Dinan 335i software announced! -- 384hp / 421 tq

atr_hugo · 12-07-2007, 07:09 AM

The piggyback unit is a physical add-on and essentially sends modified signals back to the stock ECU. It utilizes separate software code to derive the signals that will be sent to the stock ECU which 'trick' the ECU into increasing performance.

Dinan's approach would appear to be providing modified ECU software. So they essentially take BMW's code and tweak it then 'reflash' the code into the existing ECU.

Here's a wiki on flash memory: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flash_memory

joelk · 12-07-2007, 07:46 AM

I don't understand why anyone would prefer a piggy-back unit to a reflash. (bmw "approved" reflash)

$2k seems cheap to me. Re: Vishnu, I'm hesitant to do business with someone that has so many vocal haters.

No clue what happened to the Z8 guys. Off to research that right now.

edit: hmmm so the only z8 issue i found involved methods of installation of headers in the z8. not software related but interesting to read.

BMWeber · 12-07-2007, 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garrett

??
I like my warranty... so the $700 extra for the Dinan flash at my dealer is well worth the piggyback Procede!

Both are great tunes, I just prefere DINAN. BMW encrypts their ECU, so the only way for a tuner to "flash" it is to break the encryption (impossible) or work with BMW and pay a fee to have the software "kernal" tunable.

Shiv would love to have full use of the ECU.. instead of using his very skillfull tricks.

Turner motorsports has had a reflash out for over 6 months

http://www.turnermotorsport.com/html...CT_ID=TN54-ST1

chessie1629 · 12-07-2007, 08:13 AM

Is it possible that the big increase for the Dinan reflash is not really so big because BMW underrated the 300 hp to begin with. The proof would be Dyno tests with and without.

BMWeber · 12-07-2007, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joelk

I don't understand why anyone would prefer a piggy-back unit to a reflash. (bmw "approved" reflash)

$2k seems cheap to me. Re: Vishnu, I'm hesitant to do business with someone that has so many vocal haters.

No clue what happened to the Z8 guys. Off to research that right now.

edit: hmmm so the only z8 issue i found involved methods of installation of headers in the z8. not software related but interesting to read.

More HP and Tunability. I am personally looking for maximum tunability and hp and I'm will to take the warranty risk. I want to be able to through some race gas in the car and turn up the power or add other modifications and be able to get a map that was tuned for lets say catless down pipes and high flow IC.

BMWeber · 12-07-2007, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chessie1629

Is it possible that the big increase for the Dinan reflash is not really so big because BMW underrated the 300 hp to begin with. The proof would be Dyno tests with and without.

I fined that pretty interesting also. I cant wait to see the whp.

joelk · 12-07-2007, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BMWeber

More HP and Tunability. I am personally looking for maximum tunability and hp and I'm will to take the warranty risk. I want to be able to through some race gas in the car and turn up the power or add other modifications and be able to get a map that was tuned for lets say catless down pipes and high flow IC.

ah so flexibility. yeah that makes sense. using different maps for different purposes. but HP, that doesn't make sense to me because a reflash is as much control as you're going to get over the system. unless when you say that you are comparing vishnu to dinan results and not the underlying methods.

BMWeber · 12-07-2007, 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joelk

ah so flexibility. yeah that makes sense. using different maps for different purposes. but HP, that doesn't make sense to me because a reflash is as much control as you're going to get over the system. unless when you say that you are comparing vishnu to dinan results and not the underlying methods.

just talking about current results on HP not ability. I know a reflash is the better method.

manj · 12-07-2007, 10:38 AM

Can someone just give me a simple answer theres been a lot of here and there opinions, I want to be able to walk into my dealership with the car and they do whatever the f i want without them saying o looks like you voided your warranty, Which one do i get? Dont get me oppinions about which one better i just want to know which one will keep my warranty intact with my vehicle.

BMWeber · 12-07-2007, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manj

Can someone just give me a simple answer theres been a lot of here and there opinions, I want to be able to walk into my dealership with the car and they do whatever the f i want without them saying o looks like you voided your warranty, Which one do i get? Dont get me oppinions about which one better i just want to know which one will keep my warranty intact with my vehicle.

Dinan

Fast Kiwi · 12-07-2007, 11:38 AM

+1^^ done and done..

Jeff_DML · 12-07-2007, 12:51 PM

to clarify, Dinan matches the bmw warranty, not quite the same. Also I think you need to still go to a BMW dealer that sells dinan.

BMWeber · 12-07-2007, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff_DML

to clarify, Dinan matches the bmw warranty, not quite the same. Also I think you need to still go to a BMW dealer that sells dinan.

from what Ive herd your are very correct. also with all the extra power I'm a little skeptical whats guna happen when you go to the dealer with broken tranny. and BMW wont certify a previously owned dinan car so I wouldn't try the dinan flash if your leasing the car

aus · 12-07-2007, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joelk

I don't understand why anyone would prefer a piggy-back unit to a reflash. (bmw "approved" reflash)

$2k seems cheap to me. Re: Vishnu, I'm hesitant to do business with someone that has so many vocal haters.

No clue what happened to the Z8 guys. Off to research that right now.

edit: hmmm so the only z8 issue i found involved methods of installation of headers in the z8. not software related but interesting to read.

They told the dealers to CUT the ALUMINUM frame of the Z8 in order to make the E39 M5 headers fit!!! They did the right thing for each owner, but it still says something about a tuner.

As for the reflash being impossible...http://www.bimmerzone.com/BMW_Shark_Injector.htm

aus · 12-07-2007, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manj

Can someone just give me a simple answer theres been a lot of here and there opinions, I want to be able to walk into my dealership with the car and they do whatever the f i want without them saying o looks like you voided your warranty, Which one do i get? Dont get me oppinions about which one better i just want to know which one will keep my warranty intact with my vehicle.

The Dinan software could void your warranty just as easily as any aftermarket tune. With piggyback systems, you could at least remove it before bringing the car in. The only difference is Dinan warranties the car, supposedly for what ever the dealer refuses to fix. I don't know what they'd say if a tranny blew, since it's not designed for that much torque.

Also, many dealers are now selling the Turbo Tuner in their parts department.

BForbes · 12-07-2007, 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aus

The Dinan software could void your warranty just as easily as any aftermarket tune. With piggyback systems, you could at least remove it before bringing the car in. The only difference is Dinan warranties the car, supposedly for what ever the dealer refuses to fix. I don't know what they'd say if a tranny blew, since it's not designed for that much torque.

Also, many dealers are now selling the Turbo Tuner in their parts department.

Not trying to be a smart-ass but whose to say the tranny isnt designed for that much torque?

aus · 12-08-2007, 07:18 PM

There was a thread on that on E90Post about the tranny not being rated for more than somehthing like 350 ft-lbs.

larryn · 12-08-2007, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aus

There was a thread on that on E90Post about the tranny not being rated for more than somehthing like 350 ft-lbs.

I would be very surprised if that is the case, especially since the stock 335i is producing about 289 ft lb at the wheels. With 14% drivetrain loss, it's dangerously close to the limits of the tranny without any modifications.

With all of the 1/4 mile junkies/street racers on e90post running tunes (and even race gas, even a few more with drag slicks), there would be quite a few blown tranny threads by now.

alter ego · 12-08-2007, 08:27 PM

I would speak with your advisor about it before doing anything if you are worried about the warranty. It comes down to c.y.o.a. If your relationship is good and they know what you are doing or if you let them do the install you are in much better shape. A friend of mine works for a BMW dealership and has a 335 coupe. Its still a virgen though, no mods. The techs have been to BMW schools where they plug in BMW flashes that put out 350+hp and similar torque. I wouldn't be surprised if we see a ZHP version in the next couple of years. The hardware is stout enough. If you are asking for a BMW sponsored written warranty on non BMW mods you will not find one..... Hell they won't warranty damage from radars and auto starters!!!

mkiiieustyle · 12-09-2007, 01:05 AM

from what i know about toyota factory warranty is that if it's not a toyota FACTORY defect then it aint covered under warranty, if toyota didn't make the problem then why should they fix it?

Crowley · 12-09-2007, 11:36 AM

I would think it woudl be hard to believe that Dinan would release seomthing that factory parts couldn't handle as they would be fronting the cost for those who broke those parts. I am sure they have done their home work ..

Crowley

~AJ · 12-09-2007, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crowley

I would think it woudl be hard to believe that Dinan would release seomthing that factory parts couldn't handle as they would be fronting the cost for those who broke those parts. I am sure they have done their home work ..

Crowley

There are many ways of avoiding liability. Like: "for off-road use only" or just look at what Mitsubishi did with Evo owners. They didn't cover drivetrain failures for people they could prove were engaged in racing.

What is the replacement cost (engine price and labor) for a factory new N54?

I predict that Dinan won't be replacing or paying for any motor that is destroyed after installing Dinan's sofware. You assume the risk; you are on your own.

12-07-2007, 07:09 AM	#23
atr_hugo No longer moderate 325 Rep 4,401 Posts Drives: '13 135i Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: - iTrader: (0)	The piggyback unit is a physical add-on and essentially sends modified signals back to the stock ECU. It utilizes separate software code to derive the signals that will be sent to the stock ECU which 'trick' the ECU into increasing performance. Dinan's approach would appear to be providing modified ECU software. So they essentially take BMW's code and tweak it then 'reflash' the code into the existing ECU. Here's a wiki on flash memory: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flash_memory
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12-07-2007, 07:46 AM	#24
joelk Lieutenant Colonel 37 Rep 1,680 Posts Drives: Space Gray E90 M3 Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Atlanta iTrader: (0)	I don't understand why anyone would prefer a piggy-back unit to a reflash. (bmw "approved" reflash) $2k seems cheap to me. Re: Vishnu, I'm hesitant to do business with someone that has so many vocal haters. No clue what happened to the Z8 guys. Off to research that right now. edit: hmmm so the only z8 issue i found involved methods of installation of headers in the z8. not software related but interesting to read. __________________ e90 M3, Space Gray / Extended Black, ZCP, ZCV, ZP2, DCT sold: 2008 BS 135i 6MT
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12-07-2007, 08:13 AM	#26
chessie1629 Enlisted Member 0 Rep 42 Posts Drives: Join Date: Jul 2007 iTrader: (0)	Is it possible that the big increase for the Dinan reflash is not really so big because BMW underrated the 300 hp to begin with. The proof would be Dyno tests with and without.
	Appreciate 0

12-07-2007, 10:38 AM	#31
manj E90s DJ 8 Rep 134 Posts Drives: 2011 BMW 323i Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Toronto, Ontario iTrader: (0)	Can someone just give me a simple answer theres been a lot of here and there opinions, I want to be able to walk into my dealership with the car and they do whatever the f i want without them saying o looks like you voided your warranty, Which one do i get? Dont get me oppinions about which one better i just want to know which one will keep my warranty intact with my vehicle.
	Appreciate 0

12-07-2007, 11:38 AM	#33
Fast Kiwi First Lieutenant 7 Rep 342 Posts Drives: Si Z4R & Si X3 Join Date: May 2008 Location: Milwaukee iTrader: (0)	+1^^ done and done..
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12-07-2007, 12:51 PM	#34
Jeff_DML Lieutenant 24 Rep 472 Posts Drives: 01 996TT Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: San Diego iTrader: (0)	to clarify, Dinan matches the bmw warranty, not quite the same. Also I think you need to still go to a BMW dealer that sells dinan.
	Appreciate 0

12-08-2007, 07:18 PM	#39
aus Major General 892 Rep 9,032 Posts Drives: Odysse Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Seal Beach, CA iTrader: (10)	There was a thread on that on E90Post about the tranny not being rated for more than somehthing like 350 ft-lbs.
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12-08-2007, 08:27 PM	#41
alter ego New Member 0 Rep 17 Posts Drives: Join Date: Dec 2007 iTrader: (0)	I would speak with your advisor about it before doing anything if you are worried about the warranty. It comes down to c.y.o.a. If your relationship is good and they know what you are doing or if you let them do the install you are in much better shape. A friend of mine works for a BMW dealership and has a 335 coupe. Its still a virgen though, no mods. The techs have been to BMW schools where they plug in BMW flashes that put out 350+hp and similar torque. I wouldn't be surprised if we see a ZHP version in the next couple of years. The hardware is stout enough. If you are asking for a BMW sponsored written warranty on non BMW mods you will not find one..... Hell they won't warranty damage from radars and auto starters!!!
	Appreciate 0

12-09-2007, 01:05 AM	#42
mkiiieustyle Private First Class 10 Rep 151 Posts Drives: mk3 vr6 jetta, soon to be 135i Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: va beach iTrader: (0)	from what i know about toyota factory warranty is that if it's not a toyota FACTORY defect then it aint covered under warranty, if toyota didn't make the problem then why should they fix it?
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12-09-2007, 11:36 AM	#43
Crowley Major 54 Rep 1,015 Posts Drives: Join Date: Oct 2007 iTrader: (0)	I would think it woudl be hard to believe that Dinan would release seomthing that factory parts couldn't handle as they would be fronting the cost for those who broke those parts. I am sure they have done their home work .. Crowley __________________ The last words on the powerplant should go to a clearly overwhelmed Hormazd Sorabjee, editor and publisher of Autocar India: “There is something simply magical about BMW’s in-line six. It has a creamy smoothness that makes velvet feel like sandpaper.”
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