Former original (2008) 135i owner; BMW Brand Name/Reputation is Deteriorating

[x97Melbourne]

Hi guys, some may remember me as one of the original members of this forum when I special ordered one of the first 135i 's back in Summer of 2008! Great car, miss it all the time. It is my favorite BMW I've owned. Haven't been too active on here lately, but I look every now and then with great fondness and enjoy reading all the comments about the 1.

I saw the new 235i for myself here in Orlando @ Fields. A great looking car!! Hat's off to the designers. (2 pictures below -- hot car)

I have been feeling some mild bitterness lately with the BMW brand and want to get it off my chest and maybe some others feel the same way!!!

I've been feeling it more and more that BMW is loosing it's way. Look at all the models 2...3....4....5....6....7..... They have SUVs/trucks now.....X1.....X3.....X5....etc. How many more models do they plan on rolling out? Hell, they even have station wagon model(s). What's next a pick-up truck?
Look at the models offered with automatic transmission (every single one now). Remember when "M" models were manual only? Remember when M cars received a certain level of admiration? I already see in the car magazines that the M235i is just another car. There has been no fan fare -- it's not special anymore.

When I asked the Orlando dealer to tell me when they get a 2-series manual transmission in to test drive, the salesman rolled his eyes at me and literally told me it wasn't going to happen. Isn't this supposed to be an (entry level of course) "M" car? I remember when "M" was a driver enthusiast's car. I remember when there were things more important than 0-60 and driving a BMW took a certain amount of finesse and class.

Look at the comments (on this forum) ALREADY saying the 228i doesn't have the same driving satisfaction as the 128i. It's supposed to be getting better, not worse. Is the ultimate goal for a robot to drive the cars for us? Maybe some day we won't have to drive at all!

Look at the 4-series design. Does anyone really think that is better (in any way) than the outgoing 3 series models? I'm in favor of new fuel efficient engines, but not at the expense of driving satisfaction. And, what is the need to come up with a new model number -- it's dumbing down the brand. Think about it. And (personal opinion) I think the old 3-series coupes and convertibles are MUCH better looking.

For pete-sakes, BMW even has a model build to compete with a Civic Si (320i). Come on.....give me a break.... What's next -- a 2015 310i priced @ $23,000 with a 140HP engine with a pencil-thin steering wheel which targets Elantra buyers? Let's get BMWs into high school parking lots!! Yeah!! Everyone gets a BMW!!!!

Call me nuts (and I'm sure people will) but I'm loosing my ga-ga "awe" with the BMW brand. BMW wasn't originally built so everyone could have one. BMW used to be a high-class driver-oriented, exclusive brand. Now it's a car for the masses and literally everyone can afford one. Want an M-brand but don't want to drive a stick?? NO PROBLEM!!!! Want a $30,000 BMW that doesn't drive like one?? Sure!!!!

BMW makes awesome automobiles and I have the pleasure to drive one. But, I'm less and less glad/proud to drive one these days.... The roundel is loosing it's intended meaning. BMWs aren't turning heads (especially mine) as much these days....

Please send hate mail my way -- but please don't key my BMW -- because I love it.
Ok...sorry...RANT is over!!!

[1GrayBulldog]

Originally Posted by x97Melbourne

Hi guys, some may remember me as one of the original members of this forum when I special ordered one of the first 135i 's back in Summer of 2008! Great car, miss it all the time. It is my favorite BMW I've owned. Haven't been too active on here lately, but I look every now and then with great fondness and enjoy reading all the comments about the 1.

I saw the new 235i for myself here in Orlando @ Fields. A great looking car!! Hat's off to the designers. (2 pictures below -- hot car)

I have been feeling some mild bitterness lately with the BMW brand and want to get it off my chest and maybe some others feel the same way!!!

I've been feeling it more and more that BMW is loosing it's way. Look at all the models 2...3....4....5....6....7..... They have SUVs/trucks now.....X1.....X3.....X5....etc. How many more models do they plan on rolling out? Hell, they even have station wagon model(s). What's next a pick-up truck?
Look at the models offered with automatic transmission (every single one now). Remember when "M" models were manual only? Remember when M cars received a certain level of admiration? I already see in the car magazines that the M235i is just another car. There has been no fan fare -- it's not special anymore.

When I asked the Orlando dealer to tell me when they get a 2-series manual transmission in to test drive, the salesman rolled his eyes at me and literally told me it wasn't going to happen. Isn't this supposed to be an (entry level of course) "M" car? I remember when "M" was a driver enthusiast's car. I remember when there were things more important than 0-60 and driving a BMW took a certain amount of finesse and class.

Look at the comments (on this forum) ALREADY saying the 228i doesn't have the same driving satisfaction as the 128i. It's supposed to be getting better, not worse. Is the ultimate goal for a robot to drive the cars for us? Maybe some day we won't have to drive at all!

Look at the 4-series design. Does anyone really think that is better (in any way) than the outgoing 3 series models? I'm in favor of new fuel efficient engines, but not at the expense of driving satisfaction. And, what is the need to come up with a new model number -- it's dumbing down the brand. Think about it.

For pete-sakes, BMW even has a model build to compete with a Civic Si (320i). Come on.....give me a break.... What's next -- a 2015 310i priced @ $23,000 with a 140HP engine with a pencil-thin steering wheel which targets Elantra buyers? Let's get BMWs into high school parking lots!! Yeah!! Everyone gets a BMW!!!!

Call me nuts (and I'm sure people will) but I'm loosing my ga-ga "awe" with the BMW brand. BMW wasn't originally built so everyone could have one. BMW used to be a high-class driver-oriented, exclusive brand. Now it's a car for the masses and literally everyone can afford one. Want an M-brand but don't want to drive a stick?? NO PROBLEM!!!! Want a $30,000 BMW that doesn't drive like one?? Sure!!!!

BMW makes awesome automobiles and I have the pleasure to drive one. But, I'm less and less glad/proud to drive one these days.... The roundel is loosing it's intended meaning. BMWs aren't turning heads (especially mine) as much these days....

Please send hate mail my way -- but please don't key my BMW -- because I love it.

Make way for progress. It may not be what you remember and for that most on here will envy your past experience as we can only read about what it used to be like across the board. That being said, BMW still makes some of the best mass produced enthusiast cars out there. You just have to know where to look.

[..]

I don't remember M models ever being manual only. To my knowledge, all M3s came as an option in automatic.

That's besides your point though which I entirely agree! The days of true, "Driver's cars" are long gone but it's not just BMW.. It is EVERY car manufacturer.

[GR1P]

OP, I agree with you 100%.

BMWs are everywhere here in southern CA and have been played out since the late 90s/early 00s.

Being in the last batch produced, I just took delivery of my 135is a couple of months ago. It was either the 1 series or nothing. I wasn't willing to settle for a dumbed down 2 series.

[tuco44]

Originally Posted by x97Melbourne

Hi guys, some may remember me as one of the original members of this forum when I special ordered one of the first 135i 's back in Summer of 2008! Great car, miss it all the time. It is my favorite BMW I've owned. Haven't been too active on here lately, but I look every now and then with great fondness and enjoy reading all the comments about the 1.

I saw the new 235i for myself here in Orlando @ Fields. A great looking car!! Hat's off to the designers. (2 pictures below -- hot car)

I have been feeling some mild bitterness lately with the BMW brand and want to get it off my chest and maybe some others feel the same way!!!

I've been feeling it more and more that BMW is loosing it's way. Look at all the models 2...3....4....5....6....7..... They have SUVs/trucks now.....X1.....X3.....X5....etc. How many more models do they plan on rolling out? Hell, they even have station wagon model(s). What's next a pick-up truck?
Look at the models offered with automatic transmission (every single one now). Remember when "M" models were manual only? Remember when M cars received a certain level of admiration? I already see in the car magazines that the M235i is just another car. There has been no fan fare -- it's not special anymore.

When I asked the Orlando dealer to tell me when they get a 2-series manual transmission in to test drive, the salesman rolled his eyes at me and literally told me it wasn't going to happen. Isn't this supposed to be an (entry level of course) "M" car? I remember when "M" was a driver enthusiast's car. I remember when there were things more important than 0-60 and driving a BMW took a certain amount of finesse and class.

Look at the comments (on this forum) ALREADY saying the 228i doesn't have the same driving satisfaction as the 128i. It's supposed to be getting better, not worse. Is the ultimate goal for a robot to drive the cars for us? Maybe some day we won't have to drive at all!

Look at the 4-series design. Does anyone really think that is better (in any way) than the outgoing 3 series models? I'm in favor of new fuel efficient engines, but not at the expense of driving satisfaction. And, what is the need to come up with a new model number -- it's dumbing down the brand. Think about it. And (personal opinion) I think the old 3-series coupes and convertibles are MUCH better looking.

For pete-sakes, BMW even has a model build to compete with a Civic Si (320i). Come on.....give me a break.... What's next -- a 2015 310i priced @ $23,000 with a 140HP engine with a pencil-thin steering wheel which targets Elantra buyers? Let's get BMWs into high school parking lots!! Yeah!! Everyone gets a BMW!!!!

Call me nuts (and I'm sure people will) but I'm loosing my ga-ga "awe" with the BMW brand. BMW wasn't originally built so everyone could have one. BMW used to be a high-class driver-oriented, exclusive brand. Now it's a car for the masses and literally everyone can afford one. Want an M-brand but don't want to drive a stick?? NO PROBLEM!!!! Want a $30,000 BMW that doesn't drive like one?? Sure!!!!

BMW makes awesome automobiles and I have the pleasure to drive one. But, I'm less and less glad/proud to drive one these days.... The roundel is loosing it's intended meaning. BMWs aren't turning heads (especially mine) as much these days....

Please send hate mail my way -- but please don't key my BMW -- because I love it.
Ok...sorry...RANT is over!!!

Hell, I bought my first BMW in 1971..think about how I might feel...

[bmw1racer]

Originally Posted by DurimOne54

I don't remember M models ever being manual only. To my knowledge, all M3s came as an option in automatic.

Trivia: The E30 M3s had a dog-leg first gear.

[Worra]

While I agree with many of OP's sentiments, I think it's important to note that the M235i is not an "M" car.

[IEDEI]

well a few things....

firstly my 135is my first BMW and I think it is a VERY special car. Direct, well built, well engineered, and a whole lot of fun.

I do agree with the OP about the state of BMW-----but the funny thing is that ALL the automakers have had to dilute their efforts to stay in profit and in business. We sometimes forget that this is a business and companies need to make sales. The way I see it-----if BMW has to make an X1 through X9 to create enough cash flow to produce great driver cars like the 1er/1M or even an M2.....then I'm fine with it!

the m235 is just a 135 with 150lbs of added weight and a lot more M badges and 'refinement' (no thank you!). A marketing gimmick.....

[vertebra]

I think everyone is a little bitter because BMW's cars of the past were great for their time. 3 things most people on the forum are most upset about are the steering, moving towards turbo only engines and automatic transmissions. Hydraulic steering is a thing of the past. BMW has good electric steering in the new M4, it just has not made it's way to the M235i...yet. The NA engines BMW made were awesome but turbo is not something new for them. Mike Miller's favorite car happens to be a turbo. The 2002 turbo. As far as automatic transmissions go... there should always be manual available. When I moved to Atlanta the first time in 1990 I thought there was no traffic on the roads compared to NY and I could get wherever I wanted to go in 25 minutes. Now it takes me an hour or more. Manual transmission just isn't as appealing anymore. It went from something pleasurable to annoying.

I am very excited to see what they do with the all the carbon fiber that they are planning on incorporating in future cars. Their new carbon fiber tubs like they are going to use in the new Z3 are a game changer.

[B777flyboy]

Couldn't agree more. Purchased my first in dec. A 135 of course after seeing this mess begin to unfold.

[Stock4Evr]

I admit that I am not the most knowledgeable person about BMW but I do agree with the originator of this post. After picking up my 2012 135i and having the PPK1 installed I was lost in the, what is the difference, of the 135is, then the 2 and the m1 or 1m and now a 2m or is it an m2... Do they just change a few features and then call it a NEW model? I would think a NEW model should have many changes not just a couple. In any case I love my 135i and plan to keep it til I die.

[Billup]

Love my 128, not sure if I will stick with BMW on my next go around, though. As much as I enjoy driving my car, I don't know if there is anything in the near future that will give me the same amount of pleasure with all the changes being made.

Time will tell.

[ejm3]

Why is it I think the same conversation was had 35 years ago when we all switched over to unleaded gas on cars with catalytic converters.

But we got through it and ended up with better cars.

[JeffyD]

I agree that the way BMW is going in terms of design is completely redundant to each series, isn't anything special, and, overall, has lost much of its character.

The dilution if M everything is and has been apparent for a long time. Why does my is have all of these damned M logos on it everywhere? It isn't an M car... Love the wheels, shift knob, and pedals, but what's with the M door sills? Etc... The M235i is supposed to harken back to the days when there wasn't an M6. Just an M6xx series. A 6 series M tinkered with. But it isn't really like that anymore. I mean, the M235i doesn't even have a direct "average" 235i to have been tinkered with to begin with. Huh?

Also, the fact that at least some future of 1 series models will be the base, economy, no frills line but featuring mini-derived FWD is ridiculous. Especially when they say "feels as RWD as our engineers could make it." Ugh.

But you're wrong on some things, too. Firstly, wagons are awesome and BMW has offered some of the best wagons ever. Americans just don't buy them. Hence the GT garbage. Also, a 320 line is supposed to be a reemergence of a base level drivers car from the days of yore. BMW wasn't always considered a "premium" or "luxury" brand. That is what killed it when yuppies in America made it such. It was originally a manufacturer of great driving cars that everyday guys could afford. It might not have been on the same level of a Yaris equivalent back in the day, but it certainly didn't have the snobbish clientele stereotype that it now caters to, either.

Hell, outside of the US, BMW never gained such a perception and has always offered a reasonably priced line. These are seen as some of the best cars in terms of weight and dynamics as one can get in terms of their segment. And are the basis for the "performance" heritage often referred to.

I, personally, would love if BMW lost its yuppie crowd, and was forced to go back to making reasonable daily drivers and award winning sport lines based on such lines.

[edisapimp]

If we're being realistic, and we have a decision to make between producing a larger variety of cars that appeal to a broader section of the car buying market versus producing cars for the "enthusiast" crowd to avoid dilution of the mark, then I have bad news for you; BMW (and any other car production company that wishes to stay in business) is going to go with option 'A' every time.

If they could sell you a cheerios box with wheels and a roundel for $30k you don't think they would?

It's sad to admit it, but BMW as a mark has already achieved the fame and distinction as one of the great auto makers of all time, so people will buy X1s, and M224xis Type R's if they are produced.

It's purely economics, I wouldn't take it personally.

[RoundelM3]

So let's see...Porsche now builds SUVs and an ugly 4-door sedan. Does that mean their brand is "deteriorating" as well? Corporations are in business to make money, not to pander to a minority of enthusiasts, which is what is really deteriorating. Every year, there are less and less of us who are confirmed "car enthusiasts" who find driving a car to be a an enjoyable activity and don't view a car as just a transportation appliance. We're the vanishing breed, and that our favorite car company or companies are trying to stay afloat by producing what the majority of their customers want (or think they want) is not a sign of some sort of failure.

That said, BMW stands apart from run-of-the-mill manufacturers. If you want a pure sports car with no frills, buy a Lotus. See how you enjoy driving that kind of car day in and day out, as not everyone can buy both a pure performance car and an everyday car. I think of my 335i as both - but not to an extreme in either role.

[stangman]

Originally Posted by roundel335

So let's see...Porsche now builds SUVs and an ugly 4-door sedan. Does that mean their brand is "deteriorating" as well? Corporations are in business to make money, not to pander to a minority of enthusiasts, which is what is really deteriorating. Every year, there are less and less of us who are confirmed "car enthusiasts" who find driving a car to be a an enjoyable activity and don't view a car as just a transportation appliance. We're the vanishing breed, and that our favorite car company or companies are trying to stay afloat by producing what the majority of their customers want (or think they want) is not a sign of some sort of failure.

That said, BMW stands apart from run-of-the-mill manufacturers. If you want a pure sports car with no frills, buy a Lotus. See how you enjoy driving that kind of car day in and day out, as not everyone can buy both a pure performance car and an everyday car. I think of my 335i as both - but not to an extreme in either role.

+1 Well said.

[1GrayBulldog]

Originally Posted by roundel335

So let's see...Porsche now builds SUVs and an ugly 4-door sedan. Does that mean their brand is "deteriorating" as well? Corporations are in business to make money, not to pander to a minority of enthusiasts, which is what is really deteriorating. Every year, there are less and less of us who are confirmed "car enthusiasts" who find driving a car to be a an enjoyable activity and don't view a car as just a transportation appliance. We're the vanishing breed, and that our favorite car company or companies are trying to stay afloat by producing what the majority of their customers want (or think they want) is not a sign of some sort of failure.

That said, BMW stands apart from run-of-the-mill manufacturers. If you want a pure sports car with no frills, buy a Lotus. See how you enjoy driving that kind of car day in and day out, as not everyone can buy both a pure performance car and an everyday car. I think of my 335i as both - but not to an extreme in either role.

Nailed it. My sentiments exactly! +1

[AchtungF80]

While I share many of your sentiments OP, both like you being one of the first year one-of-the-one owners...you are stretching quite a bit and let me be the first to say, I agree that the brand is watering down a bit much for my taste as well...

The 320i does not compete with the Civic Si - it is an alternative to a premium midsize sedan...why buy Honda Accord V6 anyone for $34k when you can have a BMW for $34k.

The 1-series (e82) did not have any fanfare if you remember in 2008, just a lot of magazines hyping up the stats (300hp twin turbo in a car smaller in both weight and size than the E9x 3-series).

The first automatic available in an M-car (a real M car and not an M-1/3/5 series) was the E36 M3 in 1995.

The X series in many cases improved the BMW brand from a financial aspect, so if they need to sell bread and butter cars to stay relevant and keep making high performance, enthusiast M-cars, so be it.

If you really want to support BMW's "old ways", do what I did and buy an old BMW.

end rant!

[tuco44]

Originally Posted by roundel335

So let's see...Porsche now builds SUVs and an ugly 4-door sedan. Does that mean their brand is "deteriorating" as well? Corporations are in business to make money, not to pander to a minority of enthusiasts, which is what is really deteriorating. Every year, there are less and less of us who are confirmed "car enthusiasts" who find driving a car to be a an enjoyable activity and don't view a car as just a transportation appliance. We're the vanishing breed, and that our favorite car company or companies are trying to stay afloat by producing what the majority of their customers want (or think they want) is not a sign of some sort of failure.

That said, BMW stands apart from run-of-the-mill manufacturers. If you want a pure sports car with no frills, buy a Lotus. See how you enjoy driving that kind of car day in and day out, as not everyone can buy both a pure performance car and an everyday car. I think of my 335i as both - but not to an extreme in either role.

Good post.

[rrinorl]

Ahh.. is that fields of winter park? i want to go take a look...

[Gray_Panther]

Originally Posted by bmw1racer

Trivia: The E30 M3s had a dog-leg first gear.

False, the 190E did

I agree with OP, EXCEPT on one issue. It is losing*, not "loosing"

Losing is when you are not winning.

Loosing does not exist, the proper term is loosening, as in loosening the noose.