Racing brake ss pistons+large rotor review

[Focusedintntions]

Just got home from 2 amazing days at VIR running the new brake hardware. So far I'm extremely happy as for the first time ever the front brakes ran consistently cooler than the rears!!!

First off the service, knowledge, and patience (from an anxious customer wanting new toys) exhibited by Warren and everybody else at RacingBrake has been second to none. They really are a top notch outfit wanting to find the best solution for us.

Now I've rebuilt my calipers in the past with stop-tech seals and they fared no better than the stock seals. After a single weekend the dust boots were melted to bacon bits. They really aren't designed to handle heat. After a year and half of tracking the car my pistons were beginning to crumble and I had no dust boots left, so it was time to either buy a bbk or find a solution using the stock brakes. Enter Warren and RacingBrake.

First thing you notice about the new pistons is their heft, especially compared to the factory "cerami-plastic" pistons. Its really is startling how light the factory ones are. Rebuilding the calipers is a fairly straight forward process and there are tons of videos/how to's out there to follow. Second big item to notice is the new bracket warren provides. Again there's a significant weight difference when compared to the stock bracket. RacingBrakes aluminum brackets is very night compared to the stock cast steel piece. Add in the larger and lighter new rotor and it really is an impressive package to have in your hands. Installation is straight forward and easy as swapping rotors with just the extra step of swapping the bracket.

On the Street
Once it's all one I took it out for a test drive. On the road I didn't notice any big difference in regular driving. There was a bit of "whirring" noise emitting when i stepped on the brakes, but that's normal noise when using a slotted style rotor. During some spirited driving on some of my favorite back roads I noticed no discernible difference in bias or performance. The one positive I noticed was a slight increase in pedal feel. This wasn't a drastic improvement, but slightly noticeable.

On the Track
I swapped out my Cool Carbon street pads, over to my Hawk DT70 and DT60 track pads. First session of the day I went out and took it easy to get a feel for the car's setup. As the 30 minute session wore on I was finally getting comfortable with the car setup and really pushing it. By the end of the day I was really moving and enjoying this setup. Pedal feel is greatly improved. What was barely noticeable on the street really shines at the limits. Never once throughout the 2 days did I flinch or worry about my brakes. I knew what they were doing the whole time and was able to shorten my stopping distances simply b/c of the confidence I had in my brakes. For those curious/concerned about the bias being affected, there was no significant difference at all. The balance during braking felt the same as it had int he past. My only annoyance about my setup was the fact my pads were wearing and there was an increase in pedal travel, which can't be helped haha.

During temperature testing as I came off the track after a long 30 minute session I found that the front calipers and rotors were consistently cooler than the rear brakes. Calipers were generally 75-100 degrees cooler than the rears. Rotors were anywhere between 150 to 250 degrees coolers than the rears! It has been well documented how much hotter the fronts generally run than the rears.

Post track inspection
Rotors looked great with no major wear/cracking issues. What really surprised me was the calipers and seals. I was surprised to see how expensive seals were being listed for and didn't really understand why they were so much more expensive than the stoptech ones i've purchased in the past. Well now i know why. After frying the stoptech dust boots after a single day on the track, I was extremely surprised and happy to see that the new seals from RacingBrake still look about as good as the day I installed them!! There's the reason they're more expensive and worth the cost. They are designed for the heat and abuse where the others definitely weren't.


Final thoughts
So far I saying this kit is definitely worth the money if you're tracking your car. The quality of the product, and quality of the company are awesome. Initially I only got the rebuild kit for the front calipers, but after seeing how well they performed and have stood up, i'll be getting the rebuild kit for the rears. I"m sure they aren't far off from beginning to crumble too.


FYI guys to get the intro discount pricing better get your order in before Friday. This setup so far is awesome!!!

[cdde323]

Originally Posted by Focusedintntions

I'll post a full review once I'm at a pc and have a bit of time to get vids up and such.

FYI guys to get the intro discount pricing better get your order in before Friday. This setup so far is awesome!!!

Hopefully you can post that review before Friday...

Was the brake bias noticeably affected?

[pixelblue]

Originally Posted by cdde323

Was the brake bias noticeably affected?

Craig, there shouldn't be any difference in brake bias. you'll be using the same caliper and pads. only difference is better heat dissipation because of the larger rotor mass

[GaryS]

Originally Posted by pixelblue

Craig, there shouldn't be any difference in brake bias. you'll be using the same caliper and pads. only difference is better heat dissipation because of the larger rotor mass

If I understand right, the caliper was moved outward to fit the larger diameter rotor. That increases leverage and braking force, which moves the bias further forward.

[pixelblue]

Gary, although I see what you mean however, nothing has changed as far as brake pressure, piston diameters or pad surface area. I would assume swapping different brake compounds would have a greater effect on bias than moving the caliper back 10 mm. I may be wrong but I am open to be taught otherwise

[NYC6]

[GaryS]

Originally Posted by pixelblue

Gary, although I see what you mean however, nothing has changed as far as brake pressure, piston diameters or pad surface area. I would assume swapping different brake compounds would have a greater effect on bias than moving the caliper back 10 mm. I may be wrong but I am open to be taught otherwise

I agree that the difference is small. 10mm is only a 6% increase in effective radius. Brake torque is calculated by effective rotor radius x piston surface area x pad friction coefficient x pressure. So it's a 6% difference in braking force. As you said, choice of pads can make a much bigger difference. For example, Ferodo DS3000 has around 25% higher friction coefficient than DS2500.

[Focusedintntions]

I will say this much as I've been busy at work and can't type up the whole thing...brake bias increase was minimal. Over all diameter was only 12mm bigger...the new bracket only pushed the caliper out like 4 mm....

[GaryS]

Originally Posted by Focusedintntions

I will say this much as I've been busy at work and can't type up the whole thing...brake bias increase was minimal. Over all diameter was only 12mm bigger...the new bracket only pushed the caliper out like 4 mm....

If the caliper moved only 4mm, the increase in braking force is less than 3%.

[pixelblue]

must admit this kit looks very nice. stainless steel pistons and the nice two piece rotors. giving it some serious thought.

[Focusedintntions]

Originally Posted by pixelblue

must admit this kit looks very nice. stainless steel pistons and the nice two piece rotors. giving it some serious thought.

Do it!

[Focusedintntions]

Updated the review

[cdde323]

Originally Posted by Focusedintntions

Updated the review

Good info...

Do you have LSD or DTC turned off? Wondering if you're working your rear brakes as much as someone who runs with DTC on... (like me).

Thanks for answering my question on bias.

I don't imagine I've put anywhere near the abuse on my pistons/seals as yourself, so I'm sure mine are still in fine working order. Do you see getting the piston/seal kit as something needed for preventative reasons or only as needed?Curious if getting the rotor upgrade would save me from needing a new pistons/seal kit in the future.

[Focusedintntions]

I turn all the nannies off, however, the E-lsd never turns off so it's getting used quite a bit regardless of what mode the car is in. Even then, prior to this, the fronts always have run hotter.

If you're tracking, even with this setup, its not a question of if the pistons will degrade but when. Their failure is from repeated high temperature heat cycling. IMO I'd say its worth doing before you have issue. If you take out the factory pistons before they get bad, you can in the future replace them later and sell the RB ones if you ever decide to get rid of them.

Originally Posted by cdde323

Good info...

Do you have LSD or DTC turned off? Wondering if you're working your rear brakes as much as someone who runs with DTC on... (like me).

Thanks for answering my question on bias.

I don't imagine I've put anywhere near the abuse on my pistons/seals as yourself, so I'm sure mine are still in fine working order. Do you see getting the piston/seal kit as something needed for preventative reasons or only as needed?Curious if getting the rotor upgrade would save me from needing a new pistons/seal kit in the future.

[Focusedintntions]

Any questions guys?

[yawn]

Originally Posted by Focusedintntions

Any questions guys?

Just another thing, did you notice an improvement in brake fade? As in, is there a decrease in brake fade after the RB pistons and rotors were installed?

[DRedman45]

Glad you had a good experience with them...they have had major issues with the bbk they are making for vw's and their customer service pushed a lot of guys to sell it

[DRedman45]

What size rotors do they bump to 355?

[BMW86]

Originally Posted by DRedman45

Glad you had a good experience with them...they have had major issues with the bbk they are making for vw's and their customer service pushed a lot of guys to sell it

Which company had issues? RB?

Originally Posted by DRedman45

What size rotors do they bump to 355?

350x28

[sour97]

great review. thanks for sharing !!

[Focusedintntions]

Originally Posted by sharkatron

Just another thing, did you notice an improvement in brake fade? As in, is there a decrease in brake fade after the RB pistons and rotors were installed?

I never had fade prior with the use of proper pads. I did note temps were cooler on the calipers/rotors. Less chance of boiling fluid.

[TonyL128]

Racing Brake has a group buy list for these rotors. If anyone is interested, here is the link:

http://forums.racingbrake.com/showthread.php?p=4244#post4244