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[Larry Lu]

I am comparing the Forgestar and OZ rims..
anyone know about the Forgestar? I heard that maybe the same
as iForge? is that true? There 18" wheel's weight only 17.3 ?
I would like to know their quality and where they comes from.
Thx

[oneintheory]

Forgestar wheels are not actually forged, they are Flow Form Cast. They are, however, good quality. I ran a set of 19' F14s for a few months, and was very pleased with them. I doubt the 18s are that light. My 19s were 41 pounds with fully inflated tires, so maybe around 21-23 lbs? The weights are on the website, but I'm feeling lazy.

[Eddy@ApexWheels]

Originally Posted by Larry Lu

I am comparing the Forgestar and OZ rims..
anyone know about the Forgestar? I heard that maybe the same
as iForge? is that true? There 18" wheel's weight only 17.3 ?
I would like to know their quality and where they comes from.
Thx

Forgestar wheels are not CNC from a blank or stamp forged. They aren't a true forged, wheel and I remember them explaining their name in a thread somewhere. They are Flow formed. Which means the face is cast, and the barrel is then rolled out. They have a decent write up on their site I think.

I didn't see any 17.3lbs 18" wheels made by forgestar, at least not in a bmw fitment. Or are you asking about O.Z? who also doesn't make an 18" bmw wheel that's 17.3lbs that I know of.

EDIT: I looked on their site, and they list the test results for their wheels. the 18" wheel they tested was 17.7lbs on the sheet, BUT it was tested for a load rating of 1200lbs, which is significantly under the minimum required for the bmw bolt pattern. It's actually the lowest I've ever seen to date. A wheel can be significantly lighter if it doesn't have to hold up to the standard load rating.

I'm assuming/hoping that their actually production 18" wheels were tested for a higher load rating around 1500lbs or more. There's no way the wheel passed a higher load rating at that weight though with the mesh design. I peaked at a few other wheels and they were 1500lbs, I'm sure they can clarify this. I don't want to make a big deal out of it, if all they did was post old testing information.

[onehungevo]

I heard from a vendor that they bend easy and many BMW owners sell them after a few months as a result. I don't have any personal experience though but that has been keeping from buying the forgestar rims.

[modbargains]

Originally Posted by Larry Lu

I am comparing the Forgestar and OZ rims..
anyone know about the Forgestar? I heard that maybe the same
as iForge? is that true? There 18" wheel's weight only 17.3 ?
I would like to know their quality and where they comes from.
Thx

Hey Larry,

We just released the information on 18inch Forgestar's and they are really an incredible wheel. They use a Flow Form Casting method, they are durable, lightweight and handsomely priced.

here is the picture for the 18" wheel weight

[IMG]http://www.**********s.com/images/Products/Forgestar%20Wheels/1885weights.jpg[/IMG]

Why Forgestar Wheels are Better Than Cast Wheels

• Custom Offsets - Forgestar wheels can be made in virtually any offset, whereas standard cast wheels come in a set offset. This allows you to dial in exactly how you want your wheels to sit (we can help you select the offset you need for the look your looking for). Having custom offsets allows for fitment of wider wheels in stock suspension and lowered vehicles. Forgestar wheels are designed specifically for your car and it's suspension setup, where cast wheels are designed for everyone and typically do not take in to account lowered suspension setups.
  
• Weight - Forgestar wheels are also much lighter than cast wheels. The 18x8.5 F14 wheel weighs an amazingly light 17.6 lbs, where a cast wheel of this same size would weigh anywhere from 23-27 lbs. This saving of roughly 6-10 pounds per wheel makes a BIG difference in regards to handling and drivability. Reducing unsprung weight (weight that is not supported by the car's suspension, i.e wheels, tires, brake rotors, and brake calipers) is one of the easiest ways to improve your car's handling, braking, and acceleration. As a general estimate 1 pound of unsprung weight is equal to 10 pounds of static weight. (weight that is supported by the vehicle's suspension). By using this ratio if you were to replace your stock wheels that weighed 25 lbs with Forgestar wheels you would be saving 320 lbs. in static weight!
  
• Strength - Flow-formed wheels are similar in strength to that of a fully forged wheel, without the cost. The process used to make the Forgestar wheels is the same process BBS wheels uses as well. Forgestar wheels are also rated at 1200 lbs per wheel which is considerably more than a cast wheels which are typically around 1000-1200 lbs. per wheel.
  
• Range of Sizes - Forgestar wheels are available in a multitude of sizes, allowing you to decide exactly what diameter and width you want to run on your vehicle, rather being forced to run a set staggered size with cast wheels (As cast wheels usually are only available with one set front wheel width, and one rear wheel width).

I hope this help you Larry, let me know if you have any questions.

Kevin

[ALUFELGEN]

Originally Posted by paintpro21

Forgestar wheels are not CNC from a blank or stamp forged. They aren't a true forged, wheel and I remember them explaining their name in a thread somewhere. They are Flow formed. Which means the face is cast, and the barrel is then rolled out. They have a decent write up on their site I think.

I didn't see any 17.3lbs 18" wheels made by forgestar, at least not in a bmw fitment. Or are you asking about O.Z? who also doesn't make an 18" bmw wheel that's 17.3lbs that I know of.

EDIT: I looked on their site, and they list the test results for their wheels. the 18" wheel they tested was 17.7lbs on the sheet, BUT it was tested for a load rating of 1200lbs, which is significantly under the minimum required for the bmw bolt pattern. It's actually the lowest I've ever seen to date. A wheel can be significantly lighter if it doesn't have to hold up to the standard load rating.

I'm assuming/hoping that their actually production 18" wheels were tested for a higher load rating around 1500lbs or more. There's no way the wheel passed a higher load rating at that weight though with the mesh design. I peaked at a few other wheels and they were 1500lbs, I'm sure they can clarify this. I don't want to make a big deal out of it, if all they did was post old testing information.

We tested our CS7 wheels in 18" at 1450lb per corner and passed and had to change it to 1550lbs per corner because of the new JWL/VIA standards and passed as well.

The minimum required load on a BMW ranges from 660kg to 725kg per corner or 1450lbs to 1600lbs per corner.

[Eddy@ApexWheels]

Originally Posted by AluFelgen

We tested our CS7 wheels in 18" at 1450lb per corner and passed and had to change it to 1550lbs per corner because of the new JWL/VIA standards and passed as well.

The minimum required load on a BMW ranges from 660kg to 725kg per corner or 1450lbs to 1600lbs per corner.

I was informed that testing standard updates had no effect on 5x120 fitment. It changed some things for the 5x100 fitment, and some of the tire sizes that need to be used during testing, and for wheels over 30" in diameter.

Originally Posted by **********s

Forgestar wheels are also rated at 1200 lbs per wheel which is considerably more than a cast wheels which are typically around 1000-1200 lbs. per wheel.

That's why the wheels are light. They aren't up to the minimum standard required. The ARC-8 in 18x9.5" could pass at just over 17lbs if the rating were reduced much. Instead they are done at 1550lbs and are in the 18lbs range.

The D-force LTW-5 wheel is only set at 1400lbs but distributors disclose that they are recommended for track use only. I just spoke to a friend today who cracked the spoke on his 18x9" LTW-5 a while ago.

All the BBS 3 series wheels are certified for 1530 at least, from what I've seen.

I've actually never seen a wheel in person with a load rating less then 1400. cast, forged, what ever.

[ALUFELGEN]

Originally Posted by paintpro21

I was informed that testing standard updates had no effect on 5x120 fitment. It changed some things for the 5x100 fitment, and some of the tire sizes that need to be used during testing, and for wheels over 30" in diameter.

We were required to change our Load Rating for 5x120.

[jlee]

Interesting, does anyone have the load rating for the Breytons GTS-Rs ?

Jeff

[oneintheory]

Originally Posted by **********s

Hey Larry,

We just released the information on 18inch Forgestar's and they are really an incredible wheel. They use a Flow Form Casting method, they are durable, lightweight and handsomely priced.

here is the picture for the 18" wheel weight

[IMG]http://www.**********s.com/images/Products/Forgestar%20Wheels/1885weights.jpg[/IMG]

Why Forgestar Wheels are Better Than Cast Wheels

• Custom Offsets - Forgestar wheels can be made in virtually any offset, whereas standard cast wheels come in a set offset. This allows you to dial in exactly how you want your wheels to sit (we can help you select the offset you need for the look your looking for). Having custom offsets allows for fitment of wider wheels in stock suspension and lowered vehicles. Forgestar wheels are designed specifically for your car and it's suspension setup, where cast wheels are designed for everyone and typically do not take in to account lowered suspension setups.
  
• Weight - Forgestar wheels are also much lighter than cast wheels. The 18x8.5 F14 wheel weighs an amazingly light 17.6 lbs, where a cast wheel of this same size would weigh anywhere from 23-27 lbs. This saving of roughly 6-10 pounds per wheel makes a BIG difference in regards to handling and drivability. Reducing unsprung weight (weight that is not supported by the car's suspension, i.e wheels, tires, brake rotors, and brake calipers) is one of the easiest ways to improve your car's handling, braking, and acceleration. As a general estimate 1 pound of unsprung weight is equal to 10 pounds of static weight. (weight that is supported by the vehicle's suspension). By using this ratio if you were to replace your stock wheels that weighed 25 lbs with Forgestar wheels you would be saving 320 lbs. in static weight!
  
• Strength - Flow-formed wheels are similar in strength to that of a fully forged wheel, without the cost. The process used to make the Forgestar wheels is the same process BBS wheels uses as well. Forgestar wheels are also rated at 1200 lbs per wheel which is considerably more than a cast wheels which are typically around 1000-1200 lbs. per wheel.
  
• Range of Sizes - Forgestar wheels are available in a multitude of sizes, allowing you to decide exactly what diameter and width you want to run on your vehicle, rather being forced to run a set staggered size with cast wheels (As cast wheels usually are only available with one set front wheel width, and one rear wheel width).

I hope this help you Larry, let me know if you have any questions.

Kevin

Let's get real, here...the Forgestar's aren't really that much lighter than every cast rim. They aren't that heavy, but the load rating is quite bothersome. I don't know how you can say that 1200 lbs is considerably more than cast wheels, then say that cast wheels are rated for between 1000-1200 lbs.

[modbargains]

Originally Posted by oneintheory

Let's get real, here...the Forgestar's aren't really that much lighter than every cast rim. They aren't that heavy, but the load rating is quite bothersome. I don't know how you can say that 1200 lbs is considerably more than cast wheels, then say that cast wheels are rated for between 1000-1200 lbs.

Hey Guys,

I see your concerns, and to better help you understand Flow-Formed wheels and the load rating here is some really good information

Flow Forming is pressure that is applied to the cast rim, actually changing the wheels mechanical properties. The strength and impact values become similar to those of a forged wheel.
Now understand that the Forgestar wheels are optimized at 1200lbs load rating but it was actually tested at 1845lbs and PASSED! Thats exactly why these wheels are so damn great!

The Data speaks for itself, look at it.


FORGESTAR F14 TEST DATA:
STL Report 18x8.5
STL Report 18x12


The STL shows that the initial deflection is .068 after an 1825lbs test load the final deflection was .066. That was after 5.11 hours of testing!

After all that load testing there was pretty much no flex at .002

Forgestar also uses a new testing data standard called SAE J2530. It surpasses any test data out there now, this new standard is harder to pass than TUV!

Please understand that the reason it is optimized at 1200 is because the creators of this wheel made it with the intentions of putting it on lighter car. e.g. Porches, E82 1series, and the E90/92 3series type of cars!

I hope this information clarifies any questions out there!

Kevin

[oneintheory]

Originally Posted by **********s

Hey Guys,

I see your concerns, and to better help you understand Flow-Formed wheels and the load rating here is some really good information

Flow Forming is pressure that is applied to the cast rim, actually changing the wheels mechanical properties. The strength and impact values become similar to those of a forged wheel.
Now understand that the Forgestar wheels are optimized at 1200lbs load rating but it was actually tested at 1845lbs and PASSED! Thats exactly why these wheels are so damn great!

The Data speaks for itself, look at it.


FORGESTAR F14 TEST DATA:
STL Report 18x8.5
STL Report 18x12


The STL shows that the initial deflection is .068 after an 1825lbs test load the final deflection was .066. That was after 5.11 hours of testing!

After all that load testing there was pretty much no flex at .002

Forgestar also uses a new testing data standard called SAE J2350. It surpasses any test data out there now, this new standard is harder to pass than TUV!

Please understand that the reason it is optimized at 1200 is because the creators of this wheel made it with the intentions of putting it on lighter car. e.g. Porches, E82 1series, and the E90/92 3series type of cars!

I hope this information clarifies any questions out there!

Kevin

thanks for the additional info. really clears things up.

[Tarthuss]

Originally Posted by **********s

Hey Guys,

I see your concerns, and to better help you understand Flow-Formed wheels and the load rating here is some really good information

Flow Forming is pressure that is applied to the cast rim, actually changing the wheels mechanical properties. The strength and impact values become similar to those of a forged wheel.
Now understand that the Forgestar wheels are optimized at 1200lbs load rating but it was actually tested at 1845lbs and PASSED! Thats exactly why these wheels are so damn great!

The Data speaks for itself, look at it.


FORGESTAR F14 TEST DATA:
STL Report 18x8.5
STL Report 18x12


The STL shows that the initial deflection is .068 after an 1825lbs test load the final deflection was .066. That was after 5.11 hours of testing!

After all that load testing there was pretty much no flex at .002

Forgestar also uses a new testing data standard called SAE J2350. It surpasses any test data out there now, this new standard is harder to pass than TUV!

Please understand that the reason it is optimized at 1200 is because the creators of this wheel made it with the intentions of putting it on lighter car. e.g. Porches, E82 1series, and the E90/92 3series type of cars!

I hope this information clarifies any questions out there!

Kevin

Kevin you are terribly mistaken. The 1845lbs/ft (pounds per sq foot) is the rotary load required for testing a 18x8.5 wheel with a 1200lbs load per corner according to SAE J2530 standards. It does not mean the wheel is capable of sustaining a load of 1845lbs per corner.

By engineering standards, if a wheel is optimized for a 1200lbs load it`ll most likely be able to hold +/- 10% of that load to account for errors, not an exorbitant 1845lbs as you suggested. Flow Forming is quite better than cast but please check your data. Keep in mind a wheel rated at the suggested load rating for a BMW of around 695kg will have the same strength regardless if the wheel is forged, flow formed or cast. Only the weight will vary.

A rating of 1200lb per corner is very risky for any BMW.

[Eddy@ApexWheels]

Originally Posted by Tarthuss

Kevin you are terribly mistaken. The 1845lbs/ft (pounds per sq foot) is the rotary load required for testing a 18x8.5 wheel with a 1200lbs load per corner according to SAE J2530 standards. It does not mean the wheel is capable of sustaining a load of 1845lbs per corner.

By engineering standards, if a wheel is optimized for a 1200lbs load it`ll most likely be able to hold +/- 10% of that load to account for errors, not an exorbitant 1845lbs as you suggested. Flow Forming is quite better than cast but please check your data. Keep in mind a wheel rated at the suggested load rating for a BMW of around 695kg will have the same strength regardless if the wheel is forged, flow formed or cast. Only the weight will vary.

A rating of 1200lb per corner is very risky for any BMW.

As mentioned above that number is the not load rating. The load rating is 1200lbs. Which is dangerously low. The wheels are certified for 1200lbs load ratings which is ok if that is all they would ever see. On a BMW wheel intended for the street, 690KGS is needed.

Going by his information the 25lbs 20x9" wheel would be capable of handling a 2748lbs load rating. It's impossible. The wheel would have to be something like 40lbs+ to be able to withstand that. The wheel has a cast face and thin spokes. Even a fully forged wheel with an extra pound or two of spoke material could not withstand 2748lbs. That is off road wheel and diesel truck territory.

And Tarthuss brings up another fantastic issue of load rating being equal among all manufacturing processes when they are designed to withstand the same load rating (assuming they are all optimized). Cast wheels need more metal to reach the same load rating as forged wheels, flow formed wheels save weight in the barrel ONLY over a cast wheel. These wheel would be lighter then a similar design cast wheel with a load rating of 1200lbs (if you can even find another 5x120 wheel on the market with such a low rating) that's it. load rating wise they would be the same. And a forged wheel would be lighter then the above because it would need less material to achieve the same strength. But once that load rating is surpassed, they will all fail in different ways (benefit of forged is they will distort before they crack).

[modbargains]

Hey All,

You know here at **********s we try to do everything we can to introduce you to the best possible products that we feel you guys would love and need. We are passionate about these Forgestar Wheels that many of you are trying to discredit. I feel it's only because you are still unsure of this new brand and are looking for that reassurance.

Mike the owner of **********s will be placing these same wheels on his 135i project. Also, keep in mind that the professionals at the KW Race development team took on these same wheels for the next year to put on their KW Race Car. Do you really think they would jeopardize their company's reputation? I mean KW truly believes in this product because it is such a great wheel. Take into consideration all of the Porsche fanatics who are placing these wheels on their $90,000 cars. Here are a few pictures of the Renntrack track car running the wheels you guys are doubting.

Taken from the Forgestar Blog:


Why is everyone discrediting the SAE J2530 testing standard? I think many of you are misinformed and here is some good information to help you better understand the SAE J2530.

The SAE J2530 Aftermarket Wheel Performance Requirements and Test Procedures is a new standard developed for the aftermarket wheel industry to assure that the wheels produced for use on passenger cars and light trucks are safe and reliable.

The testing requirements of J2530 are composed of 3 performance tests.

1. The first is a Dynamic Cornering Fatigue Test. This is a test that simulates the forces of load put on a wheel when the vehicle is turning a corner or going around a curve.

2. The second is a Dynamic Radial Fatigue Test. This is a test that simulates the forces of load that the wheel experiences with a tire mounted and carrying the weight of the vehicle, passengers and or cargo.

3. The third is an Impact Test. This is a test designed to test the effect on the wheel in the event of an impact to the wheel such as hitting a pot hole or side impact into a curb.

This test supersedes all the previous testing standards.

We appreciate all of the comments, concerns, and questions, you guys have. We do find it unprofessional when a "Concerned enthusiast" (aka as a competing vendor) is trying to discredit me. .
I am not an engineer, I'm just a guy who's trying to introduce new products that I feel you guys would find beneficial to the community. Many doubted **********s when we introduced the CSL Replica wheels to the community and what happened after that.....the creation of the most successful aftermarket wheel today!

Again, I appreciate all the feedback and to be honest with everyone here. The Forgestar representatives and engineers are at SEMA this week, upon their return we will provide more information to you.

Kevin

[Joe Blow]

I got a set of those wheels about a month ago with Micheling PS2, don't know why I waited that long. I love the wheels and you must get rid of those runflats!!!!!

[ptack]

I would love to be able to show you what a set of 18" Forgestar F14s in Titanium look like on my SGM 135i, I really would..

ahem, ahem

[esses]

Originally Posted by ptack

I would love to be able to show you what a set of 18" Forgestar F14s in Titanium look like on my SGM 135i, I really would..

ahem, ahem

P, get them in black, the matte, not the shiny.

[bankerkys]

Originally Posted by Joe Blow

I got a set of those wheels about a month ago with Micheling PS2, don't know why I waited that long. I love the wheels and you must get rid of those runflats!!!!!

Size and offset?

[ptack]

Originally Posted by esses

P, get them in black, the matte, not the shiny.

Oh, I already own a set of Forgestars. Maybe **********s can tell me where they are.