My 128i Project

[pushkin]

Originally Posted by NJL

+ 1 interested for the dyno reading before and after PBX!

This saturday I am going in for dyno... So monday i should have the results on the site

[pushkin]

Below are the Dyno chart and a link to the youtube video of my power box dyno.

Graph:


Video:

Dyno run:
0W30 oil/94 octane/injen intake/DMT 3” exhaust/BSM Power box
From what it looks likes the power box did jack shit except burn more fuel. I can see (by using the scan tool) they advanced the ignition timing by a few degrees and dumped a more fuel. However as power goes the dyno proved that there are no gains to be had even with all my supporting modification.

Also if you’re wondering if I gave it enough time to “adapt”; I installed a few days before going on the dyno.
And if you’re wondering why it is less power now than it was before, well its most likely due to some factor like oxygen levels in the air, its not uncommon.

[Belarus]

That sucks buddy.

You should post your previous Dyno chart with the same mods and fuel Octane for side by side visual comparison.

Does PBX have multiple MAPs ? If yes did you try with different MAPs ?

[pushkin]

Originally Posted by Belarus

That sucks buddy.

You should post your previous Dyno chart with the same mods and fuel Octane for side by side visual comparison.

Does PBX have multiple MAPs ? If yes did you try with different MAPs ?

Yup its has a few maps... we tried them all on the dyno, it seems to have no affect in terms of whp...

[Evice]

PBX is hoax what?

[pushkin]

Originally Posted by Evice

PBX is hoax what?

Depends what you mean by hoax... lol

[Franco]

Has anyone done a dyno (besides the company) with only PBX with no other modifications? How about throttle feel that everyone seems to talk about, any improvement?

[pushkin]

Originally Posted by Franco

Has anyone done a dyno (besides the company) with only PBX with no other modifications? How about throttle feel that everyone seems to talk about, any improvement?

throttle is great!

here is a 330i with the PBX:



same one:



here is his thread: http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=359146

[JimD]

It could be that the tune is designed for an unmodified engine and doesn't work well with the mods. If so, the programming could change and a benefit be achieved.

It could also be that there is a restriction in the engine that prevents any improvement from the tune. Like the intake system may be too restrictive. The X5 has a ~260hp version of this engine, it seems like somebody posted there is a difference in the intakes - am I remembering things?

Jim

[Evice]

Intake manifold and ECU some say. 130i has the very same engine producing 265hp.

I am a little dissapointed with the results.

[JimD]

I went on realoem and checked some things and I might have discovered something useful.

I compared the 260hp X5 3 liter to the 230hp 128i 3 liter. The torque peak rpm is the same, the peak hp increases on the X5 to 6600 rpm versus 6500 on the 128i (almost the same). Compression ratio, and bore & stroke all the same (this stuff is from BMWUSA website).

RealOEM shows a different cylinder head part number. But the part number for the intake manifold, inlet camshaft, eccentric camshaft, exhaust camshaft, intake valve, and exhaust valve are all the same. The camshafts being the same seems consistent to me with the hp and torque peaks occurring at essentially the same rpm.

The difference I found that might be significant is the injector. The X5 has an injector with part number 13537531634. The 128 N52 has an injector with part number 13537574376. Price of either is shown as $122.42 each (6 are used). Assuming the X5 has a bigger injector, it would make sense for this to restrict performance of the 128 N52.

Jim

[jabwind51]

Originally Posted by JimD

I went on realoem and checked some things and I might have discovered something useful.

I compared the 260hp X5 3 liter to the 230hp 128i 3 liter. The torque peak rpm is the same, the peak hp increases on the X5 to 6600 rpm versus 6500 on the 128i (almost the same). Compression ratio, and bore & stroke all the same (this stuff is from BMWUSA website).

RealOEM shows a different cylinder head part number. But the part number for the intake manifold, inlet camshaft, eccentric camshaft, exhaust camshaft, intake valve, and exhaust valve are all the same. The camshafts being the same seems consistent to me with the hp and torque peaks occurring at essentially the same rpm.

The difference I found that might be significant is the injector. The X5 has an injector with part number 13537531634. The 128 N52 has an injector with part number 13537574376. Price of either is shown as $122.42 each (6 are used). Assuming the X5 has a bigger injector, it would make sense for this to restrict performance of the 128 N52.

Jim

Interesting find. The intake manifold should be different with the 128i getting a one-stage, and all other N52 higher hp variants, getting a three-stage intake manifold. Most on e90 post with 325's found that just changing to the three-stage intake manifold yields the 260ish hp found in the X series, z4, and both the 130i and 330i. They have found that the 325's still have the software to allow for this swap, but the ECU needs to be tuned to allow for more hp.

Another member with a 328i (as opposed to the conversions done so far on 325's) just purchased the intake manifold and intends to do the software tune. This would be interesting to see how a 328 responds to the new intake manifold more so than a 325, for our 128i situation.

(And FWIW, I have PBX and I do notice more pull at highway speed and off take-away launches. And this is with BMW Performance Intake and Exhaust.)

[Belarus]

Originally Posted by pushkin

Yup its has a few maps... we tried them all on the dyno, it seems to have no affect in terms of whp...

Send an email to Terry@BMS and Mike@N54 for their input. Don't forget BMS policy of 14 day money back satisfaction guarantee.

[JimD]

I went and looked at a e90 328i on RealOEM. The intake manifold is different. On the e90, it shows a 11617559524. On the X5 and 128i, it shows 11617559523. So it makes some sense to switch the manifold on a e90 but I don't think it makes sense on the 128i.

Conversely, the injectors of the X5 and the e90 are the same, 13537531634 and the 128i is different, 13537574376. So it would also make sense for a e90 owner not to change injectors.

I did not look at all the other parts of the e90 but I did check the intake camshaft and it was the same part number as the 128i and X5 (11317563663).

Before I spent the money on parts, I would print out these pages from RealOEM and go through them closer to make sure there are no other differences.

Jim

[jabwind51]

Originally Posted by JimD

I went and looked at a e90 328i on RealOEM. The intake manifold is different. On the e90, it shows a 11617559524. On the X5 and 128i, it shows 11617559523. So it makes some sense to switch the manifold on a e90 but I don't think it makes sense on the 128i.

Conversely, the injectors of the X5 and the e90 are the same, 13537531634 and the 128i is different, 13537574376. So it would also make sense for a e90 owner not to change injectors.

I did not look at all the other parts of the e90 but I did check the intake camshaft and it was the same part number as the 128i and X5 (11317563663).

Before I spent the money on parts, I would print out these pages from RealOEM and go through them closer to make sure there are no other differences.

Jim

Wow. This is very interesting. I am going to check perhaps the difference between the 128i and the 130i, maybe this is the better one to compare our car to..265 hp?

I was so set on ordering an intake manifold in the future...However, it appears that the three stage intake manifold at part number 11617559523 is already on a 128i? So we have the intake??? This is exciting!

I also thought the X3 was involved in this too.

EDIT: I just checked realoem for teh 128i and it did come up with 11617559524 for the 128i, which is the one-stage manifold...thoughts? I checked all years...

[JimD]

jabwind51,

It would seem we are both right about the 128i but I was not really specific enough. I search a e88 - a 128i convertible - because that is what I have. It shows the same intake as the X5 (the ...523). I searched the e82 128i and I get the ....524, same as the e90. I wonder what the 3 series convertible has....

So for a 1 series N52, it seems to matter whether you have a convertible or a coupe. With the former, only the injectors appear to be different. With the latter, both the intake and the injectors are different. That is a big difference since the intake is over $500 list.

The convertible has extra weight but it doesn't make a lot of sense to me that BMW switches around little parts like this. It seems like some of the reason is marketing - they don't want a 260 hp motor in the 128 because they get $6000 more for the 135i. If the difference was 40hp instead of 70hp, they probably wouldn't sell as many 135i.

Jim

[jabwind51]

Originally Posted by JimD

jabwind51,

It would seem we are both right about the 128i but I was not really specific enough. I search a e88 - a 128i convertible - because that is what I have. It shows the same intake as the X5 (the ...523). I searched the e82 128i and I get the ....524, same as the e90. I wonder what the 3 series convertible has....

So for a 1 series N52, it seems to matter whether you have a convertible or a coupe. With the former, only the injectors appear to be different. With the latter, both the intake and the injectors are different. That is a big difference since the intake is over $500 list.

The convertible has extra weight but it doesn't make a lot of sense to me that BMW switches around little parts like this. It seems like some of the reason is marketing - they don't want a 260 hp motor in the 128 because they get $6000 more for the 135i. If the difference was 40hp instead of 70hp, they probably wouldn't sell as many 135i.

Jim

Yes. I did see this, however, it appears that the 128i convertible is the one with the differing fuel injection system (...76), vs the 128i coupe, 330i, x5, all with the part number ending in (...34). Check again to verify but I can see:

Fuel Injectors:

13537574376 E88 128i
13537531634 E82 128i
13537531634 E70 X5 3.0
13537531634 E90 2006 330i
13537531634 E90 2006 325i
13537531634 E87 130i (same N52N engine--265 hp)

Intake Manifolds:

11617559524 E90 2006 325i
11617559524 E82 128i
11617559523 E88 128i
11617559523 E70 X5 3.0
11617559523 E90 2006 330i
11617559523 E87 130i (same N52N engine--265 hp)

So, it seems that just the injectors need to be replaced on the convertible and only the intake for the 128i coupe to get that elusive 265 hp with an ECU tune. The 128i verts already have the intake manifold it looks like!


Interestingly, all the engines were N52N EXCEPT the E88 128i, which is N51. This could be the difference in the different fuel injectors, perhaps?

[Evice]

I want a nice NA around 265 hp ! Is this too much to ask!? I don't want turbos, I don't wanna spend $6000 to get 135, I want the nice, pure magnificent NA, which deserves my $6000

[jabwind51]

Originally Posted by Evice

I want a nice NA around 265 hp ! Is this too much to ask!? I don't want turbos, I don't wanna spend $6000 to get 135, I want the nice, pure magnificent NA, which deserves my $6000

Precisely man. Precisely. It has been strongly argued that a 130i with some goodies, pushing 275-285 horsepower is the TRUE sports car, over the 135i with the turbos.

That said, I will be getting the intake manifold at some point this year, install it myself, and probably get the 330i/130i tune after my first year service in 6000 miles.

I am thinking that with this manifold plus my intake/exhaust, I should be approaching that elusive horsepower mark.

Plus, on e90post, WinterTuning has announced a 330i tuned to 289 hp, and their tune works on all N52N engine variants, including ours....(with the better intake manifold, however)

[DustinDep]

there is also a german company that does a tune for N52 with the better intake manifold to 289hp DE motor sports i think it was

[JimD]

You might need the exhaust manifolds too. The X5 has part numbers 18407558769 & 70. The e88 128i has 18407556503 & 04. I do not know how realistic the pictures are on RealOEM but the X5 parts look more like a header. List price is nearly $1000 each (there are two).

I don't think I'd want an injector from a wrecked car but if you could find a intake or exhaust from a wrecked car, it might save some money.

Jim

[toto4dwin]

no difference in the front. 128/125/130 intake, manifolds all the same.
The leap forward is in the rear axle drive. I had the E87 130 Differential Drive and Output Shaft in my E82 125. Guarantee improvement!
Before that I had the BMW Performance Intake & Exhaust. Improvement is only acoustically.
Now the BMW Performance Rear Wheel Brake fits!
Cheers