1 Series M Coupe vs RS3 - Specs and Styling Compared

[lasovan]

to me RS3 is the ultimate hairdresser's hot hatch

[James T. Kirk]

The BMW 1M is going the direction of a more organic life-form look.
Audi maintains its Iron Man square face look.

Behold the abomination...

[Robert]

Aesthetics alone, baring any difference in picture quality, the RS3 looks so much sharper.

[madfast]

Originally Posted by TrojanBMW

I have arguments with my dad about this. He's got an S8 and is convinced that Audi has the right arrangement.

I have yet to convince him that he's dead wrong.

the rule of thumb that i've noticed is that the more natural motion is always the upshift.

and that makes sense. if you're racing, the upshift is more important. you want to eek out every millisecond advantage you can. conversely you downshift under braking so you dont need the more natural motion.

lets see some examples:

sequential stick shift: more natural motion? pull back. how do they do it in racing? bull back! coincidence? NO!

paddle shifters: more natural motion? pull back! lefty or righty? most people right handed so right paddle upshift? YES!! coincidence? NO!

race bikes: more natural motion? step down. how do they do it in racing? step down! dedicated weekend racers will convert the standard shift pattern on their bikes to a "race shift pattern"

wrc style single paddle: pull = upshift, push = downshift, paddle on right side

skoda wrc style steering wheel rings: pull = upshift, push = downshift

honda motorcycle Dual clutch: trigger pull = up, thumb button push = down

and the list goes on...

lets see your dad refute all of the above examples...

[Joer]

Originally Posted by uhn2000

The target market for the RS3 completely evades me but hey maybe in Europe this kind of stuff is big!

Probably the same we think about an F150 Raptor...

[Joer]

I think both cars are great. Audi definitely has the best interior.
However I just love the 1M!

[TrojanBMW]

Originally Posted by marcel b

If that would be the case, then all race cars have it the wrong way.
It is much more natural to pull when accellerating und to push while braking. (think about your own bodyweight under acceleration and under braking) You can use this as your argument. I am curious to hear the counter arguement why he thinks Audi has the right arrangement....

I "think" that the reasoning they give is that pushing feels like "up" as in going up in gear, and vice versa. The Porsche PDK is the same way, which isn't surprising given the close relationship between Audi/VW and Porsche.

In practice, it feels really awkward and just plain backwards.

[MrHarris]

Wow 235 front 225 rear what is going on.

[Yogijet]

Originally Posted by TrojanBMW

I "think" that the reasoning they give is that pushing feels like "up" as in going up in gear, and vice versa. The Porsche PDK is the same way, which isn't surprising given the close relationship between Audi/VW and Porsche.

In practice, it feels really awkward and just plain backwards.

The BMW feels quite natural and I think they got it right. Case in point - I have a Step which tends to move off in 2nd in regular driving. Without thinking, to take off after a back up, for example, I routinely flick the lever left from D and then up(-)/forward to ensure I move off in 1st, quite similar to how would one actually select first from neutral in the typical manual trans car.

[White Shark]

Originally Posted by MrHarris

Wow 235 front 225 rear what is going on.

RS3's FWD-biased Haldex AWD...



(source: http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthr...=582583&page=2)

[JB135MDCT]

1M is the "KaninchenorHase Jägermeister"

[BMWAutoXer]

Originally Posted by NFIDDY5

Tires Front 245/35 R19 93Y XL 235/35 R19
Tires Rear 265/35 R19 98Y XL 225/35 R19


Am I reading this correctly? Does Audi know something that other manufacturer's of AWD platforms don't? Wider wheels up front? I know its not uncommon to have a wider track up front, but wider tires? Never came across anyone that tried that in my EVO / STi days. Interesting concept. Or typo. Either way, the 1M is the better of the two IMHO. But I am a BMW homer.

It's a FWD design and afterthought haldex diff. They don't even have real Quattro AWD and there is gobs of torque steer from the transversely mounted engine. To be perfectly honest, it's a joke of a car if you drive a few of them around a track. They stuck the wider tires on the front to try and minimize the torque steer and make the car more prone to oversteer like a real performance car instead of the nose in understeer it's built to do.

[BMWAutoXer]

Originally Posted by ArabianSensation

Is the RS3 a front-biased AWD system? Quattro comes in both front and rear biased versions. If the RS3 is front biased, this would make sense.

The A3/S3/RS3 aren't quattro. The only actual quattro left are the A4 and A6. The rest use the same trash haldex on demand dif you get in a Ford. Audi took a page from VWs book and screwed up their engineering cred with it, then proceeded to draw attention to it with their truth in engineering ad campaign

[11N55]

Honestly I think we would have to see both cars in person before judging their looks but I would have to go with the BMW. The Audi being FWD and no 6MT completely kills it not to mention its a hatch...

[Pete_vB]

Originally Posted by BMWAutoXer

The A3/S3/RS3 aren't quattro. The only actual quattro left are the A4 and A6. The rest use the same trash haldex on demand dif you get in a Ford. Audi took a page from VWs book and screwed up their engineering cred with it, then proceeded to draw attention to it with their truth in engineering ad campaign

I'm curious if you've spent enough time in a haldex car to get used to it? I prefer a full-time 4wd, but the haldex is quite good once you get used to it- most of the people that trash it don't have enough seat-time to adapt. Certainly the haldex is going to let the RS3 crush the 1M on a wet road... Which won't stop me getting the 1M.

[conneem-TT]

Veyron is also Haldex based, just thought I'd throw that out there.

On more normal models the general rule is Haldex is used on the tranverse engine layout platforms and torsen on the longitudinal layouts. Other cars using Haldex include the Saab X, the Volvo XC70/90 ect.

The latest generation (genIV) is much improved on the older models, it was released sometime in 2008. They got rid of the hydraulic pump and replaced it with an electric pump to build pressure, coupled with a proportional pressure release valve, so when the rear wheels demand torque, the valve closes and hydraulic pressure is already there so unlike the the older versions it can operate independent of slip i.e. as in the older cars you would notice/need a little bit of front wheel slip to build pressure in order to engage the haldex clutch before the rear got power. Now it distributes torque based on steering angle, throttle input, speed & slip and can apply it instantly when desired due to the pressure needed to engage the clutch being pre charged by the electric pump. Another plus is they actually made the system lighter to while making it function better. 4 wheel burn out's can be done if that's your thing.

Bahhhh, four wheel burnout, bap, bap, bap, bap

Performance wise I think the 1M will be a more engaging machine. It is interesting to look at the torque spread, the 5 clyinder Audi engine is very impressive with peak torque over a wider rpm band than the 1M and peak power holding to higher rpm also.

Looks wise, the RS3 would seem to be more of a sleeper, whereas the 1M looks maybe overstyled beside it. That department will be down to personal tastes i suppose.

[Art__Vandelay]

The 1M looks more sexy, while the RS3 looks okay, but the exterior is pretty boring (I'd say as it used to be by Audi). The Audi interior however is way more classy. But I'm absolutely sure the 1M is much more fun to drive. No doubt I'd prefer the 1M.

[Future M1 owner]

Originally Posted by conneem-TT

Veyron is also Haldex based, just thought I'd throw that out there.

On more normal models the general rule is Haldex is used on the tranverse engine layout platforms and torsen on the longitudinal layouts. Other cars using Haldex include the Saab X, the Volvo XC70/90 ect.

The latest generation (genIV) is much improved on the older models, it was released sometime in 2008.

Lamborghini 4wd systems are Haldex based as well, including the new Aventador.

[Wolf]

the bimmer's back is definitely sexier, more aggressive. I like the front bumper and the air curtain but I never liked the headlights, they never fitted into bmw's profile. I like audi's front, all of it but its too shiny too much bling.... i had circles in any interior so audi's interior really suck... the bimmer is same bland look. I think the audi will win tho I am 1M fan... i still will buy the bimmer..

[Joer]

Originally Posted by Croatian test driver

The 1M looks more sexy, while the RS3 looks okay, but the exterior is pretty boring (I'd say as it used to be by Audi). The Audi interior however is way more classy. But I'm absolutely sure the 1M is much more fun to drive. No doubt I'd prefer the 1M.

Completely agree! he 1M just makes more excited...!

[TrojanBMW]

I think the styling of the 1M is going to win out over the Audi over the long run. 10-15 years now, it will still look like a BMW and a nice one at that. Over the same time the RS3 (and most Audis for that matter) will become really dated; the front is too wild, and the rest of the car too boring.

I've always thought the Audi's biggest problem was that they never developed a consistent design language for their cars that could connect from one generation to another. You can definitely tell that the 1M is related to an E30 or even a 2002.

[hks786]

I heard that the new RS3 did the ring in 8.09. I dont know what the source of this is though. We have already heard the time of 8.12 for the 1M. It will be interesting to see how the 1M and RS3 compare.