging to drive as a daily. Yes it is supremely fast, and there's fun to be had there: on the drive to/from work, I might get to savour it 2 or 3 times for a few seconds. But that's about where it ends. It is simply too heavy and insulating from the everyday driving experience. And frustrating too, because I know what it can deliver if let off the leash. To get any enjoyment from it, I need to give it a good flogging on deserted back roads, and frankly it can be quite scary keeping control of the lead-tipped missile. I get far more enjoyment from my stock 71rwkW MX-5! So much so that I'm toying with the idea of getting a used NC MX-5 to replace the 135i, pocket the difference, and right off the BMW experience as an expensive mistake. Early days yet and I'm not totally decided. But if there's one thing I can say with certainty, it is that there is absolutely no chance you'll see me near a 1M.

[Zuzu]

Originally Posted by sparoz

Hey, that's an empty offer!!!! We know it won't beat the m3 in 1/4mile!

And like everyone else mate..You are only speculating.. .. There is NO raw data available yet.

[RadiuM]

Originally Posted by chylld

I think you'll be owing a lot of beers...

Argh, I hate these guys video's. They are never consistant in any of the times they get between cars, even if a guy almost stalls it in the race they take that as a proper run. bah.

They should do multiple runs of each car to see what the best time is and then compare.

eg.

135 vs s2000 = 14s vs 14.6s
135 vs cayman = 13.6 vs 13.7s
135 vs 370z = 13.9s vs 14.1s

I bet if they raced the cayman vs the Z the Z would get 13.7 and the cayman 14.3

[Jaguar66]

Originally Posted by RadiuM

Argh, I hate these guys video's. They are never consistant in any of the times they get between cars, even if a guy almost stalls it in the race they take that as a proper run. bah.

They should do multiple runs of each car to see what the best time is and then compare.

eg.

.

135 vs s2000 = 14s vs 14.6s
135 vs cayman = 13.6 vs 13.7s
135 vs 370z = 13.9s vs 14.1s

I bet if they raced the cayman vs the Z the Z would get 13.7 and the cayman 14.3

I agree this clip is bogus. The Cayman S stumbled badly on its only run

If you look, and consider the cars are running against the clock, and not each other, the Caymans time beat the BMWs times on 2 out of the 3 of the BMWs runs. Including both the 0-400 M, and 0-500 M. If you average the BMWs runs the Caymans time beats it. And this is even counting that the Cayman S stumbled off the line on its only run, so other runs would likely have been even faster. I would say the Cayman S won this contest.

BMW runs
1st. 0-400 14.054 sec 0-500 16.202 sec
2nd. 0-400 13.676 sec 0-500 15.808 sec
3rd. 0-400 13.900 sec 0-500 16.049 sec
--------------------------------------------------
Ave. 0-400 13.877 sec 0-500 16.020 sec

Cayman S run
1. 0-400 13.758 sec 0-500 15.838sec

[Alext]

Hey Guran I know EXACTLY what you mean. Trouble is you been spoilt. I used to own a MX5 and a Lotus Elise which made the feeling of the 135i's handling and connection even worse! In any case you should consider getting a NB...a turbo one if you can find one...I found the NB more engaging to drive than the NC, but still more comfortable and rigid than the NA. Also preferred the seating position.

Having said that, the 135i was never designed to be an outright sports car.

Have you considered a Porsche?

[05C4R]

why do M3 owners always post in M1 threads. i think they are scared, oh and not quite tired yet of telling people they own an M3. its really quite funny. i like M3's but now i don't want to look like an M3 owner if that makes sense.

i think the best way forward for BMW would be to differentiate the M1 from the M3 so power and performance can go unconstricted. They could do this by leaving the M3 as the luxe weekend sports car and making the M1 the hard core sports car by making it alot lighter, a lsd, wider track, more power, bigger brakes, etc. No luxury crap, just go faster upgrades. So you have the middle aged luxo sports car M3 and the track weapon M1.

i would definately be down for an M1 if it is built like this.

[BBK]

Originally Posted by beemer

why do M3 owners always post in M1 threads. i think they are scared, oh and not quite tired yet of telling people they own an M3. its really quite funny. i like M3's but now i don't want to look like an M3 owner if that makes sense.

i think the best way forward for BMW would be to differentiate the M1 from the M3 so power and performance can go unconstricted. They could do this by leaving the M3 as the luxe weekend sports car and making the M1 the hard core sports car by making it alot lighter, a lsd, wider track, more power, bigger brakes, etc. No luxury crap, just go faster upgrades. So you have the middle aged luxo sports car M3 and the track weapon M1.

Agreed! In everything that you said...

[Guran]

Originally Posted by Alext

Hey Guran I know EXACTLY what you mean. Trouble is you been spoilt. I used to own a MX5 and a Lotus Elise which made the feeling of the 135i's handling and connection even worse! In any case you should consider getting a NB...a turbo one if you can find one...I found the NB more engaging to drive than the NC, but still more comfortable and rigid than the NA. Also preferred the seating position.

SPs occasionally show up for sale and would be nice but it limits my options if I decide to eventually compete with it at Supersprints. Same deal with the SE - although there are plenty of them for sale. I've driven a stock NB8B and it's not what I'm looking for. An NC is a good option from that perspective, plus I like the look and feel. Retractable hardtop is nice too. I'll still have my NA6 for the ultimate in driver engagement and regular track work.

Have you considered a Porsche?

Not seriously, although I'm sort of interested in a used Boxster S at around $45k-$50k, and pocket the difference. I'd need to look into servicing (don't think there are any specialists in Wollongong). I'm also looking at moving away from the snobbery and aggro that BMWs seem to attract, and I don't think I'll get any less with a Porsche.

Still mulling it all over.

[Alext]

Yeah tough decision Guran. Not many options around in this sort of segment. S2000 is another I can think of that may give you the level of fun and driver involvement you desire at a good pricepoint.

Boxster S would be $$$ to keep out of warranty.

I had a NB '01 that I turbocharged aftermarket. It was brilliant fun. The 135i reminds me of it in a straight line (though not as quick and developing power at higher rpms).... until you get to a corner.