[onesixeight]

Originally Posted by collinp

Maybe the software in my car isn't downshifting to first at stop lights so it brakes smooth, but takes forever to get moving again. Just a crazy theory.

- Collin

I have looked as some technichal documentation from my shop forman and in regular D mode (not S), all E90 transmissions are programmed to start in 2nd gear, regardless how "hard" you've been driving or even if adaptive transmission is in its most aggressive setting. In "DS" mode, the car can will start in 1st if it is in the most aggressive adaptive mode.

[SV Concepts III]

This sounds like a software issue. BMW had issues with some of the E46 steptronics clunking when coming to a stop or putting it into first (while in step mode). They cleared the software and it, for the most part, solved the issue.

[onesixeight]

Originally Posted by BMWERKEN

This sounds like a software issue. BMW had issues with some of the E46 steptronics clunking when coming to a stop or putting it into first (while in step mode). They cleared the software and it, for the most part, solved the issue.

I agree and I hope that this is resolve with a software update...

But with the recent BMWs and all the million mile R&D testing they do, I can't believe that they would let so many problems slip by in a production car. These aren't small hidden things that take Antonio Pizzonia, F1 test driver for Williams BMW to find. It's everyday people like you and I that are discovering these problems within the first couple hundred miles of ownership. I just finished reading, Driven : Inside BMW, the Most Admired Car Company in the World (a great read BTW), and it talks about how BMW QC pretty much gives up saying that they would rather focus on vehicle dynamics rather than fix QC problems. True...I know I'm not buying a bulletproof reliable Lexus, but such problems within the first month of ownership? BMW better start concentrating on QC, or they're gonna lose more customers to people like Lexus and Infiniti who are already riding up their rear end.

[E90 Enthusiast]

These posts are making me a very nervous soon-to-be-owner.

Shouldn't some of these issues have been ironed out during pre-production?

[onesixeight]

Originally Posted by E90 Enthusiast

These posts are making me a very nervous soon-to-be-owner.

Shouldn't some of these issues have been ironed out during pre-production?

In a way, you should be nervous. A lot of people here are saying, "oh, it's just programming." When I rearend someone, I'll make sure to tell them, "oh it's just programming." The way BMW of North America is handling the situation is just appalling. I've called them on numerous occasions and even phone the supplier of the DSC programming, Continental Teeves, and I've yet to hear from anyone with a fix. My dealer has been great through all of this, giving me a 530i to drive while they solve the problem, but even BMWNA has not been in good communications with my dealership. Even my dealer is puzzled on the lack of attention they are giving this safety matter. They have about 10 cars in right now, with the same problem. The only recommendation was to overrwrite the existing DSC programming (v. 40). The car wouldn't take it because that's what's on there now.

My 745Li with the electric parking brake jerks an inch everytime I put in in park, and so does just about every 7. People on the boards were saying, oh yea, just give it time, they'll throw some software at it and fix it all up. Guess what, even the latest 750i facelift 4 years later does the samething. BMW, don't tell me that's the nature of an electric parking brake and it's just something I'm gonna have to get used to. Jaguar XJs have been using the electric parking brake and it sure doesn't jerk like the 7s.

I know I sound like one unhappy BMW customer, and don't get me wrong...I'm not here to troll up the boards and make all the future BMW customers run away...The car is great, but sometimes I question my BMW purchases of late...

[CorporalCarrot]

Folks

I must admit for once I am pretty happy about Ireland's car registration system. Every number plate here begins with the registration year. i.e. 05 = 2005, and it means that 70% of all car sales here occur in the first three months of any year. As a private buyer, you would be either insane or very wealthy if you bought a car in the last few months of the year, since its effectively 1 year old just a couple of months later.

So when I was told I couldnt have the E90 I wanted until September, it meant that I just decided to wait an order an 06 plate car. I've been pretty bummed out reading these forums and as the cars start to appear on the streets, but threads like this make me feel better, because most of this stuff should be sorted out by the time I get my car.

I must admit, I don't think its acceptable to have these type of issues with a new car, and the "Its a software issue" excuse wouldn't wash with me.

C

[E90Fleet]

This is a know software issue with ZF transmissions

Its affecting all makers that use them, especially Jaguar

The 5 Series very recently gotten new software and it has supposebly fixed the problem on their version of the gearbox

Hopefually the E90 version of the software will be out soon

[onesixeight]

Originally Posted by E90Fleet

This is a know software issue with ZF transmissions

Its affecting all makers that use them, especially Jaguar

The 5 Series very recently gotten new software and it has supposebly fixed the problem on their version of the gearbox

Hopefually the E90 version of the software will be out soon

I know the thread's title is about downshifting, but I think the problem is not with the transmission but with the soft-stop feature of the car which is a DSC & Brakes issue. For example, even in other cars with the similar ZF 6-speed automatics such as 745Li or Jaguar X-type, when you are in manual mode and you downshift at a complete stop...the car doesn't move forward when you are on the brakes. You may feel a slight jerk, but the car doesn't move physically move forward like it does for me. The only way that can happen is if the braking system releases partial or complete brake pressure to allow the car to travel forward again.

[silverado]

Originally Posted by onesixeight

Bimm Me Up!!!

That's the exact same problem I've been experiencing!!!

That wierd feeling is the DSC soft-stop function at work. The jerk forward is the rear caliper releasing brake pressure in an attempt to smoothen out the stop. Whatever it's does, it's downright dangerous and I've already brought it to the attention of BMWNA and the NHTSA. I called Continental Teeves, the suppliers of DSC for BMW and they have yet to return my call. If you go to http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/pr...in/results.cfm and hit Complains -> Search and type in 10127832 you will find a copy of my complain to the NHTSA.

My issue is its very difficult to stop without the car moving forward again...I've had times where the car traveled up to a foot from its inital stopping point.

If you would, please file a PUMA case with your service advisor. After filing a PUMA case, the only help BMW-AG offered was a software update. The CD they sent my dealer with the same software version that's presently on the car...so it was no help.

-Chris

This never happened to me in my manual transmission car. So I'm not sure this could be attributed to the "DSC soft-stop function".

[onesixeight]

Originally Posted by silverado

This never happened to me in my manual transmission car. So I'm not sure this could be attributed to the "DSC soft-stop function".

silverado,

I should have added, only to cars equipped with Steptronic automatic transmission.

The extra travel that I'm experiencing after coming to a stop is movement caused by the normal movement one experience after taking their foot off the brake in an automatic. Problem is, car continues to travel with foot planted on the brake pedal.

Let me also add, and I don't claim to know more than any BMW engineer...but just my thought...The soft-stop feature is releasing brake pressure after the car had already stopped. Mercedes has a similar feature on their European SBC equipped cars, and on those, it releases the pressure as you are coming to a stop. Either way, I think there are liability issues anytime the computer is releasing brake pressure for you and a reason why MB didn't bring the system to the states.

I guess that's what I get for buying an automatic... Should've bought a manual.

[Bimm Me Up]

I drove the car today in 'M" mode since evein in DS, the jerking still comes out once in awhile.

In "M" mode, there is no jerking, so I must say that the issue is transmission related.

[onesixeight]

Originally Posted by Bimm Me Up

I drove the car today in 'M" mode since evein in DS, the jerking still comes out once in awhile.

In "M" mode, there is no jerking, so I must say that the issue is transmission related.

Bimm Me Up...

Are you downshifting as you are coming to a stop? The reason is, if you are in a higher gear, let's say 3rd gear, the gearing isn't going to move you forward as much as if you are in 1st gear. When you are in M mode, the car doesn't downshift into a starting gear (ie. 1st or 2nd gear) until after you come to a stop. It does downshift if it feels you are in too high of a gear, let's say you go to 6th gear at 20 mph, but it doesn't go all the way down to 1st or 2nd. A little confusing and I probably don't make it sound any simpler... Again, I'm not sure if we have the same problem, but I know mine isn't transmission related.

I spoke with an engineer at Continetal Teeves and the NHSTA today. NHSTA said a inspector did get a chance to test a car in the Washington D.C. area and did feel it. They're not sure if it warrants a recall, but an offical with the NHSTA is in communications with BMW. Well, see how it goes...

[collinp]

Since seeing this thread I've been watching my car during braking and have not seen the slightest hint of this issue. I'm driving a 330i steptronic. I'm glad I don't have it. It sounds frightening.

So to understand your scenario... you're driving along at 30 miles and hour or so. The car in front of you stops. You brake and just as the car is about to come to a standstill brake pressure releases and the car lurches forward a foot or so? Yikes!

- Collin

[itznin]

Originally Posted by collinp

Since seeing this thread I've been watching my car during braking and have not seen the slightest hint of this issue. I'm driving a 330i steptronic. I'm glad I don't have it. It sounds frightening.

So to understand your scenario... you're driving along at 30 miles and hour or so. The car in front of you stops. You brake and just as the car is about to come to a standstill brake pressure releases and the car lurches forward a foot or so? Yikes!

- Collin

Collin... not quite that serious!

For me even if I am going say 10mph to a red light, the stop just isn't SMOOTH.

You stop and then it jerks forward just a bit. Nothing scary or any possibility of an accident it just is a jerky type of feeling.

[onesixeight]

Originally Posted by collinp

Since seeing this thread I've been watching my car during braking and have not seen the slightest hint of this issue. I'm driving a 330i steptronic. I'm glad I don't have it. It sounds frightening.

So to understand your scenario... you're driving along at 30 miles and hour or so. The car in front of you stops. You brake and just as the car is about to come to a standstill brake pressure releases and the car lurches forward a foot or so? Yikes!

- Collin

It will do it coming to a stop at any speed. Again, I think the car I has it worse than other E90s. I drove 2 330s (1 ZSP, and the other non-ZSP) and the ZSP car did it once coming out of the dealership. Otherwise, it was ok. The other ZSP 325i I drove, did it five times in stop-and-go downtown traffic, but is better than my car.

The car will come to a complete stop, but release brake pressure, and grab again a second later. As "itznin" stated, the car will stop, but when you are in heavy city traffic and you have to get really close to the car in front of you, you really have to leave extra room since the car will creep forward another couple of inches (and I've had to move a whole foot) from the intital stopping point.

I'm trying to do a video to send to the NHSTA to document my problem. I will post it once I have it edited and uploaded.

[e90fanatic]

Originally Posted by onesixeight

It will do it coming to a stop at any speed. Again, I think the car I has it worse than other E90s. I drove 2 330s (1 ZSP, and the other non-ZSP) and the ZSP car did it once coming out of the dealership. Otherwise, it was ok. The other ZSP 325i I drove, did it five times in stop-and-go downtown traffic, but is better than my car.

The car will come to a complete stop, but release brake pressure, and grab again a second later. As "itznin" stated, the car will stop, but when you are in heavy city traffic and you have to get really close to the car in front of you, you really have to leave extra room since the car will creep forward another couple of inches (and I've had to move a whole foot) from the intital stopping point.

I'm trying to do a video to send to the NHSTA to document my problem. I will post it once I have it edited and uploaded.

what is BMW doing to solve this? Nothing at all? how about BMWNA? This cannot be real...now I'm worried about my car

[onesixeight]

Originally Posted by e90fanatic

what is BMW doing to solve this? Nothing at all? how about BMWNA? This cannot be real...now I'm worried about my car

My dealer, BMW of Honolulu has been wonderful and accomodating. They've offered me a 530i loaner car while attempting to fix the problem, but yesterday, I took my car back since all the advice BMWAG offer my dealership is to wait for a new software update. They did not give any timeline as to when this new software update would be released. I asked my service advisor if BMW is even formally recognizing this as a problem, and they said "no."

I've called BMW USA's Customer Relations at 1-800-831-1117 and all they could say is, "We've never heard of this problem, and it's a bit early to tell you what wrong since we have a limited number of E90s on the road." They never asked for my VIN number or any detailed info except the model, 325i ZSP. I called them on two different occasions, once when they called me to survey me on my purchase experience, and I made a follow up call a week later when the car moved a whole foot after coming to a stop. I was quite angry since the primary driver is my 16 year old sister, I'd like to make sure she's in a safe car.

Right now, I'm trying to figure out if this is an isolated issue with my car or E90s in general. It seems some aren't experiencing the problem at all, and some who are, just don't think it's all that serious. Sounds like some of you aren't bother or don't feel it's a serious situation, but in my opinion, this isn't acceptable in a BMW, let alone any car. I don't care if it's just the nature of the car or if its a feature of the car. If that's the way the car is, I'll sell it to someone who thinks they can live with it for under what I paid for it. My sales manager said they'll take the car back if BMW isn't able to correct the situation, so I'm gonna hold them to it.

[e90fanatic]

Originally Posted by onesixeight

My dealer, BMW of Honolulu has been wonderful and accomodating. They've offered me a 530i loaner car while attempting to fix the problem, but yesterday, I took my car back since all the advice BMWAG offer my dealership is to wait for a new software update. They did not give any timeline as to when this new software update would be released. I asked my service advisor if BMW is even formally recognizing this as a problem, and they said "no."

I've called BMW USA's Customer Relations at 1-800-831-1117 and all they could say is, "We've never heard of this problem, and it's a bit early to tell you what wrong since we have a limited number of E90s on the road." They never asked for my VIN number or any detailed info except the model, 325i ZSP. I called them on two different occasions, once when they called me to survey me on my purchase experience, and I made a follow up call a week later when the car moved a whole foot after coming to a stop. I was quite angry since the primary driver is my 16 year old sister, I'd like to make sure she's in a safe car.

Right now, I'm trying to figure out if this is an isolated issue with my car or E90s in general. It seems some aren't experiencing the problem at all, and some who are, just don't think it's all that serious. Sounds like some of you aren't bother or don't feel it's a serious situation, but in my opinion, this isn't acceptable in a BMW, let alone any car. I don't care if it's just the nature of the car or if its a feature of the car. If that's the way the car is, I'll sell it to someone who thinks they can live with it for under what I paid for it. My sales manager said they'll take the car back if BMW isn't able to correct the situation, so I'm gonna hold them to it.

wow your dealership is really good! I testdrove couple of 330i's and never have noticed that problem. Hopefully my car won't have it or they'll come out with a fix soon!!

[onesixeight]

Originally Posted by e90fanatic

wow your dealership is really good! I testdrove couple of 330i's and never have noticed that problem. Hopefully my car won't have it or they'll come out with a fix soon!!

Of the five 330s I drove, I only experienced it in two of the cars, and they were relatively mild mannered compared to my car.

I'm not sure if it's the larger brakes, but it seems to be more of a problem with the 325s.

I wish you the best of luck too

[onesixeight]

Great...now the car is seriously moving 6 inches after every braking manuver...I'm so sick of it. I'm dropping it back off tomorrow and I'm going to throw the keys on the managers desk.

To make matters worse, the car is throwing a TMPS failure. Checked air pressure, it's 34/36 after driving. I just set it the other day to 29/32, so I'm quite sure the DSC sensors that are on my wheels are messed up.

[supachiney]

Originally Posted by onesixeight

In a way, you should be nervous. A lot of people here are saying, "oh, it's just programming." When I rearend someone, I'll make sure to tell them, "oh it's just programming." The way BMW of North America is handling the situation is just appalling. I've called them on numerous occasions and even phone the supplier of the DSC programming, Continental Teeves, and I've yet to hear from anyone with a fix. My dealer has been great through all of this, giving me a 530i to drive while they solve the problem, but even BMWNA has not been in good communications with my dealership. Even my dealer is puzzled on the lack of attention they are giving this safety matter. They have about 10 cars in right now, with the same problem. The only recommendation was to overrwrite the existing DSC programming (v. 40). The car wouldn't take it because that's what's on there now.

My 745Li with the electric parking brake jerks an inch everytime I put in in park, and so does just about every 7. People on the boards were saying, oh yea, just give it time, they'll throw some software at it and fix it all up. Guess what, even the latest 750i facelift 4 years later does the samething. BMW, don't tell me that's the nature of an electric parking brake and it's just something I'm gonna have to get used to. Jaguar XJs have been using the electric parking brake and it sure doesn't jerk like the 7s.

I know I sound like one unhappy BMW customer, and don't get me wrong...I'm not here to troll up the boards and make all the future BMW customers run away...The car is great, but sometimes I question my BMW purchases of late...

i never experienced this problem with my 2008 bmw. but I have the same issue as some of you now with my 2011. WHen i am at a full stop at times, it just starts jerking. this morning on the way to work it jumped about a foot, and it was gona do it again. i find either putting it in N or switching to steptronic as a temp fix but this is retarded, i cant feel safe driving knowing i could rear end someone. I have only about 11.5k miles on my 328. WHen i picked it up it had about 10.3k on it. i never had an issue with this until it reached about 11k. I dont know why they cant do something about this. its 2013 for petes sake, we shouldnt be having the same issues so many years later. i used to enjoy driving bmws, but over the past 7-10 years i find i am slowly finding them repulsive.

[REDBIRDE90]

My 2006 E90 325i has the ZF trans and it is annoying and jerks just before full stop. Still waiting to hear if anyone has gotten the S/W upgrade that fixed it. My wife's 2004 X3 has the GM trans and it is flawless.

It's funny how someone posted that the GM was the bad one....

Just hope someone has positive feedback as I don't want to spend $285 for the dealer to do updates or reset the adaptive values and it re-appears next day. Also, 3-different dealers say to never change trans. fluid even though owners manual says do it @ 100K miles.