The 328i is almost a pointless car.

[hbiscuit]

agreed

[ptack]

The 328i is simply the least expensive 3 series. I agree that the rationale for the coupe is probably limited to styling, cost and badge, but that can be big for a lot of people.

Heck, I'm much more perturbed when I see people I suspect to be car-clueless driving 135is.

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by Citizen Z

I'm actually seriously looking at the 2011 Mustang as a replacement for my 135i, for what its worth, and the 2010 Camaro wasn't available when I purchased my 1er. I'm not a badge whore, I'm a power whore and a power slide slut. If a car can't hustle around corners, I don't give a damn, which is why I've passed on American muscle cars until now. As for this magical "BMWness" you refer to, I haven't really seen it. And I certainly don't think the 1er is more prestegious than a 3er; hell, most people don't even know the 1er exists, which is why I'm talking about the 328i compared to the rest of the class in which it competes. The Roundel, on any model, regarless the vehicle's spec, is a desirable name plate and one of the reasons people buy BMWs. That desirability comes because BMW makes better cars than a 328i with an automatic.

The average BMW buyer (or premium car buyer in general) doesn't give a damn how fast the car is. You're looking at this with a very narrow view. You're not the target demographic for a 328i, but that doesn't make it worthless. It's one of BMW's best selling vehicles, and I'm pretty sure that selling cars is the point of making them. There is no better BMW than the 328i for the same money that will do the same things.

I love my 135i, but the fact of the matter is the backseat is all but worthless for adults, even for short trips. That's not an issue for me, but it is for a LARGE majority of the buying public.

The short answer is, just because the car isn't for you doesn't make it "pointless", and the sale figures CLEARLY demonstrate that.

[Monterra]

True, but for me its like this:
Once the 1 series came out the 328i coupe that I once pined for suddenly appeared big (although not appreciably on the inside), overweight(the 1 should be lighter too, granted) and overpriced. Pointless for BMW to manufacture- obviously not. Irrelevant to me after 128 debuted, basically yes.

[The Cthulhu]

I had an auto 328i as a loaner, and it was a fun car to drive if you use tiptronic to keep it above 3000 RPM.

[CrazyIvan]

Once 1 Series was released in US, it was a done deal for me. 135i is a great car for a money but it isnt for everyone. It is somewhat overpriced for its size, etc. But you cant use the same rationale when you are buying BMW. You are buying the whole experience: handling, driving feel, etc. And for many people 328 delivers plenty. We are spoiled here, Europeans will be perfectly happy with 318 but it still going to set them back as much as we pay for 328. Have you seen the prices on 135i in Germany? It sells for something around $60k. I guess its all in a perspective. If all we had was 318 and 320, then 328 would feel like an M car in comparison.

[imported_mega]

Originally Posted by Monterra

True, but for me its like this:
Once the 1 series came out the 328i coupe that I once pined for suddenly appeared big (although not appreciably on the inside), overweight(the 1 should be lighter too, granted) and overpriced. Pointless for BMW to manufacture- obviously not. Irrelevant to me after 128 debuted, basically yes.

appeared big because it is big, I liked the e46, but that was the last 3 series I would own

[BlueC]

Originally Posted by Citizen Z

Oh, I'm not dogging the N52, I think the engine is fine if you read my original post. I'm just saying when you make the 3er sluggish, it ceases to become a special car, and isn't any better than a Toyota Camry V6. There is just zero excitement, with the exception of the styling (it ~is~ pretty good looking, in coupe form). I guess I'm clouded by my attiude towards cars in general, that they should make you go "wow!" in some way, whether it be handling, power, comfort, or styling. The 328i doesn't get high marks in any category especially expense, though perhaps it has better handling and styling than I'm giving it credit for.

The Toyota Camry is absolutely nothing like the 328i sedan. If I had a Camry, I would drive it into oncoming traffic. The 328i (when properly equipped) can be a very enjoyable car to drive.

The 328i is the exact same chassis as the 335i. The only thing that separates the two cars are the engine, transmission, and brakes. You're still getting the same suspension, same frame, same interior, same engineering, same build quality, etc.

Again, for someone that does not care about speed (which is most likely a good majority of drivers out there), the 328i is an excellent car. It has the same premium options as the 335i. Even the slowest form of the 328i will be more enjoyable to drive than a Toyota Camry.

[Monterra]

Maybe that was the woman's rationale who drove here Ford Aerostar almost 2 miles South on the Taconic in the Northbound lane tragically killing herself and 7 others including 4 children. I have to drive by the site of the accident daily- a sad reminder of how quickly it can all be taken away. Police still have no idea what may have caused her to do that. Sorry- it was just the worst crash pretty much ever in my area.

I guess when the 1 option came out, the size of the 3 was more exposed and an additional liability when considering 3vs1. Having said that I'll always admire the subdued elegance of 3 coupe but there's something about the unapolgetic brashness of the 1 that I love.

[Citizen Z]

Originally Posted by BlueC

The Toyota Camry is absolutely nothing like the 328i sedan. If I had a Camry, I would drive it into oncoming traffic. The 328i (when properly equipped) can be a very enjoyable car to drive.

Emphasis added.

[BForbes]

Originally Posted by lib

Everyone has a different set of wants & needs. The 328 is a great car for plenty of people, some of which will undoubtedly look at the 1-series as equally pointless.

I totally agree.

[spudw]

No one is going to come out on top in this debate. The 328i is one of BMW's best-selling cars. Period. Most NA 328i buyer choose an auto, as is the trend with most cars in NA. Only the minority really care about performance and handling. The majority want a competent high-quality German mid-sized car.

The OP referred to them as badge whores. This is way off. They are largely discerning people that appreciate BMW quality. They could do with a Camry or an Accord, but perhaps can afford better. Isn't that what it's all about?

Sometimes we get so wrapped up in performance, handling and technology that we fail to recognize that the majority buy cars from the same dealers we do, and yet have other more mundane priorities.

And thank God for that, or else BMW would have been history long ago.

[Citizen Z]

Originally Posted by spudw

No one is going to come out on top in this debate. The 328i is one of BMW's best-selling cars. Period. Most NA 328i buyer choose an auto, as is the trend with most cars in NA. Only the minority really care about performance and handling. The majority want a competent high-quality German mid-sized car.

The OP referred to them as badge whores. This is way off. They are largely discerning people that appreciate BMW quality. They could do with a Camry or an Accord, but perhaps can afford better. Isn't that what it's all about?

Sometimes we get so wrapped up in performance, handling and technology that we fail to recognize that the majority buy cars from the same dealers we do, and yet have other more mundane priorities.

And thank God for that, or else BMW would have been history long ago.

Well put.

[shodanusmc]

O believe my wifes 135 Vert listed at around 52,000. Any idea what a Ford GT500 vert lists for?

It is all relative. Some people are very happy with the 128, 328, and 528.

[Citizen Z]

Originally Posted by shodanusmc

O believe my wifes 135 Vert listed at around 52,000. Any idea what a Ford GT500 vert lists for?

It is all relative. Some people are very happy with the 128, 328, and 528.

MSRP on a 2010 GT500 is $51k, and goes up from there depending on the options and Edmunds says people are paying pretty close to MSRP, if not more. I hope I'm not mistaken when I say a GT500 is a heckuva lot more desirable than a fully loaded 135i vert, particularily for the enthusiast segment.

[cookie]

you guys dont get the 323?

[JimD]

:The backseat of a 1 is not useless but it is best for occasional use and short trips. I have had 4 adults in mine and have only had it a week. But the back seat passengers were ladies under 5'6". And the front seat passengers had to give them a little room. So if you are going to take four adults in your one, make sure a couple are ladies I also had a car seat in it and had an under six foot guy in front. I would not try 4 big guys but as long as a couple of the adults are average or less in height/width, you can make it work.

In my week, I am starting to appreciate the BMW way of doing things. Cruise control on the steering wheel is very common today and what is on my SUV. But you have to take your hand off the wheel to push the buttons. The BMW stalk cannot be easily seen, at least for me, but does not need to be and can be worked easily with both hands still on the wheel. I thought the turn signals momentary switch was a little off initially but I am getting to like it too. Who doesn't like a silky smooth engine, good handling, and a quiet car? I do not care for the looks of the 3s but if I needed the extra back seat space - for longer than short trips or more than infrequent use - I would seriously consider it. I test drove a 328 coupe because it was all I could find around me with a manual. I thought it was nice but I like my 128 vert a lot more. I would look at a 4 door 3 if I went that way - it actually has significantly more back seat leg room.

Jim

[tbird]

I had the 325, which is basically the same. While I was not a fan of the car, it was due to my being a true car performance fan. I have certainly expressed my detriments on the vehicle, but that is again as who I am.

But I can't say that the car is a bad car. Let's face it, it is just as many above have said. The basic engine 3 sedan is the "Entry Level BMW", and is the bread-and-butter for BMW. Some uninformed like to think that the 128 is, since it technically is the cheapest. But it isn't. The 1 is a low-production model, and only the 128ci is cheaper. All three other 1's are more expensive than the basic 3 sedan.

There is weight behind both points of "People who want to purchase quality (and might I add the BEST warranty in the entire biz)", and then "Badge Whores". Down here in SoFL, I would say that we have more badge whores than concientious owners. The majority of BMW's down here are the stripped 328 sedan, which fits the badge whores, and since 80% of all BMW's in America are leased, this fits.

But certainly there are plenty of people who buy the car because, let's face it, driving a BMW is certainly a far better car in performance, stature, quality of build, etc etc etc, than a Camry, which is "dull as dishwater". The Accord is certainly a good car, but again it is boring, and the warranty on Honda's sucks.

While the 3 Series Sedan does not fit my personal "1 Addict" taste, I can certainly say that it is still a great car, great looking, a GREAT warranty, and it delivers peace of mind to its owner.

Quick note: The size of the backseat to the 1 is only 2 inches smaller than the 3 coupe, so there is no weight to any complaints in comparison. It actually is not a bad backseat, and with the top down, people don't find it cramped at all

[warmtoes]

The 323 is for Canada not the US I believe.

Funny, I just had a 328i sedan for the last 8 days as a loaner. Initially when I got it I was not particularly happy with it's performance. I thought the engine was nice and smooth but obviously lacking in low end torque compared to my 135 vert.

But, over the week I came to appreciate it for what it was. Even without the sport package (had crappy 16" wheels and no-season tires) it was dynamically neutral when going around high speed sweeping curves. My last car was nowhere near as stable at speed when turning.

It was very compliant when going over potholes and bumps so I can see how it would be a good family driver. The interior materials were definitely better than my 1 but I still like the style of the 1 interior though.

Overall I think BMW did a good job with the car as it is the big mover and sweet spot in the lineup.

[lib]

Originally Posted by Citizen Z

I hope I'm not mistaken when I say a GT500 is a heckuva lot more desirable than a fully loaded 135i vert, particularily for the enthusiast segment.

Why? Because it has a bigger engine? There's more to it than that.

If someone simply jumps to whatever has the biggest engine at a given price point I would claim that they are absolutely NOT an enthusiast. While the engine is an important piece it takes a lot more than just an engine to make a great car.

I'm not saying "an enthusiast" wouldn't want a GT500. I'm simply saying "an enthusiast" could go for either one depending on their personal priorities.

Then again, half the people around here that claim to be "an enthusiast" have never even changed their own oil.

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by Citizen Z

Emphasis added.

I'm assuming you're talking about the manual transmission, and I'd like to know what the hell my mother needs a manual transmission for?

[tbird]

Originally Posted by lib

Why? Because it has a bigger engine? There's more to it than that.

If someone simply jumps to whatever has the biggest engine at a given price point I would claim that they are absolutely NOT an enthusiast. While the engine is an important piece it takes a lot more than just an engine to make a great car.

I'm not saying "an enthusiast" wouldn't want a GT500. I'm simply saying "an enthusiast" could go for either one depending on their personal priorities.

Then again, half the people around here that claim to be "an enthusiast" have never even changed their own oil.

+1
But unfortunately, there are lots of people who only look at that.

As for the GT500, BIG engine, 540hp, but only does 0-60 in .1 faster than the 135 at 4.7. So let's do math. 300hp=4.7, 540hp=4.6.......but the GT500 is a "bigger" engine. So to concur strongly, bigger engine is not best.