M3 steering feel

850tgul · 11-23-2015, 01:21 PM

Curious to hear from folks with firsthand experience on the difference in steering feel between the E9x M3/1M and a 135/128 with the M3 control arm kit. I just drove an E90 M3 and loved the more direct feel of the steering, not necessarily any more accurate or quicker turn in, but very direct and I suppose a bit heavier as well.

I myself kind of half assed my front setup and only replaced the tension struts with an “HD” Meyle. Nice improvement over stock but still not quite where the M3 was at. I also have the E93 M3 front sway bar, Bilstein HD struts, Swift springs, and Dinan camber plates running about -2.0 front camber.

So I know the M3/1M have a different steering rack than our cars but for those who have gone full M3 control arms AND have some seat time with an M3/1M, how close does the 1er w/m3 front kit get to the M3/1M’s feel?

ShocknAwe · 11-23-2015, 05:07 PM

IMO? Steering rack.

Yeineken · 11-26-2015, 05:51 AM

I believe the M3 steering rack is a 2.2 ratio and the 135i is a 2.7

A small difference and not really worth the price unless you can find an M3 steering rack that's very cheap.

So you can get close. But I've heard the only way to get that authentic feel is to do a full swap.

vtl · 11-26-2015, 11:30 PM

I had good condition control arms and swapped them out for M3 ones. Didn't notice much difference really. On long corners the car understeered less from the increase in camber. I could take more speed through the corners before the front started to scrub. Looking at the construction you only gain 1 spherical ball joint vs the stock rubber bushings. The other joint on the m3 arm is still a rubber bushing.

Steering feel I think may have improved slightly but honestly couldn't tell much of a difference. Would maybe have to jump back into a stock car and drive them back to back to really tell.

If you replaced blown stock control arms (which is what a lot of people probably do) then it will obviously be a massive difference.

The rack can be retrofitted but its a servotronic rack which requires an extra connection for the variable assist. See my post here from when I dug through the wiring diagram:

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showp...7&postcount=20

HP Autosport · 12-29-2015, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vtl

I had good condition control arms and swapped them out for M3 ones. Didn't notice much difference really. On long corners the car understeered less from the increase in camber. I could take more speed through the corners before the front started to scrub. Looking at the construction you only gain 1 spherical ball joint vs the stock rubber bushings. The other joint on the m3 arm is still a rubber bushing.

Steering feel I think may have improved slightly but honestly couldn't tell much of a difference. Would maybe have to jump back into a stock car and drive them back to back to really tell.

If you replaced blown stock control arms (which is what a lot of people probably do) then it will obviously be a massive difference.

The rack can be retrofitted but its a servotronic rack which requires an extra connection for the variable assist. See my post here from when I dug through the wiring diagram:

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showp...7&postcount=20

Even though it's still a rubber bushing in the thrust arm, it is much stiffer thus less movement under load.

You can always upgrade to an aftermarket bushing to further limit movement without going to a full mono-ball bearing.

http://www.hpashop.com/Rogue-Enginee...?categoryId=-1

chris82 · 12-29-2015, 09:04 PM

Forgive me, I don't have experience driving an M3. That being said, I do have experience driving my 1er with stock control arms, and my friends 1er with the M3 control arms back to back many times. We have the same coilovers/springs/camber plates/tires/alignment settings and they drive similarly. I can tell you for certain that the M3 control arms provide a noticeable upgrade in steering feel and add weight and tightness to the steering.

850tgul · 12-30-2015, 01:57 PM

What I was experiencing, and doing a poor job of explaining, was the M3's quicker rack I think. It wasn't that the M3 turned in so much better than my car, it's just that it required much less sawing at the wheel to get the same result.

Dackelone · 12-30-2015, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 850tgul

What I was experiencing, and doing a poor job of explaining, was the M3's quicker rack I think. It wasn't that the M3 turned in so much better than my car, it's just that it required much less sawing at the wheel to get the same result.

^^That would be the (faster ratio)rack...

Sounds like you should start searching for a used M3 rack. It should be too hard to find one.

swagon · 12-30-2015, 02:15 PM

The Active Steering, hated by many and very rare, has a super fast steering rack. When maneuvering (parking), I don't even make a full turn with the steering wheel. In twisties, it's great as well.

It is pretty damn heavy as well, but does not self center which many don't like.

Think it's even quicker than the M3 Servotronic.

11-23-2015, 01:21 PM	#1
850tgul Captain 279 Rep 998 Posts Drives: 718 GT4, F87 M2, F30 330xi, X3 Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Boston, MA iTrader: (15)	M3 steering feel Curious to hear from folks with firsthand experience on the difference in steering feel between the E9x M3/1M and a 135/128 with the M3 control arm kit. I just drove an E90 M3 and loved the more direct feel of the steering, not necessarily any more accurate or quicker turn in, but very direct and I suppose a bit heavier as well. I myself kind of half assed my front setup and only replaced the tension struts with an “HD” Meyle. Nice improvement over stock but still not quite where the M3 was at. I also have the E93 M3 front sway bar, Bilstein HD struts, Swift springs, and Dinan camber plates running about -2.0 front camber. So I know the M3/1M have a different steering rack than our cars but for those who have gone full M3 control arms AND have some seat time with an M3/1M, how close does the 1er w/m3 front kit get to the M3/1M’s feel? __________________ Current: 718 GT4 6MT, F87 M2 6MT, F30 330xi, F25 xdrive35i Gone: E82 128i M-Sport, 997.2 911, B8.5 S5, 987.2 Cayman, W211 E550, E92 M3, B8.5 S4, 981 Cayman, E82 128i, E46 M3, Z4MC, Mk5 GTI VR6, MZ3R, C5 Z06, B5 S4, Volvo T-5R, Volvo 740Ti
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11-23-2015, 05:07 PM	#2
ShocknAwe 1Addict 3233 Rep 7,894 Posts Drives: E82 Mutt, M57 Truck Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Charleston iTrader: (22)	IMO? Steering rack. __________________ 2010 135i 6MT Jet Black N54/3 FE82 Mutt \| BUILD THREAD \| GARAGE SALE
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11-26-2015, 05:51 AM	#3
Yeineken Colonel 1301 Rep 2,093 Posts Drives: '11 135i M Sport Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Delmarva Peninsula iTrader: (3) Garage List '11 135i [8.20] '16 Ford Hatchback [0.00] '15 X5 [10.00]	I believe the M3 steering rack is a 2.2 ratio and the 135i is a 2.7 A small difference and not really worth the price unless you can find an M3 steering rack that's very cheap. So you can get close. But I've heard the only way to get that authentic feel is to do a full swap. __________________ Pyrat Clone
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11-26-2015, 11:30 PM	#4
vtl Brigadier General 1493 Rep 3,148 Posts Drives: 2008 BMW 135i MT Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Melbourne, Australia iTrader: (0)	I had good condition control arms and swapped them out for M3 ones. Didn't notice much difference really. On long corners the car understeered less from the increase in camber. I could take more speed through the corners before the front started to scrub. Looking at the construction you only gain 1 spherical ball joint vs the stock rubber bushings. The other joint on the m3 arm is still a rubber bushing. Steering feel I think may have improved slightly but honestly couldn't tell much of a difference. Would maybe have to jump back into a stock car and drive them back to back to really tell. If you replaced blown stock control arms (which is what a lot of people probably do) then it will obviously be a massive difference. The rack can be retrofitted but its a servotronic rack which requires an extra connection for the variable assist. See my post here from when I dug through the wiring diagram: http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showp...7&postcount=20 __________________ Build Thread
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12-29-2015, 09:04 PM	#6
chris82 Brigadier General 827 Rep 3,856 Posts Drives: 128i Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: NY NY iTrader: (8) Garage List 2009 BMW 128i [9.80]	Forgive me, I don't have experience driving an M3. That being said, I do have experience driving my 1er with stock control arms, and my friends 1er with the M3 control arms back to back many times. We have the same coilovers/springs/camber plates/tires/alignment settings and they drive similarly. I can tell you for certain that the M3 control arms provide a noticeable upgrade in steering feel and add weight and tightness to the steering.
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12-30-2015, 01:57 PM	#7
850tgul Captain 279 Rep 998 Posts Drives: 718 GT4, F87 M2, F30 330xi, X3 Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Boston, MA iTrader: (15)	What I was experiencing, and doing a poor job of explaining, was the M3's quicker rack I think. It wasn't that the M3 turned in so much better than my car, it's just that it required much less sawing at the wheel to get the same result. __________________ Current: 718 GT4 6MT, F87 M2 6MT, F30 330xi, F25 xdrive35i Gone: E82 128i M-Sport, 997.2 911, B8.5 S5, 987.2 Cayman, W211 E550, E92 M3, B8.5 S4, 981 Cayman, E82 128i, E46 M3, Z4MC, Mk5 GTI VR6, MZ3R, C5 Z06, B5 S4, Volvo T-5R, Volvo 740Ti
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12-30-2015, 02:15 PM	#9
swagon Major General 13521 Rep 8,165 Posts Drives: F80 6MT Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: . iTrader: (0)	The Active Steering, hated by many and very rare, has a super fast steering rack. When maneuvering (parking), I don't even make a full turn with the steering wheel. In twisties, it's great as well. It is pretty damn heavy as well, but does not self center which many don't like. Think it's even quicker than the M3 Servotronic. Last edited by swagon; 12-30-2015 at 02:26 PM..
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