1 series M intercooler is the same as 135i

[cooler2442]

Originally Posted by TTurboBullett

You are aware the helix has an ambient face 56% larger than the ETS and has more charge rows(13 vs 9 or 10) right? Our exposed ambient face is about 70% larger and we also use a very dense offset staggered fin core!

I'm also aware that Helix requires cutting while ETS requires 0 cutting or any kind of modifications which is the reason alot of us go for the ETS 5".

[TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management]

Originally Posted by cooler2442

I'm also aware that Helix requires cutting while ETS requires 0 cutting or any kind of modifications which is the reason alot of us go for the ETS 5".

The latest gen helix only needs a very minor bit of trimming up near the ait sensor that's it!

[cooler2442]

Originally Posted by TTurboBullett

The latest gen helix only needs a very minor bit of trimming up near the ait sensor that's it!

It's still some kind of trimming. I personally do not want to do any kind of trimming at all when putting on an intercooler. The manufacturers who designed the intercoolers should have been smarter like ETS and release 2 versions. One which requires no trimming at all and then a second bigger one for those that don't care and are willing to trim.

[RnmEvo9]

I trimmed very little for my Helix to fit my 135i. Its very minor and worth the hassle in my opinion. Its not like people will be able to tell you trimmed on the inside of the bumper anyways.

[TunedM2C]

Originally Posted by TTurboBullett

The latest gen helix only needs a very minor bit of trimming up near the ait sensor that's it!

Can you post a pic of this area?

[JHOOPS2]

Any of them are better than stock. Trust me on this, once you pull the stock unit out you will be surprised that it works at all. It makes the stock IC on my old WRX look like a work of genius. Pics really don't show how big a pile of junk it is.

[Eddie135]

Originally Posted by 1speedbike

Yes it is. If you're going to a track, or drive like a maniac with lots of speeding up fast and slowing down, then an intercooler is a good idea. I know Cobb insists that you upgrade the IC to use their more aggressive tunes, but if you're not sustaining the engine load for an extended time and only doing a couple quick pulls for fun, it's not necessary. Mine has been holding up just fine for daily driving, even with lots of hard starts from stoplights, highway onramps, etc. For sustained driving like that, though, the intercooler helps a lot.

Also, methanol injection is just as effective, if not more, than an intercooler at keeping the temps down, too. But methanol is its own can of worms.

thanks for the feedback

[2012one35i]

Originally Posted by JHOOPS2

Also, to be a bit more scientific I have some base numbers without the FMIC on my dynojet, and as soon as the weather matches most closely to what it was when I did those pulls I will ratchet the car back down and see what a difference the FMIC made on the same tune. I have a load cell attached to my DJ, so I can do some long controlled runs and generate some real world load and temps for good comparison.

Wow! I leave the thread for a few hours and look what happens! JHOOPS2, I really appreciate what you're trying to do here. When the weather complies, I sure hope you report back on this thread with your results. This is not a "Helix is better than ETS" thread. It's about what point in modding does a $1000 intercooler swap start making sense.

And people who state that an intercooler makes 25hp, or whatever, don't seem to get it either. Intercoolers don't "make" horsepower. Intercoolers reduce the knock threshold and increase charge density, which allow the ECU to increase timing and fuel, which make horsepower.

Another quote about 18psi is 18psi regardless of turbo size is also off the mark. Big turbos make cooler boost, small turbos make hotter boost, and when your boost is hot, you have less air molecules available per psi to make power.

Which brings us to the fact that our engines are 10.2:1 compression ratio. This is high compression, folks. That means our turbos are designed to provide a small amount of boost to augment the high static compression ratio. I intend to modify my car to the tune of Dinan Stage 2 or Burger Stage 1. At 400whp, no doubt I need an intercooler. But at 350-380 crank horsepower, do I really need to dump a grand on an intercooler? Wow! Thanks for letting me vent.

[Colt]

Originally Posted by Tuned1M

Can you post a pic of this area?

This. Is it metal trimming or plastic trimming?

[BMW86]

Any FMIC is better than the stock IC. I've seen real world logs of 2 cars being compared side by side and the IAT's were consistently lower, by a lot!

I wouldn't be buying a FMIC for horsepower though, there's better ways to spend your money. It's good for consistent back to back runs as it minimises heatsoak and helps keep the temps down, which is all you could really want.

If you are buying the FMIC for power gains, I can tell you from real world testing it's all top of 3rd gear and above. Don't expect anything in 1st and 2nd gear. There is a noticeable difference in 4th but not sure how many people go WOT in 4th!

[2012one35i]

Originally Posted by BMW86

Any FMIC is better than the stock IC. I've seen real world logs of 2 cars being compared side by side and the IAT's were consistently lower, by a lot!

I wouldn't be buying a FMIC for horsepower though, there's better ways to spend your money. It's good for consistent back to back runs as it minimises heatsoak and helps keep the temps down, which is all you could really want.

If you are buying the FMIC for power gains, I can tell you from real world testing it's all top of 3rd gear and above. Don't expect anything in 1st and 2nd gear. There is a noticeable difference in 4th but not sure how many people go WOT in 4th!

Great post!
Let's separate myths and opinions from real world observations!

[1Fasst1]

Originally Posted by Angerman

This. Is it metal trimming or plastic trimming?

The trimming for an intercooler install is no big deal. This is just one of the many installs that is on this forum.

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showt...cooler+install

[2012one35i]

Originally Posted by 135iUSN

---

so what boost does the dinan stage go up to?
The web site only says "Dinan Stage 2 Performance Engine Software safely increases turbo-boost pressure"

glad I have an early update as they dropped the HP/TQ on new version of SW.

Dinan claims 355 (crank) hp and 401 (crank) lbs/ft. Good enough for me. The torque is ungodly. So is the price.
But, would I notice any gains at this level of power with an upgraded intercooler? Hmmm......

http://www.dinancars.com/shop/D900-3...55.aspx#page=1

[JHOOPS2]

FWIW, I paid $599 for my AA sport IC in a GP that is still going on. The quality is top notch and appears to do exactly what I expected it to do.

[Matador]

I have Dinan Stage 2 and you will definitly notice the gain in power without the intercooler - Adding the intercooler is up to your driving style - i doubt it will add noticeable amounts of power but it will allow you to maintain that power for longer runs - I am also considering adding an intercooler and looking at FMIC or ETS right now - i am not looking to increase boost , but just the ability to keep power longer - if that makes sense -

[1Pirate]

Originally Posted by 2012one35i

This is not a "Helix is better than ETS" thread. It's about what point in modding does a $1000 intercooler swap start making sense.

I intend to modify my car to the tune of Dinan Stage 2 or Burger Stage 1. At 400whp, no doubt I need an intercooler. But at 350-380 crank horsepower, do I really need to dump a grand on an intercooler? Wow! Thanks for letting me vent.

Your question is the same as mine. However, I already have the Dinan Stage 2 upgrade on my N54 motor. I've had the Dinan tune since late Septmber and love it. Lots of torque. But I'm concerned how the car will react when it gets hot in June, July and August, especially with the heat and humidity here in eastern North Carolina. A bigger and better intercooler should help with the heat issues.

I also would prefer something that bolts in without having to make modifications to the car. At this point I'm leaning toward the ETS 5" intercooler if I decide to do the mod. I spoke at length with Harold from HP yesterday and he has the ETS intercooler on his 1M. It's making 400+ rwhp. He told me he went with the ETS because he didn't have to make any modifications to his car and because it allowed him to use the particular tune he was running, where the stock intercooler did not.

Bottom line if I lived in a cooler region of the country I might not consider changing the intercooler with the Dinan Stage 2 tune, but living in the south it seems to make since to consider upgrading the intercooler if you have a tune to help reduce heat soak issues.

[1Pirate]

Originally Posted by Matador

I have Dinan Stage 2 and you will definitly notice the gain in power without the intercooler - Adding the intercooler is up to your driving style - i doubt it will add noticeable amounts of power but it will allow you to maintain that power for longer runs - I am also considering adding an intercooler and looking at FMIC or ETS right now - i am not looking to increase boost , but just the ability to keep power longer - if that makes sense -

I'm right there with you.

[Matador]

Yup !! heat and humidiyt are also not too shabby in our parts

[TunedM2C]

Originally Posted by 1Fasst1

The trimming for an intercooler install is no big deal. This is just one of the many installs that is on this forum.

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showt...cooler+install

At the end of that thread it appears he's now trying to go back to stock but can't because of the possible trimming?

[1Fasst1]

Originally Posted by Tuned1M

At the end of that thread it appears he's now trying to go back to stock but can't because of the possible trimming?

Not really sure what problem he was having. He was running a HPF fmic which uses the factory c-clips and piping. Due to the weight of this intercooler it comes with extra support braces. As the stock intercooler is secured by one bolt at each end and c-clips at the piping it should not be an issue to put the stock one back. Most of the after market intercoolers are thicker than stock and just need a little more clearance with some of the plastic pieces inside the front bumper. If anyone is not comfortable doing a slight amount of trimming, the 5" ETS should be your ticket. No trimming required.

[2012one35i]

We're starting to drift off topic again. I am hoping to keep this a generic intercooler thread. Not a "who's is bigger/better," but at what power level is it profitable, so to speak, to make the switch.

[JHOOPS2]

My Thoughts: Keep in mind, not all tunes are equal as far as power goes, so i am just basing this off of average WOT boost.

Stock boost

• Daily driver : OE is fine
• Spirited Driving : OE is fine
• Autocross or tracking : OE is fine, but if you are in boost often then an aftermarket will benefit you in keeping iat's down and prevent timing retard due to intake temps.
  

Up to a 12 psi tune

• Daily Driver : OE is fine
• Spirited Driving : OE, but you could start to benefit from an aftermarket unit.
• Autocross or Tracking : Aftermarket unit recommended for extended peak performance

12-15 psi tune

• Daily Driver : OE is fine for short freeway entry ramp bursts.
• Spirited Driving : OE, but you could start to benefit from an aftermarket unit.
• Autocross or Tracking : Here is where I recommend a mandatory upgrade to a better FMIC.

>15 psi tune

• Daily Driver : OE will be fine, but to avoid knock when accelerating hard I recommend a better FMIC.
• Spirited Driving : After market FMIC for continual peak performance.
• Autocross or Tracking : If you want to go more than one lap and make the power that you are aiming for then yes, you need an FMIC.