All blinkers activated under heavy low speed braking uphill

[Artemis]

Noticed for the third time that my 1M goes into some sort of emergency mode when braking hard at a relatively low speed on an uphill part (with all safe-drive systems activated, i.e. DSC on): when I brake hard, but without screeching tires, at ± 50 km/h on an uphill part, all four blinkers start to flash. Except for the flashing blinkers, everything remains normal (engine, NAV, CD, dashboard indications, etc. active). So there you are waiting in front of the traffic lights at the end of the uphill part, with all four blinkers automatically activated. As if my 1M protests: "hey, drive a few more minutes before testing the ///M brakes". Only way to switch them off, is to push the emergency triangle button (tried touching the turn signal stick, but to no avail). Was a bit puzzling the first time it happened. All three times happened at exactly the same spot under similar circumstances (low speed/heavy braking/uphill road/DSC on/late evening). This puppy must be blinking all the time when driven on a circuit!

Did not check yet the manual for an explanation. Is it a glitch or some sort of security/emergency proceeding activated under heavy braking (warning for other road users that you decelerate faster than they might assume)? ...Or maybe the spot where it repeatedly happened is simply jinxed?

On a general note: compared to my 1M, ABS braking was much more obvious in my M3's (that typical feeling of marble stones rubbing your right foot + some sort of whirring-rattling sound); the 1M seems to be a more discrete decelerator (but nevertheless as effective).

[EmmDrei]

@Artemis: Yup, it's built in safety stuff. It'll start with your brake lights starting to flash and if you decelerate almost to standstill, the blinkers come on. It's a feature, not a bug. The blinkers don't come on on the track (at least I haven't had that happen yet), but cars following complain about the flashing brake lights. If I remember right, the blinkers will only come on below a certain speed and you're probably not slow enough on the Nordschleife.

[Grey Dove]

Originally Posted by EmmDrei

@Artemis: Yup, it's built in safety stuff. It'll start with your brake lights starting to flash and if you decelerate almost to standstill, the blinkers come on. It's a feature, not a bug. The blinkers don't come on on the track (at least I haven't had that happen yet), but cars following complain about the flashing brake lights. If I remember right, the blinkers will only come on below a certain speed and you're probably not slow enough on the Nordschleife.

Is the flashing related to BMW only?

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by EmmDrei

@Artemis: Yup, it's built in safety stuff. It'll start with your brake lights starting to flash and if you decelerate almost to standstill, the blinkers come on. It's a feature, not a bug. The blinkers don't come on on the track (at least I haven't had that happen yet), but cars following complain about the flashing brake lights. If I remember right, the blinkers will only come on below a certain speed and you're probably not slow enough on the Nordschleife.

Tell me you're pulling my leg. So BMW managed to put its drivers to shame? A bit embarrassing to be waiting in front of the traffic lights with all blinkers on. Other road users could think that you experience car-trouble or that you're messing with buttons. Hard braking is fun to experience the deceleration feeling managed by the mighty ///M brakes.

[EmmDrei]

@gs/e60/1m?: Afaik, no. I have seen the flashing brake lights on other cars also. It's probably some safety bs they have all agreed upon, if not some stupid EU regulation.

@Artemis: No, I wish I was pulling your leg, believe me! I have had the same situation... approaching a traffic light outside of rural areas. Have a little fun, train some max braking while targeting precisely for the stop line. Car stops and starts flashing. "What the f***?" Press all sorts of buttons... feel like an idiot... general fail. I know what you mean. I even asked my dealer if they could deactivate that stuff by programming, he said, they couldn't. It is one more detail obviously invented and added to keep the idiots alive.

[HALOTHANE]

Is this feature/bug/jinx/accessory/etc. only for EU cars, or is it on NA 1M's also?

[EmmDrei]

@gs/e60/1m?: I just tried Google. Naturally... EU regulations. (76/756/EWG) The entire system is called "adaptive brakelights" and Mercedes, BMW, Renault and Volvo have them (according to the german Wikipedia).

@1MVO: Just try it. Accelerate on a clear stretch of road and slam your brakes until standstill. If you have adaptive brakelights, then your indicators will start flashing.

[///BYU]

Adaptive Brake Lights is listed on bmwusa as standard equipment for the 1M.

http://www.bmwusa.com/standard/conte...s/default.aspx

Also: http://www.bmwusa.com/Standard/Conte...ns/Safety.aspx

Adaptive Brake Lights
Bumper-to-bumper collisions most often occur when the driver behind you didn't realize how hard you were braking. Our Adaptive Brake Lights help eliminate that scenario by emitting a larger, brighter light the more force you use. It allows those behind you to clearly see whether you're lightly tapping the brakes to slow down or applying full force for a sudden stop.

This video is a bit dated (the vehicle is a 2004 BMW 330i ZHP) and it doesn't show the blinkers coming on. It would be good to see a similar demo for a 2011 BMW with Adaptive Brake Lights.

[Pamlico]

Not sure if this is on US spec cars. I've had a couple of instances where I had to apply the brakes very forcefully to come to a stop and the blinkers didn't switch on.

[1SerieStud]

What the OP is describing has nothing to do with Adaptive Brake Lights. If you look inside the rear lights, each has a bulb on the inner side (side that mates to the trunk lid) which normally does not illuminate during normal braking; however, during hard braking, these bulbs illuminate in addition to the regular brake lights, to make it much brighter. This is known as Adaptive Brake Lights.

Also, these are the same bulbs that in other countries serve as rear fog lights, which we do not get standard in NA, but it is a very simple retrofit job.

[EmmDrei]

@1SeriesStud: You're wrong, as "adaptive brake lights" refers to the entire system and not only the simple lights themselves. The entire system makes up the adaptive brake lights. It is all one process. The brake lights light up in two steps, then start to flash and finally the indicators are activated when the car is close to standstill. The onboard electronics control what happens when, while braking.

The german BMW website calls the system "dynamic brake light" with one model and "adaptive" for the next.

[theshiningnova]

I've seen flashing/blinking brake lights on Porsche a lot when you brake hard. You'll see a lot of them in youtube when they are tracking. I didn't know BMWs would do that, too. I reckon it's a very good safety feature.

Left/right turn indicator blinking automatically under heavy braking tho, I haven't seen that before.

[theshiningnova]

I see that Adaptive brake light is a standard feature on 1M. There were no details in both the normal 1series manual or the 1M supplementary manual though.

The BMW website on general technologies does not say Adaptive brake light does not specifically say the brake lights will blink on emergency braking but the page for X6 seems to say it will.

One reason for the high visibility of the BMW X6 is the Adaptive Brake Lights. When you brake normally, the back lights go on as normal; when you brake in an emergency, they blink several times per second to warn the cars behind. When every split-second counts, this enhances safety all round.

Still no mention on Left/Right turn indicator blinking but I guess it just makes sense to do so if you brake hard and come to a complete stop. Rather than feeling embarrassed, I would feel safer that way knowing the person behind will more likely know that I'm doing an emergency stop, not just slowing down.

[Simsims]

no this sounds like a europe thing

on my ED I went to Paris and was in some pretty heavy stop/go traffic on the highway in the city, and this was night time. I noticed most of the cars' 4 way blinkers came on when they braked hard. initially thought this was a them paranoid about getting rear-ended....

[Artemis]

OK, found it. It's a BMW gizmo called Brake Force Display (BFD).

Try it. It is "triggered after the anti-lock brake sensors detect a rate of deceleration in excess of 5 m/second square". Otherwise stated: brake HARD and let the ///M brakes do their job.



"Brake Force Display
BMW continues to drive its innovation forward with the release of Brake Force Display, a dynamic safety enhancement feature available on most models from May 2004.
Brake Force Display is a simple yet effective way of communicating to following traffic that the BMW in front is stopping quickly, providing extra advance warning of a potential road hazard ahead. This should help lessen the need for harsh emergency braking by following drivers who now have extra reaction time.
Brake Force Display warning has been fitted to BMW vehicles sold in the United States for some time, and has just gained approval by regulatory bodies in Europe and Australia for use in these markets.
BMW hopes the adoption of Brake Force Display will lead to a reduction in avoidable rear-end collisions as well as help prevent loss of control caused by panic braking in vehicles not equipped with advanced electronic chassis systems such as BMW's Dynamic Stability Control III.
Sudden stops - emergency braking - are not a regular element of everyday driving. But it's precisely at these moments that the fast reactions of drivers behind are most important. Brake Force Display is a dual-stage brake light system. For normal braking, the main light element is illuminated; for harder, sudden braking, the entire brake light glows red. Drivers behind intuitively understand and can react accordingly.
Here's how it works
Brake Force Display works by increasing the intensity of the brake lights in the rear lamp clusters by expanding the number of illuminated LEDs when heavy braking is detected. The extra lighting is triggered after the anti-lock brake sensors detect a rate of deceleration in excess of 5 m/second square.
As an example of the force of the braking, at 5 m/second square a briefcase placed on a car seat would accelerate off the seat onto the floor. The system reacts within a few tenths of a second to increase the intensity of the stoplight illumination, projecting a highly visible warning beacon to following traffic. Only deceleration forces trigger Brake Force Display, not simply pedal pressure, in order to avoid unnecessary illumination.
BMW 5 Series, X3 and 6 Series Coupe and Convertible was fitted with Brake Force Display technology from March 2004 production, and the 3 Series, X5 and Z4 Roadster included the feature from April 2004 production.
Brake Force Display joins a long list of safety feature firsts introduced as standard equipment on BMW vehicles sold in Australia and other markets under its industry-leading FIRST (Fully Integrated Road Safety Technology) policy which includes anti-lock brakes, traction and stability control, dual-stage intelligent airbags and rigid body shells equipped with impact absorbing crumple zones."
http://www.bmwinformation.com/technology/bfd.html

For the code guys amongst us:
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=500751

[EmmDrei]

In the US such systems are obviously refered to as ESS - Emergency Stop Signals (see Wikipedia). But it may well be possible, that a US car is different from a EU spec car. We're talking about EU spec cars.

The german 3-series microsite states:

"Dynamisches Bremslicht.
Die wenigsten Bremsvorgänge sind Vollbremsungen. Doch genau hier kommt es besonders auf die Reaktion aller Verkehrsteilnehmer an. Das Dynamische Bremslicht zeigt an, wie stark das Fahrzeug abgebremst wird.
Bei einer Notbremsung wird die Bremsleuchte blinkend angesteuert und kurz vor Fahrzeugstillstand das Warnblinken eingeschaltet. Nachfolgende Fahrer können zwischen leichtem Bremsen und einer Vollbremsung unterscheiden und richtig reagieren."

I'll translate:
Dynamic brake light.
The minority of all braking occurences are full brake applications. (Not sure if I translate this right... it means to say "applying the brake with full force".) But here especially the reactions of all motorists are important. The dynamic brake light shows how hard the vehicle is being decelerated.
In an emergency braking situation the brake light will be made to flash and the emergency indicators are activated shortly before standstill. Drivers following can discriminate between light braking and a full brake application and react correctly.

(It tried to stay as close to the original text while translating, even if it sounds a little strange.)

[M3 Adjuster]

nice translation.. works well.. and makes a certain amount of sense...

if one has to come to an abrupt immediate stop on.. say.. a highway or autobanh.. this could be helpful in warning other motorists that the vehicle ahead isn't just slowing, but slowing so much, so rapidly, as to come to a stop.


I've seen adaptive braking in cars on the track.. the E46 models had this beginning with 2003 or so with one of the mid cycle updates.. MINIs have the high mounted third brake light flash... although this may be an aftermarket option..

[1SerieStud]

If you read my reply again, you will see it was specific to US-spec cars. This being said, I am not wrong - I have yet to see my car flash the brake lights and/or hazards upon hard braking. I do know, however, that in the US the extra brake bulbs do illuminate upon hard breaking, secondarily to the main brake bulbs. So on my car, it is simply a two step process and none of that flashing you're all talking about.

Originally Posted by EmmDrei

@1SeriesStud: You're wrong, as "adaptive brake lights" refers to the entire system and not only the simple lights themselves. The entire system makes up the adaptive brake lights. It is all one process. The brake lights light up in two steps, then start to flash and finally the indicators are activated when the car is close to standstill. The onboard electronics control what happens when, while braking.

The german BMW website calls the system "dynamic brake light" with one model and "adaptive" for the next.

[Rekraps]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Noticed for the third time that my 1M goes into some sort of emergency mode when braking hard at a relatively low speed on an uphill part (with all safe-drive systems activated, i.e. DSC on): when I brake hard, but without screeching tires, at ± 50 km/h on an uphill part, all four blinkers start to flash. Except for the flashing blinkers, everything remains normal (engine, NAV, CD, dashboard indications, etc. active). So there you are waiting in front of the traffic lights at the end of the uphill part, with all four blinkers automatically activated. As if my 1M protests: "hey, drive a few more minutes before testing the ///M brakes". Only way to switch them off, is to push the emergency triangle button (tried touching the turn signal stick, but to no avail). Was a bit puzzling the first time it happened. All three times happened at exactly the same spot under similar circumstances (low speed/heavy braking/uphill road/DSC on/late evening). This puppy must be blinking all the time when driven on a circuit!

Did not check yet the manual for an explanation. Is it a glitch or some sort of security/emergency proceeding activated under heavy braking (warning for other road users that you decelerate faster than they might assume)? ...Or maybe the spot where it repeatedly happened is simply jinxed?

On a general note: compared to my 1M, ABS braking was much more obvious in my M3's (that typical feeling of marble stones rubbing your right foot + some sort of whirring-rattling sound); the 1M seems to be a more discrete decelerator (but nevertheless as effective).

Check out the top gear live video... the brake lights on the 1M he drifts into the arena with blink (you can catch it for a second just as he makes his first high speed turn!) Adaptive brake lights it is! Your car is just fine.

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by Artemis

OK, found it. It's a BMW gizmo called Brake Force Display (BFD).

Try it. It is "triggered after the anti-lock brake sensors detect a rate of deceleration in excess of 5 m/second square". Otherwise stated: brake HARD and let the ///M brakes do their job.

I think you also have to be going faster than 70 kph and then brake hard for the BFD to activate on a 1er. This feature where the third brake light flashes is only on EU spec car.

Remember that video of that tuned TT vs a AW 1M at the Ring. That is where I remembered seeing it pulse in action - for the fist time.

US cars have something simular in that, the rear brake lights have a two stage brake light system. When you brake hard... the inside (rear brake fogs) light up for a few seconds, then go off. They do not flash! I believe the Z4 was the first BMW to have this feature.

Yes, you can have the BFD coded. I had my car coded with this feature. I just have never been able to test it that it indeed is working.


As for the hazard (turn signal/four way flasher) lights also coming on as your about to cme to a stop - this feature has been around for five or so years on MB's, Peugeot and Citreon's. I don't even think this feature is on every new EU spec BMW, only a select few. This feature is also not allowed on US spec cars bc NHTSA (National Highway Traffic Safety Administration says it would "confuse" US drivers. So our cars don't get this feature.


Here is that video of the TT vs 1M. Check out 2:53 on the video... you can clearly see the third brake light flash under hard braking....

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

As for the hazard (turn signal/four way flasher) lights also coming on as your about to cme to a stop - this feature has been around for five or so years on MB's, Peugeot and Citroën's. I don't even think this feature is on every new EU spec BMW, only a select few. This feature is also not allowed on US spec cars bc NHTSA (National Highway Traffic Safety Administration) says it would "confuse" US drivers. So our cars don't get this feature.

Thanks for your insights, Dackel.

Yesterday I experimented to provoke it and it worked: get some speed, brake hard to standstill, experience the deceleration G-force, and at the brink of standstill the hazards are effectively activated. I waited to check if the hazards would switch off automatically after a couple of flashes, but they didn't. I was required to push the hazards button (red emergency triangle) to get back to normal. So at least my 1M is equipped with this Brake Force Display gizmo. You're right that at very low speed, it doesn't activate - deceleration must indeed be rather intense (read: brutal).

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Thanks for your insights, Dackel.

Yesterday I experimented to provoke it and it worked: get some speed, brake hard to standstill, experience the deceleration G-force, and at the brink of standstill the hazards are effectively activated. I waited to check if the hazards would switch off automatically after a couple of flashes, but they didn't. I was required to push the hazards button (red emergency triangle) to get back to normal. So at least my 1M is equipped with this Brake Force Display gizmo. You're right that at very low speed, it doesn't activate - deceleration must indeed be rather intense (read: brutal).

So... you have to brake HARD but not (too hard to)engage the ABS system right? And come to a complete stop while braking HARD. And you do this from 50 kph - when your turn signals come on?

I might have to give this a try with my US spec car. I am curious as to how my car was coded. I had thorsten from www.car-coding.de code my brake lights to EU specs.

Also... when driving at night at over 70 kph... and braking HARD... do you eve see your third brake light flash? I would think one could see the flashing at nigh via road signs and those white stick markers on the side of the German roads. But I have never been able to see any flashing. ?


Dack