N52 before and after nitrous dyno

[Dafttt]

Originally Posted by flinchy

i mean.. there's people with 3.2 stroker and S54 ITB swaps making 330-350whp ffs...

Related:

http://www.ovdgroeprallyteam.nl/de-auto.html

[JimD]

Originally Posted by MarkkyyMan

Is the n54 a liner or cast iron sleeve?

n54 has steel sleeves in the aluminum block.

[flinchy]

Originally Posted by Daft Auto

Related:

http://www.ovdgroeprallyteam.nl/de-auto.html

Wat!

S54 head swap?

Not just ITB's... Full head? That must be PHENOMENALLY expensive

I thought it sounded like a weirdly snarly s54

Bet that things revs like crazy with that head.

[TheSt|G]

From the top:

-Aluminum engines with iron cylinder sleaves /= a N52. Unrelated.

-That N52 with the E36 ITBs and such has nothing to do with a stock drivetrain street car. Unrelated.

-That rally car just has a S54. Zero N52s present. Unrelated.



This is really no different than the V6 Mustang guys who thought bumping the top speed limiter on their cars was a good ideal, only to have the driveshaft detonate at 130mph. Cars have tolerences in spec with their design. There is obviously wiggle room for safety, but extreme things like nearly doubling the torque will require a fundemental re-evaluation of all the parts involved.

[Dafttt]

Originally Posted by TheSt|G

-That rally car just has a S54. Zero N52s present. Unrelated.

Ah, I see. Google translate basically states it's a 130i with e46 heads, displacing 3.0L.

Pictures show it's clearly an S54. What a marriage though.

[TheSt|G]

Originally Posted by Daft Auto

Ah, I see. Google translate basically states it's a 130i with e46 heads, displacing 3.0L.

Pictures show it's clearly an S54. What a marriage though.

I find it a bit odd that they did not just use an E46 M3. It is a better chassis for such things. I suppose they must have just had an engine and E82 laying around for such things.

[MarkkyyMan]

Originally Posted by TheSt|G

This is really no different than the V6 Mustang guys who thought bumping the top speed limiter on their cars was a good ideal, only to have the driveshaft detonate at 130mph. Cars have tolerences in spec with their design. There is obviously wiggle room for safety, but extreme things like nearly doubling the torque will require a fundemental re-evaluation of all the parts involved.

The first mistake was buying a V6 mustang..

[kobeballer96]

Originally Posted by MarkkyyMan

The first mistake was buying a V6 mustang..

[TheSt|G]

Originally Posted by MarkkyyMan

The first mistake was buying a V6 mustang..

Lets not kid ourselves into thinking that the 128i isn't also the base model.

[kobeballer96]

Im in love with their n52 build!

Custom Radiatior
Custom Headers
Custom Exhaust
Custom Cam
Custom Head
Upgraded Electric Water Pump
Motec M800 ECU
2690lbs
280whp (info is over a year old)
KW Suspension
BMW Performance BBK

[flinchy]

Originally Posted by Daft Auto

Ah, I see. Google translate basically states it's a 130i with e46 heads, displacing 3.0L.

Pictures show it's clearly an S54. What a marriage though.

where are the pics?

both the youtube description and the website says it's an N52 block with S54 head

I mean... it makes WAY more sense for it to just be an S54 swap haha. Shouldn't be possible to put an S54 head on it, what with the coolant jackets and oil passages etc. not lining up... and the S54 being CHEAPER to swap in...

ED: that red one is SICK. i wonder what it revs to?

[edisapimp]

Originally Posted by TheSt|G

This is really no different than the V6 Mustang guys who thought bumping the top speed limiter on their cars was a good ideal, only to have the driveshaft detonate at 130mph. Cars have tolerences in spec with their design. There is obviously wiggle room for safety, but extreme things like nearly doubling the torque will require a fundemental re-evaluation of all the parts involved.

^This.

I don't want anyone to think that the following is 128i bashing or 135i proliferating in any way, but the 128 was not made to do what you're about to ask it to do (by adding this much power.)

The reason the 135 is withstanding so much greater power levels than stock is because a car with three liters and two turbos was conceived with performance in mind. I have no facts to substantiate this of course, but throughout history it's always been the case. 4g63, SR20DET, 1/2jz, s54 :wink

These manufacturers kind of *know* they better build their performance models to withstand being driven by maniacs like us.

[Obioban]

If you tune the car for nitrous, it'll run like shit without it. If you tune the car for no nitrous, it'll run like shit with it. If you tune in the middle, it'll run poorly always. And no matter how you tune it, adaptations will be constantly getting screwy by using the nitrous.

Plus, what's the point? The goal (IMO) of going to a drag strip is to measure how fast your car is. If you have a system that's off 99+% of the time, that you turn on at the drag strip... are you actually measuring how fast your car is? Certain doesn't measure how powerful it is on a back road or on a track, which is what really matters.

Crappy platform for a kind of pointless technology, imo. Dumb.

[TheSt|G]

Originally Posted by edisapimp

^This.

I don't want anyone to think that the following is 128i bashing or 135i proliferating in any way, but the 128 was not made to do what you're about to ask it to do (by adding this much power.)

The reason the 135 is withstanding so much greater power levels than stock is because a car with three liters and two turbos was conceived with performance in mind. I have no facts to substantiate this of course, but throughout history it's always been the case. 4g63, SR20DET, 1/2jz, s54 :wink

These manufacturers kind of *know* they better build their performance models to withstand being driven by maniacs like us.

This would be spot on, and not 128i bashing in the slightest.

[kobeballer96]

Originally Posted by Obioban

If you tune the car for nitrous, it'll run like shit without it. If you tune the car for no nitrous, it'll run like shit with it. If you tune in the middle, it'll run poorly always. And no matter how you tune it, adaptations will be constantly getting screwy by using the nitrous.

Plus, what's the point? The goal (IMO) of going to a drag strip is to measure how fast your car is. If you have a system that's off 99+% of the time, that you turn on at the drag strip... are you actually measuring how fast your car is? Certain doesn't measure how powerful it is on a back road or on a track, which is what really matters.

Crappy platform for a kind of pointless technology, imo. Dumb.

one word, OFT. lol switch maps on the go. i would have a reg map and another map with timing retarded and fuel tables adjusted for nitrous and c16

[Obioban]

Originally Posted by kobeballer96

one word, OFT. lol switch maps on the go. i would have a reg map and another map with timing retarded and fuel tables adjusted for nitrous and c16

So, I'd assume you'd have to flash your tune on every time you wanted to drive the car and then back to a non nitrous tune when done?

I don't know about the N52 ecu, but on the S65/S85/S54/S62 there's a flash counter-- after 50 flashes the ECU bricks, and the car won't run. Which would allow you... 25 nitrous uses, assuming no other tunes to your car, until you bricked it.

Not to mention the N52's ECU's bus speed is incredibly slow-- you'd have to wait forever for each flash to actually drive your car.

On the S54, NickG/MaxPSI have figured out a way to have multiple maps on the same flash (triggered by the sport button, to choose between pump gas or race gas). That sounds like a far better solution to me, if you can find someone who could implement it.

Or, really, give up on nitrous because it's dumb for anything but drag cars. It doesn't make your car faster, it just makes your car test faster. Unless your a drag racer (which I suspect you're not, at least in your 128), the only benefit of measuring acceleration is to know what your car can do. Nitrous... isn't that.

[kobeballer96]

Originally Posted by Obioban

So, I'd assume you'd have to flash your tune on every time you wanted to drive the car and then back to a non nitrous tune when done?

I don't know about the N52 ecu, but on the S65/S85/S54/S62 there's a flash counter-- after 50 flashes the ECU bricks, and the car won't run. Which would allow you... 25 nitrous uses, assuming no other tunes to your car, until you bricked it.

Not to mention the N52's ECU's bus speed is incredibly slow-- you'd have to wait forever for each flash to actually drive your car.

On the S54, NickG/MaxPSI have figured out a way to have multiple maps on the same flash (triggered by the sport button, to choose between pump gas or race gas). That sounds like a far better solution to me, if you can find someone who could implement it.

Or, really, give up on nitrous because it's dumb for anything but drag cars. It doesn't make your car faster, it just makes your car test faster. Unless your a drag racer (which I suspect you're not, at least in your 128), the only benefit of measuring acceleration is to know what your car can do. Nitrous... isn't that.

well i street race too, Baltimore MD area is by far the worse for it we are known. im going back to the states this fall. it would be a flash that i would use when going to a Friday night meet and we do random rolling races. i think your impression is that i was be spraying all the time everywhere lol NO! it would be nice to just surprise someone and be a sleeper.

and the 128i ECU hasnt been known to brink. OFT guys have flashed it over 100 times when testing tunes out on the project car on their 328i same ECU. Its not dumb to each and their own. Heck my last car would run circles on M3s and other high powered cars. I just decided to get into this car because there was something just about it =)

[Obioban]

You sure they didn't reset the flash count on the EPROM along the way (ecu hardware mod)?

[Pothole]

Originally Posted by Daft Auto

Ah, I see. Google translate basically states it's a 130i with e46 heads, displacing 3.0L.

Pictures show it's clearly an S54. What a marriage though.

This is the engine from the 1m. I can confirm this as I am dutch and well able to translate.. :P

According to the website the engine is most definitely a 130i N52 with E46 heads. I have sent them an email to confirm.

[TheSt|G]

Originally Posted by Pothole

This is the engine from the 1m. I can confirm this as I am dutch and well able to translate.. :P

According to the website the engine is most definitely a 130i N52 with E46 heads. I have sent them an email to confirm.

What are heads? Engine generally only has a head...

I suspect there was something lost in translation here. Last I heard on this project it was just a straight S54 swap, which would make the most sense from a motorsport perspective.

[135Pats]

I know nothing about the motor in question, but if the end goal is a high revving, really strong NA 6 from BMW…why on earth would you Frankenstein an S54 head with an N52 block? The block won’t take big time power, just wasn’t meant for it despite it being an outstanding motor. S54 swaps are easy and common, relatively speaking. Seems needlessly complex and limiting to drop the S54 head into the N bottom end. IDK this whole “nitrous in an alu/mag NA motor” is senseless to me. Maybe I’m just no fun….Now nitrous in a closed deck, iron block (S54)? That makes plenty of sense.

[TheSt|G]

Originally Posted by 135Pats

I know nothing about the motor in question, but if the end goal is a high revving, really strong NA 6 from BMW…why on earth would you Frankenstein an S54 head with an N52 block? The block won’t take big time power, just wasn’t meant for it despite it being an outstanding motor. S54 swaps are easy and common, relatively speaking. Seems needlessly complex and limiting to drop the S54 head into the N bottom end. IDK this whole “nitrous in an alu/mag NA motor” is senseless to me. Maybe I’m just no fun….Now nitrous in a closed deck, iron block (S54)? That makes plenty of sense.

Even then, if the goal is more power, go for more power. Nick G(under the name of MaxPSI) makes a really good DD friendly S54 turbo kit that puts down serious power.

I simply don't get the allure of nitrous. It gives you a stat sheet number, not a real performance change.