135i Limited slip included??

[TX78666]

IMO, if you're asking if you need it, then you don't, even at the track. I am far from reaching the point where I am charging out of corners hard enough to spin the inside wheel. I rode with an instructor today, and he showed me an example of the open diff holding him back on a car he was building. He was driving waaaaaaaaaaaaaay beyond my abilities.

$3k? That's 1-2 years worth of track events. I'd wager that 10 events worth of experience will put me (and most n00bs like me) light years ahead of where I would be with an LSD, and no additional experience. As I've mentioned before, I've watched an instructor put half the track on an advanced run group at Texas World Speedway, in our e46, with an open diff. That included many purpose-built cars, with LSDs.

Yeah, it would be nice to have one, but by the time it matters, I'll be looking for a dedicated track car anyway.

Just my 2 cents.

[GaryS]

Originally Posted by mdputnam

So, we are left without a proper double wishbone front suspension...

Good corporate financial decision? Yes. But, if Mazda can put them in a $25k Miata and make a profit, there is really no excuse for BMW to delete them in their $45k sports sedan. Is the 135i one of the best sports sedans on the market? Yes, it sure is. Is it "The Ultimate Driving Machine"? Only in the minds of the marketing department.

Yes, BMW should design their cars like Miatas and Civics, not like 911s and Boxsters.

[shah269]

For me it's all about safety and snow/ice/water ect ect.
When you have LSD the care just "works" better in these conditions.
A FWD car does not need it due to weight of the engine on the wheels....but a RWD car....NEEDS a proper LSD to "work" in any place other than SoCal or Texas

[Mr. Clarkson]

Originally Posted by shah269

.but a RWD car....NEEDS a proper LSD to "work" in any place other than SoCal or Texas

Clearly not. Perhaps you're not giving the rest of the world enough credit.

[KingOfJericho]

My car "works" perfectly well.

[BBursey]

Originally Posted by TX78666

IMO, if you're asking if you need it, then you don't, even at the track. I am far from reaching the point where I am charging out of corners hard enough to spin the inside wheel. I rode with an instructor today, and he showed me an example of the open diff holding him back on a car he was building. He was driving waaaaaaaaaaaaaay beyond my abilities.

$3k? That's 1-2 years worth of track events. I'd wager that 10 events worth of experience will put me (and most n00bs like me) light years ahead of where I would be with an LSD, and no additional experience. As I've mentioned before, I've watched an instructor put half the track on an advanced run group at Texas World Speedway, in our e46, with an open diff. That included many purpose-built cars, with LSDs.

Yeah, it would be nice to have one, but by the time it matters, I'll be looking for a dedicated track car anyway.

Just my 2 cents.

This is the post I needed to see. I'm about to order a Dinan Stage 2 suspension kit, high performance bushing kit (e.g. rear subframe and control arm bushings) and the M3 wishbones. With all that intended to improve the car's road manners, and not expecting to track the car much (given the local track closed last summer), I was wondering if I should also get an LSD to save labour while the back of the car is apart. Since I'm not sure, it's probably fair to say I wouldn't really "value" the difference - so I'll do without until I have a good reason to put one in.

Cheers,
Bryan

[GaryS]

Originally Posted by Canucker

I was wondering if I should also get an LSD to save labour while the back of the car is apart. Since I'm not sure, it's probably fair to say I wouldn't really notice the difference - so I'll do without until I have a good reason to put one in.

You would definitely notice the difference, but I doubt that you'd think it was worth that much money unless you track.

[TX78666]

Originally Posted by GaryS

You would definitely notice the difference, but I doubt that you'd think it was worth that much money unless you track.

Agreed, you'd *almost* definitely notice it. Whether you'd think it was an improvement, rather than a difference, is another matter, and whether you'd think it was a $3k improvement seems pretty unlikely.

[BBursey]

Originally Posted by TX78666

Agreed, you'd *almost* definitely notice it. Whether you'd think it was an improvement, rather than a difference, is another matter, and whether you'd think it was a $3k improvement seems pretty unlikely.

Fixed my post... I'm still glad this thread popped up to help validate that an LSD probably isn't the missing link for a street car that I feared I'd regret not getting.

Thanks,
Bryan

[mdputnam]

Originally Posted by GaryS

Yes, BMW should design their cars like Miatas and Civics, not like 911s and Boxsters.

Gary,
Your a little confused. The 135i has the same type of front suspension as a Honda Civic. So, in that narrow sense they did design your car like the Honda Civic. My point was the 135i should have come with the type of front suspension and differential as the both the Miata and Boxster have.

[Diver]

Get LSD if you want to trip, or track or...

[cpt97m3]

Originally Posted by mdputnam

Gary,
Your a little confused. The 135i has the same type of front suspension as a Honda Civic. So, in that narrow sense they did design your car like the Honda Civic. My point was the 135i should have come with the type of front suspension and differential as the both the Miata and Boxster have.

Gary might not be confused. Both the 135i and the *current* Honda Civic have Macpherson struts in front. But the pre-2000 civics had Double A-Arms in front, and are well known for great handling. Some SCCA classes are filled with 1999 Civics for this reason. Nit-Picky detail, but I figured I should clarify.

[mdputnam]

Originally Posted by cpt97m3

But the pre-2000 civics had Double A-Arms in front, and are well known for great handling. Some SCCA classes are filled with 1999 Civics for this reason. Nit-Picky detail, but I figured I should clarify.

Good Point CPT!

Gary,
The front suspension on your $40,000 "Ultimate Driving Machine" isn't even as sophisticated as a 1999 Civic's front suspension.

[Focusedintntions]

While the spring/strut combo isn't very sophisticated in terms of technological advancement, the lca's along with the angle and flex of the whole thing is way more advanced than any civics will ever be. Even the vaulted 911's and every other major manufacturer nowadays use a McPherson strut based suspension. Next step up in sophistication is inboard suspension

[GaryS]

Originally Posted by mdputnam

Good Point CPT!

Gary,
The front suspension on your $40,000 "Ultimate Driving Machine" isn't even as sophisticated as a 1999 Civic's front suspension.

Yes, that's correct. Imagine how fast a Porsche Cup car would be if its front suspension was sophisticated like a 99 Civic or 2005 Accord.

[mdputnam]

Yea, makes ya wonder what Porsche was thinking. But then, these were the same guys that thought hanging an engine off the end of the rear axle was a good idea!

[dtwyim]

Originally Posted by mdputnam

most of their customers couldn't tell the difference between the Mac Pherson strut and the Turkey trot.

Originally Posted by mdputnam

Yea, makes ya wonder what Porsche was thinking. But then, these were the same guys that thought hanging an engine off the end of the rear axle was a good idea!

Hence the cayman.

[GuamX1]

[carcar123454321]

Super old thread but thought I'd chime in.

I've been driving a Solstice GXP with a limited slip differential for a year now. Absolutely love it...you turn off the "nanny" and the rear wheel when accelerating around a corner lock up nicely, may spin some, and you use your foot to control the yaw of the car. It's an absolute blast. (Also the GXP has 3 modes, including "Competition" where it lets you be almost nanny-less but if you get crazy sideways it engages. Or you can turn it completely off.). Of course the Solstice build quality is half that of the BMW and you can only fit 2 people seated and one duffle bag in the "trunk" ;-) But for raw fun it's a blast.

I've had the 135i for just a bit and the LSD is sorely missed--and I'm talking as a daily driver, not the track. It's just a different driving experience, and if you've never had one and used it a lot, you just can't compare. To me it's not just "performance" but a whole immersive feel with an LSD. Now I accelerate say at slower speeds around a corner (or heck even straight) and the 135i nanny kicks in, slapping me on the wrist, pulling my foot off the accelerator (cuts throttle), hurting power by applying brakes (any system that "brakes" is bleeding off power) and jerking the car around to compensate rather than letting it just smoothly spin some and slip a little.

If you turn off the system on the 135i, you just get a bunch of one wheel spin--you just can't compare it ;-0. Also it's not the best set up for getting up say a slippery drive if you ever had to.

That said, it's hard to justify that much cash if you're on a tight budget. I wish to heck our cars were set up (I have a manual) where you could just buy one for say $1000 and put it in. That would be doable for me $ wise.