M3 control arms or Camber Plates???

[avolt1234]

I want to give the track a run on stock (or close to) suspension so I can buy corresponding parts based on my driving needs. I have been reading how people are burning up the outside of their tires on completely stock suspension. I want to do either camber plates or M3 control arms to help dial in some extra camber to save my tires. Which one would you recommend and why. Thanks!!

[MightyMouseTech]

Both.

[avolt1234]

Originally Posted by MightyMouseTech

Both.

I was coilovers down the road so wouldnt I need to change my camber plate with the updated coilover specs?

[Ginger_Extract]

Originally Posted by avolt1234

I was coilovers down the road so wouldnt I need to change my camber plate with the updated coilover specs?

With my Vorshlags, I had them "rebuilt" when I changed from OEM suspension to coilovers for ~$100 by Vorshlag.

[2PUTT]

Tire wear is caused by lots of factors:
- track configuration
- track surface
- tire pressure
- driver
- alignment

If you're new at track events, you're better off spending on:
- better brake fluid
- better pads
- improving the nut behind the wheel

The car is very capable. Slowly work your way to the mods as you see fit.
*just my 2 cents.

[lowside67]

If you were chasing purely lap times, the camber plates would be the best option.

However, for just starting to track, it'd be better to start with the M3 arms. The reason for this is that eventually you will want both modifications, but in the interim the M3 arms give you a bit more camber, a bunch better steering feel (stiffer bushings), and no downside on the street as they are not noisier, higher maintenance, etc. If you did camber plates now you would have to redo them, both installation and parts, when you switch to coilovers and they have the potential to make noise, etc. on the street.

Mark

[avolt1234]

Originally Posted by 2PUTT

Tire wear is caused by lots of factors:
- track configuration
- track surface
- tire pressure
- driver
- alignment

If you're new at track events, you're better off spending on:
- better brake fluid
- better pads
- improving the nut behind the wheel

The car is very capable. Slowly work your way to the mods as you see fit.
*just my 2 cents.

I completely agree, I need to find out my driving style and hopefully improve that with time. I just know camber is hard to find with the stock suspension and I dont want to chew through tires every track even

Originally Posted by lowside67

If you were chasing purely lap times, the camber plates would be the best option.

However, for just starting to track, it'd be better to start with the M3 arms. The reason for this is that eventually you will want both modifications, but in the interim the M3 arms give you a bit more camber, a bunch better steering feel (stiffer bushings), and no downside on the street as they are not noisier, higher maintenance, etc. If you did camber plates now you would have to redo them, both installation and parts, when you switch to coilovers and they have the potential to make noise, etc. on the street.

Mark

This is exactly the kind of info I was looking for, thank you

[DietTab]

Control arms are a lot less work.

[chris82]

If you're doing coilovers later, I'd do the M3 arms for now. Then when you upgrade to coilovers, you can buy the correct camber plates to match the spring diameter. For the first couple track events it doesn't really matter

[MightyMouseTech]

Originally Posted by chris82

If you're doing coilovers later, I'd do the M3 arms for now. Then when you upgrade to coilovers, you can buy the correct camber plates to match the spring diameter. For the first couple track events it doesn't really matter

Good advice here. The M3 arms will not give you much extra camber, but it is better than nothing. I was really surprised how little camber our cars have in the front stock, less than 1/2 a degree.

I did the M3 arms and Dinan fixed plates as I have no plans to go coilovers. If anything I will go with a better damper and fixed height spring. My car is a street car first, so I am not willing to compromise on possible clunking or noise from a coilover set up.

Although, I am looking at maybe installing an M3 front knuckle and strut. Not sure what all the pros and cons of that are yet.

[avolt1234]

Originally Posted by chris82

If you're doing coilovers later, I'd do the M3 arms for now. Then when you upgrade to coilovers, you can buy the correct camber plates to match the spring diameter. For the first couple track events it doesn't really matter

That is probably the route that I will go, thanks for the advice

Originally Posted by MightyMouseTech

Good advice here. The M3 arms will not give you much extra camber, but it is better than nothing. I was really surprised how little camber our cars have in the front stock, less than 1/2 a degree.

I did the M3 arms and Dinan fixed plates as I have no plans to go coilovers. If anything I will go with a better damper and fixed height spring. My car is a street car first, so I am not willing to compromise on possible clunking or noise from a coilover set up.

Although, I am looking at maybe installing an M3 front knuckle and strut. Not sure what all the pros and cons of that are yet.

It really does suck how little camber they give us stock, but Ill take the good with the bad. I just see coil overs as a necessary mod due to the ability to gain so much camber

[Jackal]

Originally Posted by 2PUTT

Tire wear is caused by lots of factors:
If you're new at track events, you're better off spending on:
- better brake fluid
- better pads
- improving the nut behind the wheel

Great advice. I always have to remember that no car can out perform braking in acceleration. (60-0 time<0-60 time). Saving time in the corners with good reliable braking will almost always benefit on an AutoX track more.

[chris82]

Originally Posted by MightyMouseTech

Good advice here. The M3 arms will not give you much extra camber, but it is better than nothing. I was really surprised how little camber our cars have in the front stock, less than 1/2 a degree.

I did the M3 arms and Dinan fixed plates as I have no plans to go coilovers. If anything I will go with a better damper and fixed height spring. My car is a street car first, so I am not willing to compromise on possible clunking or noise from a coilover set up.

Although, I am looking at maybe installing an M3 front knuckle and strut. Not sure what all the pros and cons of that are yet.

Clunking? Noise? Who's coilovers do that?

[Solo_M_Tech]

Just replace everything. I did the little at a time method, eventually replaced everything. Once i upgraded the shocks and springs, the stock bushings were too soft. M3 RSFB had to be installed Then i needed more aggressive spring rates and more adjustability so i went to coilovers, then M3 control arms and tension arms. Still looking for more stiffness. Save up and do everything at once and buy quality equipment. It's alot more expensive doing everything twice.

[MightyMouseTech]

Originally Posted by chris82

Clunking? Noise? Who's coilovers do that?

[02rsxpilot]

Originally Posted by ApexResistance

Just replace everything. I did the little at a time method, eventually replaced everything. Once i upgraded the shocks and springs, the stock bushings were too soft. M3 RSFB had to be installed Then i needed more aggressive spring rates and more adjustability so i went to coilovers, then M3 control arms and tension arms. Still looking for more stiffness. Save up and do everything at once and buy quality equipment. It's alot more expensive doing everything twice.

Good advice because it accurately implies that the components of the car all work in concert. My caveat would be it isn't worth spending thousands for a complete overhaul until you know what you want and why.

Specific to the OP's question, as someone who has both M3 arms and Dinan camber plates on an otherwise stock car, I'd say the M3 arms will make a subtle difference in feel (not as much as this forum would have you believe, but it is there), whereas the camber plates are basically unnoticeable. The M3 arms are also materially more expensive, both parts and labor. If camber is your only goal, the plates are the best bang for the buck. If you want to begin a more holistic performance overhaul, I'd start with the M3 arms because you won't need to replace them down the road. Then again, you'd have no trouble reselling Dinan plates here at a modest discount if need be.

[avolt1234]

Originally Posted by 02rsxpilot

Good advice because it accurately implies that the components of the car all work in concert. My caveat would be it isn't worth spending thousands for a complete overhaul until you know what you want and why.

Specific to the OP's question, as someone who has both M3 arms and Dinan camber plates on an otherwise stock car, I'd say the M3 arms will make a subtle difference in feel (not as much as this forum would have you believe, but it is there), whereas the camber plates are basically unnoticeable. The M3 arms are also materially more expensive, both parts and labor. If camber is your only goal, the plates are the best bang for the buck. If you want to begin a more holistic performance overhaul, I'd start with the M3 arms because you won't need to replace them down the road. Then again, you'd have no trouble reselling Dinan plates here at a modest discount if need be.

I went with the M3 control arms just based on the reasoning that I wont need to replace them down the road when I get coils. If I didnt have the replace the CPs when I got coils then it would be a different story. Now its just a matter of time before the coils go on

[tuj]

dude I just took my car on it's first track day (not MY first track day, mind you), and the stock car on stock tires did just fine. No need to modify the suspension yet. 8/10ths is in the driver, not the car.

[avolt1234]

Originally Posted by tuj

dude I just took my car on it's first track day (not MY first track day, mind you), and the stock car on stock tires did just fine. No need to modify the suspension yet. 8/10ths is in the driver, not the car.

This will be my first time actually tracking a car, I have rode in one before but never driven. I will have a lot of learning to do once I get behind the wheel, but that is what the track is for

[DietTab]

Originally Posted by tuj

dude I just took my car on it's first track day (not MY first track day, mind you), and the stock car on stock tires did just fine.

If fine is... slow.

[tuj]

yeah, it *was* slow. RFT's are slow. we're going to fix that next session... My point still stands that for a 20-25 minute session on the track, on stock tires, the stock components are fine.

[CrimsonXV]

Total noob question here, why do camber plates have to be replaced?