Sex on wheels

[BForbes]

Man check out this video of the M3.... I'm picturing an M1 not being very different than this. WOW....White with the carbon fiber roof is SO HOT. Tell me what you think?

http://www.autoblog.com/2007/05/01/v...romo-surfaces/

[larry lawless]

its really hot, always been a fan of the m3 and if the m1 came out looking something like this, it would really give it presence

[Brookside]

Incredible video - and the black carbon roof is outrageous.
:biggrin:

[WolfsburgerMitFries]

Originally Posted by onehots2k

Tell me what you think?

I think the new 3 series is a dud, and BMW has lost their way in that segment...which is exactly why I'm looking at the 1 series.

A V8 engine, in times of extremely volitale gas prices, is a transparently bad idea....not to mention completely unnecessary considering the performance of the 335i. Gratuitous styling elememts such as the hood buldge and vents of the new M3 are tacky, out of place, and look like something borrowed from Subaru or Mitsubishi...a perfect look for the aftermarket tuner crowd which caters to children and those with childish tastes.

I'm comprehensively unimpressed with the M3, and 3 series in general are as common as dirt anymore, there's nothing distinctive about owning that car today, and car ownership is a whole lot more than its 0-60 time. I'm ready for a fresh approach.

[BForbes]

Originally Posted by WolfsburgerMitFries

I think the new 3 series is a dud, and BMW has lost their way in that segment...which is exactly why I'm looking at the 1 series.

A V8 engine, in times of extremely volitale gas prices, is a transparently bad idea....not to mention completely unnecessary considering the performance of the 335i. Gratuitous styling elememts such as the hood buldge and vents of the new M3 are tacky, out of place, and look like something borrowed from Subaru or Mitsubishi...a perfect look for the aftermarket tuner crowd which caters to children and those with childish tastes.

I'm comprehensively unimpressed with the M3, and 3 series in general are as common as dirt anymore, there's nothing distinctive about owning that car today, and car ownership is a whole lot more than its 0-60 time. I'm ready for a fresh approach.

Wow, that comment was unbelievable. You just totally discredited yourself as a respectable car enthusiast on this site. The characteristics of a high revving V8 and a twin-turbo is very different. An M car is more than 0-60 and this one is bound to kick ass and take names.

What you are saying is that there is no need in the wake of high fuel prices. NEWS FLASH, you should not be spending 30+ on a BMW if worried about gas prices. Do yourself a favor and buy a Civic or a Hybrid and get 50-60mpg. And if they make a diesel for the U.S., do you think its going to be cheap enough to make up for the cost of the car? I think not. Not for a long time. It is bound to be more 3-4 grand more than its nearest competitor.

Your entitled to not like the styling of this car.(many dissagree) But to not show respect for what it stands for is....F*cked up!! I know people that have no clue about cars but know what an M3 is. The car is a legend, the halo car of the BMW brand. It wasnt the best at one thing but it was good at everything. I'm a part of at least 4 different forum sites, most japanese and they show nothing but RESPECT for this car. Yes, they'll say its not reliable, its expensive, etc. but nobody has ever knocked whats under the hood.

And lets totally knock the 3 series. The car that IS the bmw franchise. A car that is yet to be dethroned.

Just like you are interested in the fuel sipping market, there is a sports car market. And this car will fit very well for those who need more than 2 seats.

[Brookside]

For me, hands down, the 3-coupe, especially the 335 is the most all-round satisfying car in their current line-up. Just my opinion.:biggrin:

[spudw]

I think both 2K and Wolf are little on the extreme in your opposing points of view.

Yes the M3 is not what it was. It's heavier and more complex than ever, and it has broken a tradition of M3s using i6 engines. And yes the V8 is incongruent with concerns over fuel economy etc. As much as you're entitled to disagree with styling elements, "gratuitous" implies they have no purpose, and I'm not sure that's the case.

On the other side, as good as the M3 may be, it's a few degrees closer to the Bugatti Veyron end of the spectrum and, as such, is quite a few degrees removed from the original M3 concept. It's heavier and, as such, depends on a bigger powerplant to generate impressive numbers. With enough technology and a large enough sticker price, the wonder that is the M3 is inevitable. But so are Ferraris and Aston Martins.

To say the 3-series, as we knew it and loved it, is totally dead is perhaps extreme. But our good old buddy from high school has grown up to be a stock broker and has changed. Same guy, but it's Scotch and Caviar instead of Beer and Pasta. That rubs some people the wrong way...

Personally, if I could afford one, I'd drive one and every day that I'd have to walk past the tacky hood bulge and air vents to get behind the wheel and light up that V8 would be the best day of my life!!!

[Propagator]

Originally Posted by spudwest

To say the 3-series, as we knew it and loved it, is totally dead is perhaps extreme. But our good old buddy from high school has grown up to be a stock broker and has changed. Same guy, but it's Scotch and Caviar instead of Beer and Pasta. That rubs some people the wrong way...

:thumbup: well put spud

[BForbes]

I mean cars have to evolve. You cant bring a Naturally aspirated I-6 to an 8 party. Audi and the Benz have 8's. Many have said this car will complete with the twin-turbo GTR...which bothers me. Yes, bmw's styling has been controversial and dont look great in pictures but when u see them in person, some just melt your face. I didnt like the current 3sedan when they came out, now I would drive one in a heartbeat.

On another note, more power doesnt always equate to worse performance. Look at the 2008 Corvette. They bumped up the hp by 30 to make it a plump 430hp. Its a 12second car and still achieves 30mpg on the highway. Thats amazing.

[WolfsburgerMitFries]

Originally Posted by onehots2k

Wow, that comment was unbelievable. You just totally discredited yourself as a respectable car enthusiast on this site.

I think you're interpretation quite 1 dimensional. As someone who has owned multiple 3 series, I've watched the car that I was very enthuistiac about become corrupted.

The 3 is becoming too large, and its getting stuffed with counterintuitive technologies like idrive. Related to new technology, if you want to give me the ability to check my oil level on the insturment cluster, that's fine, but don't delete the oil dipstick on the engine...I'd rather not burn up my engine, or overfill it because of a malfunctioning sensor.

The 3's signature driver oriented cockpit now looks like something borrowed from a late 80's Camry, the new simplified instrument cluster looks like something out of any 90's Japenese econobox, my spare 95 Dodge Caravan has a more informative instrument cluster than the current 3 series. And while we're on the inside, what happeded to the trademark well placed window switches on the center console?...now the controls are tilted away from me on the drivers door?

I used to be proud that my BMW always had a full size spare on an identical rim as the rest of the car...now BMW has decided to stick you with those horrible runflats. If you like runflats, fine, that can be YOUR option that YOU order on YOUR car, but don't force me into something I don't want or need. Then there's the matter of Bangle styling.

There's also legitimate competition for all trim levels of the 3 series today, where there was not in the past. If you're looking at the M3 level, the Audi RS4 has a phenominal engine, more mature and elegant styling, and a much sportier (and idrive free) quality feeling interior. And its more distinctive because its not anywhere near as common. But you don't want to see any of that do you? Just as long as you see the M3 badge then its all good to you, right?

I wanted to like the E92, but after an objective evaluation, a just couldn't.

[spudw]

Wolf, I hope for your sake the 1er is satisfying. But for the 1er to overcome all the concerns you appear to have about the 3er, I think it would have to be made by a different manufacturer. 1er will be in the same family, sharing cockpit traits, Bangle styling and I wouldn't be surprised if it has runflats.

On the bright side, it will be smaller and likely more driver-centric. And I do agree that the 3er, starting with the '99 E46 that I drive, has gradually moved away from that principle.

I like the current 3er, but not for the same reason's I liked the E36 and to a lesser extent my E46. I hope the 1er will bring back some of what went out the door with the E28 and E36...

[BForbes]

Many of the things u listed are the same things i dislike about the current 3 also. But it isnt enough for me to not like them at all. Yes i miss the driver-orientated cockpit and gauges, etc. I'm not a fan of the interior and would never buy a black interior in that car. But even though the BMW has gotten bigger, it handles better than the previous models, accelerates faster, has higher lateral g's, its also safer and more economical.

A good friend of mine has an RS4, but its just another numb fast luxo car. Drive an M3 and an RS4 back to back and then come talk to me. Its not more distinctive because its not as common. You dont see them because they cost 60k+ I dont ever expect bmw to have interiors as nice and elegant as audi's.

My point is yes the car has its faults, but the driving experience and performance that I am looking for is met or exceeded.

[eMINI]

And, I'm so late to the party!

Originally Posted by WolfsburgerMitFries

I think the new 3 series is a dud, and BMW has lost their way in that segment...which is exactly why I'm looking at the 1 series.

Originally Posted by WolfsburgerMitFries

A V8 engine, in times of extremely volitale gas prices, is a transparently bad idea....not to mention completely unnecessary considering the performance of the 335i. Gratuitous styling elememts such as the hood buldge and vents of the new M3 are tacky, out of place, and look like something borrowed from Subaru or Mitsubishi...a perfect look for the aftermarket tuner crowd which caters to children and those with childish tastes.

You sound like a grumpy old man! I like that.

Originally Posted by onehots2k

…The characteristics of a high revving V8 and a twin-turbo is very different. An M car is more than 0-60 and this one is bound to kick ass and take names.

Originally Posted by onehots2k

What you are saying is that there is no need in the wake of high fuel prices. NEWS FLASH, you should not be spending 30+ on a BMW if worried about gas prices. Do yourself a favor and buy a Civic or a Hybrid and get 50-60mpg. And if they make a diesel for the U.S., do you think its going to be cheap enough to make up for the cost of the car? I think not. Not for a long time. It is bound to be more 3-4 grand more than its nearest competitor.

Clearly Wolf’s priorities are somewhat in conflict. Mine, too. Gas mileage isn’t really one of ‘em though. I mean I drive a car that’s tiny but still get only 25 mpg in mixed driving. As far is fuel economy goes, I’m thrilled when there are offerings for everyone. At least then I get to decide for myself… me no like when you decide for me.

Originally Posted by onehots2k

Your entitled to not like the styling of this car.(many dissagree) But to not show respect for what it stands for is....F*cked up!! I know people that have no clue about cars but know what an M3 is. The car is a legend, the halo car of the BMW brand. It wasnt the best at one thing but it was good at everything. I'm a part of at least 4 different forum sites, most japanese and they show nothing but RESPECT for this car. Yes, they'll say its not reliable, its expensive, etc. but nobody has ever knocked whats under the hood.

Sounds like the criticisms are rooted in appearance concerns. So long as form follows function, I’ll allow them some leeway. Heck, I learned to love the Z3-based M Coupe!

Originally Posted by onehots2k

And lets totally knock the 3 series. The car that IS the bmw franchise. A car that is yet to be dethroned.

And the reasons for all that success… continued improvement on an already great car and accurately assessing the needs/wants of the car-buying public.

Originally Posted by spudwest

I think both 2K and Wolf are little on the extreme in your opposing points of view.

Originally Posted by spudwest

Yes the M3 is not what it was. It's heavier and more complex than ever, and it has broken a tradition of M3s using i6 engines. And yes the V8 is incongruent with concerns over fuel economy etc. As much as you're entitled to disagree with styling elements, "gratuitous" implies they have no purpose, and I'm not sure that's the case.

<snip>

To say the 3-series, as we knew it and loved it, is totally dead is perhaps extreme. But our good old buddy from high school has grown up to be a stock broker and has changed. Same guy, but it's Scotch and Caviar instead of Beer and Pasta. That rubs some people the wrong way...

Personally, if I could afford one, I'd drive one and every day that I'd have to walk past the tacky hood bulge and air vents to get behind the wheel and light up that V8 would be the best day of my life!!!

What can I say, except that you’re so right.

Originally Posted by onehots2k

I mean cars have to evolve. You cant bring a Naturally aspirated I-6 to an 8 party. Audi and the Benz have 8's. Many have said this car will complete with the twin-turbo GTR...which bothers me. Yes, bmw's styling has been controversial and dont look great in pictures but when u see them in person, some just melt your face. I didnt like the current 3sedan when they came out, now I would drive one in a heartbeat.

I’ve experienced much the same turnaround in my attitude toward the E90/E92… if only it were smaller…

Originally Posted by WolfsburgerMitFries

… As someone who has owned multiple 3 series, I've watched the car that I was very enthuistiac about become corrupted.

Originally Posted by WolfsburgerMitFries

The 3 is becoming too large, and its getting stuffed with counterintuitive technologies like idrive. Related to new technology, if you want to give me the ability to check my oil level on the insturment cluster, that's fine, but don't delete the oil dipstick on the engine...I'd rather not burn up my engine, or overfill it because of a malfunctioning sensor.

The 3's signature driver oriented cockpit now looks like something borrowed from a late 80's Camry, the new simplified instrument cluster looks like something out of any 90's Japenese econobox, my spare 95 Dodge Caravan has a more informative instrument cluster than the current 3 series. And while we're on the inside, what happeded to the trademark well placed window switches on the center console?...now the controls are tilted away from me on the drivers door?

I used to be proud that my BMW always had a full size spare on an identical rim as the rest of the car...now BMW has decided to stick you with those horrible runflats. If you like runflats, fine, that can be YOUR option that YOU order on YOUR car, but don't force me into something I don't want or need. Then there's the matter of Bangle styling.

I wanted to like the E92, but after an objective evaluation, a just couldn't.

Though I sometimes disagree with you, you’re absolutely right on all counts, here. I demand a new BMW small, light & simple! But if I can’t have that, maybe I can be happy with one is smaller, lighter and simpler than the E92.

Originally Posted by spudwest

Wolf, I hope for your sake the 1er is satisfying. But for the 1er to overcome all the concerns you appear to have about the 3er, I think it would have to be made by a different manufacturer. 1er will be in the same family, sharing cockpit traits, Bangle styling and I wouldn't be surprised if it has runflats.

Originally Posted by spudwest

On the bright side, it will be smaller and likely more driver-centric. And I do agree that the 3er, starting with the '99 E46 that I drive, has gradually moved away from that principle.

I like the current 3er, but not for the same reason's I liked the E36 and to a lesser extent my E46. I hope the 1er will bring back some of what went out the door with the E28 and E36...

Dude! I’m all about the E28 (my current track car) and E36 (100k miles in that one, too). Hopefully they can re-capture some of that magic.

Originally Posted by onehots2k

My point is yes the car has its faults, but the driving experience and performance that I am looking for is met or exceeded.

I can only hope you’re right about this. You are right… right?

[BForbes]

Ofcourse I'm right...the main reason i love bimmers are there driving dynamics! And with this 1 beings smaller and lighter, how could they screw it up. :wink:

[spudw]

:thumbup: Thanks eMini!!!!

Did you just down a 4-pack of Red Bull?

[Propagator]

Originally Posted by WolfsburgerMitFries

I think you're interpretation quite 1 dimensional. As someone who has owned multiple 3 series, I've watched the car that I was very enthuistiac about become corrupted.

The 3 is becoming too large, and its getting stuffed with counterintuitive technologies like idrive. Related to new technology, if you want to give me the ability to check my oil level on the insturment cluster, that's fine, but don't delete the oil dipstick on the engine...I'd rather not burn up my engine, or overfill it because of a malfunctioning sensor.

The 3's signature driver oriented cockpit now looks like something borrowed from a late 80's Camry, the new simplified instrument cluster looks like something out of any 90's Japenese econobox, my spare 95 Dodge Caravan has a more informative instrument cluster than the current 3 series. And while we're on the inside, what happeded to the trademark well placed window switches on the center console?...now the controls are tilted away from me on the drivers door?

I used to be proud that my BMW always had a full size spare on an identical rim as the rest of the car...now BMW has decided to stick you with those horrible runflats. If you like runflats, fine, that can be YOUR option that YOU order on YOUR car, but don't force me into something I don't want or need. Then there's the matter of Bangle styling.

There's also legitimate competition for all trim levels of the 3 series today, where there was not in the past. If you're looking at the M3 level, the Audi RS4 has a phenominal engine, more mature and elegant styling, and a much sportier (and idrive free) quality feeling interior. And its more distinctive because its not anywhere near as common. But you don't want to see any of that do you? Just as long as you see the M3 badge then its all good to you, right?

I wanted to like the E92, but after an objective evaluation, a just couldn't.

That is a BITCHING summary of all things that are wrong with E90.

Is dipstick really just too much of a pain to deal with for the majority of BMW owners? Who are these people??

[larry lawless]

looking at what has been going on i just have to say i think that some of you are not about change. things never stay completely the same as they where when they are originally released. take yourself for instance, when you where born you where small, light, and agile. but you where also stupid as a child. so people enjoyed you mostly because of your YOUTH, ENERGY, and all around GOOD NATURE. but over the years you GREW UP, got BIGGER, and HEAVIER. and amongst all that you also gained a lot of KNOWLEDGE and with that knowledge came POWER.

now that you are older and more sophisticated do people dislike you more probably not and if they do they are entitled to, but they should still respect you with the utmost. granted there are some qualities about your self now you would like to exchange with some of your youth like qualities, but for the most part. most of us would rather stay who we are now with the knowledge and power we have now.

its the same thing that has happened to the 3-er. it has grown up and matured into a more SOPHISTICATED vehicle. its gotten BIGGER, HEAVIER, and has attained more KNOWLEDGE. but with all that it has also got a lot more POWER(talking mostly about the m3 models). now that is has all this KNOWLEDGE and POWER its a very different beast than it was when it was born, but so are you.

look at it this way do you still have the same friends you had when you where in first grade, or have they changed over the years and now you have some completely different friends with maybe 1 or 2 of the same ones still hanging on in there. what you should ask yourself is are you one of the friends that has changed or are you hanging on in there. i mean if you look at the sum of things it was really inevitable for the m3 to grow into what it is now based on what everyone else was doing around it.

and i bet if you asked it (m3) if it would like to go back to what it used to be it would say no just like you


PS i own a e30 m3 and i love it, but i love all the models up the the e92, they where just great cars to ride in,chill in, and most of all to drive. now i know the rs4 is a great car 2 cause my friend has one and i have driven it but it lacks a lot of fun factor that the even e46 had so im expecting the e92 fill that gap when its released:roundel::respekt:

[eMINI]

Larry!

Thanks for the extremely funny and quite accurate analogy. I couldn't agree more. :thumbup:

<slight pause>

Now build me a small, light, powerful car with youth, energy and an all-around good nature. Also equip it with knowledge and two nice cup holders. :wink:

[BForbes]

Originally Posted by larry lawless

looking at what has been going on i just have to say i think that some of you are not about change. things never stay completely the same as they where when they are originally released. take yourself for instance, when you where born you where small, light, and agile. but you where also stupid as a child. so people enjoyed you mostly because of your YOUTH, ENERGY, and all around GOOD NATURE. but over the years you GREW UP, got BIGGER, and HEAVIER. and amongst all that you also gained a lot of KNOWLEDGE and with that knowledge came POWER.

now that you are older and more sophisticated do people dislike you more probably not and if they do they are entitled to, but they should still respect you with the utmost. granted there are some qualities about your self now you would like to exchange with some of your youth like qualities, but for the most part. most of us would rather stay who we are now with the knowledge and power we have now.

its the same thing that has happened to the 3-er. it has grown up and matured into a more SOPHISTICATED vehicle. its gotten BIGGER, HEAVIER, and has attained more KNOWLEDGE. but with all that it has also got a lot more POWER(talking mostly about the m3 models). now that is has all this KNOWLEDGE and POWER its a very different beast than it was when it was born, but so are you.

look at it this way do you still have the same friends you had when you where in first grade, or have they changed over the years and now you have some completely different friends with maybe 1 or 2 of the same ones still hanging on in there. what you should ask yourself is are you one of the friends that has changed or are you hanging on in there. i mean if you look at the sum of things it was really inevitable for the m3 to grow into what it is now based on what everyone else was doing around it.

and i bet if you asked it (m3) if it would like to go back to what it used to be it would say no just like you


PS i own a e30 m3 and i love it, but i love all the models up the the e92, they where just great cars to ride in,chill in, and most of all to drive. now i know the rs4 is a great car 2 cause my friend has one and i have driven it but it lacks a lot of fun factor that the even e46 had so im expecting the e92 fill that gap when its released:roundel::respekt:

I couldnt have said it better. BTW, I'm crazy jealous of your E30 M3. i was looking at one but they are CRAZY expensive....such a HOT car.

[spudw]

Larry, could you post a full size shot of your M3?

[larry lawless]

Originally Posted by spudwest

Larry, could you post a full size shot of your M3?

the last one is the car when i 1st got it

[Propagator]

^^^
Nooooooooooooooice..... :headbang: