1M Officially gone in Houston. Can't even pre-order...

[KingOfJericho]

Because I've seen this all before. You guys are falling victim to MARKETING. When has BMW released a car that was completely sold out before the first one even touched US soil? Never. It just wouldn't make sense. They are going to sell as many as they can to all who want them. That means that some of you will be waiting longer than others but anyone who wants one will have one. iPad2 anyone?

[DiavelM3]

Originally Posted by Red135

It seems that a negative opinion of the 1M is effecting how you expect it to fair on the open market. There is only going to be 600 in the US, 450 in the UK, but that isn't a limited release? Is it because it isn't numbered?

All good points, but, what I was trying to convey is that there have been models in the past (limited edition and not LTD.) that had a huge reaction when they were first released and yet, many people were able to get their hands on them. In other threads in this forum, there have been other members that have posted their exprience with other makes and models and the FRENZY prior to production of the car(s). Yet, they were still able to purchase one 6 months - year afterward.... Just saying, anything is possible with this car. You may be one of the lucky few that ever get to own one of these new 1M's. On the other hand, we ALL (on this forum) may be the proud owners of one...

Also, Dr. Seigler stated, "Not limited but hard to get." This came from the man himself. So, yes, not limited release.... Or so they say.... Don't buy into everything you hear and read...

[Red135]

Originally Posted by KingOfJericho

Because I've seen this all before. You guys are falling victim to MARKETING. When has BMW released a car that was completely sold out before the first one even touched US soil? Never. It just wouldn't make sense. They are going to sell as many as they can to all who want them. That means that some of you will be waiting longer than others but anyone who wants one will have one. iPad2 anyone?

You are assuming that BMW really cares to sell a great amount of these. If they did limit it and they sold them all, BMW would be fine with it. Whatever they limited it to wouldn't be arbitrary.

What marketing? BMW has barely done anything to market the 1M. I statement made to a website that was only seen by people specifically looking for it, it hardly marketing. At least 600 cars is a number that has been provided. It may change, but it isn't guesswork.

iPad 2 = 1M? Ridiculous comparison.

[KingOfJericho]

You don't think that slowly undressing a car over a prolonged period of time at various events with a super secret website room dedicated to it is marketing? It was done in this way to create hype and that's exactly what you're falling prey to. The car is not being marketed to the masses, it's being dangled and teased in front of a frothing group of wanting consumers.

The iPad2 is not as poor of a comparison as you think. These waiting lists at the dealers are the same as the giant lines that you see on the news at apple stores and best buys. The iPad2 is currently "sold out" but if you wait a few weeks for the fury to die down, you'll be able to walk into an apple store on any given day and pick one up. I am predicting the exact same thing for the 1M (although it will always be special order, like any other BMW). Time will tell who is right but please bookmark this thread and come back to it in December.

[Red135]

Originally Posted by ferrari4evr1

Don't buy into everything you hear and read...

Why are you assuming that I am buying into anything? I merely pointed out that people shouldn't buy into the idea that they should wait because there will be cars available and for less. There is no way of knowing that. The only thing we know is that cars are available now and if someone absolutely wants one, they shouldn't wait. The cars may remain available, they may not; they may become more expensive, they may become less expensive. Don't be so interested in being right, just acknowledge that there is more than one potential outcome.

[Red135]

Originally Posted by KingOfJericho

You don't think that slowly undressing a car over a prolonged period of time at various events with a super secret website room dedicated to it is marketing? It was done in this way to create hype and that's exactly what you're falling prey to. The car is not being marketed to the masses, it's being dangled and teased in front of a frothing group of wanting consumers.

And this campaign was on television? Or was it on the internet? BMW didn't even announce the unveiling was happening. BMW fan sites and forums did the marketing, not BMW. This is a special production vehicle for a limited customer base. The lack of an automatic is evidence of that; it easily limited the market. BMW's claims of cost aside.

[MDORPHN]

Originally Posted by Red135

And this campaign was on television? Or was it on the internet? BMW didn't even announce the unveiling was happening. BMW fan sites and forums did the marketing, not BMW. This is a special production vehicle for a limited customer base. The lack of an automatic is evidence of that; it easily limited the market. BMW's claims of cost aside.

BMW was actively involved in the successful "viral marketing" of this car. In fact, there are at least two employees whose job includes inciting enthusiasts on forums like this one.

Neil

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by hlmiii

Respectfully ... what is the basis for this (pretty comprehensive) statement?

I don't recall reading or hearing anything that supports it.

It's really not that simple.
And even if it were ... the line availability just isn't there..

In the visit to the Leipzig plant... we were told that 70% of the cars being produced were sold. So 30% of the production is going to load up dealer lots and are available as extra inventory stock around the world for the 1 series and X1 models built there. The plant churns out around 700 cars per day. IIRC, the paint booth is the slowdown... and it runs one extra shift compared to the line because of the time involved.

A little overtime authorization could easily pump out a ton of cars.
At any rate... as others have mentioned... plenty of limited edition cars start off with dealers taking advantage and charging markup and then supply catches up to demand and patient buyers avoid the gouing. The ones that line up first generally pay for the initial exlcusivity.

Porsche GT-3 RS
Ford GT
Honda S2000
Mazda Rx-8
Acura NSX
The Copperhead Viper mentioned earlier
E30 M3
E36 M3 lightweight


the list goes on and on.

[fueledbymetal]

Originally Posted by KingOfJericho

I bet my bottom dollar that there will be FAR more than 600 of these coming to the US.

If I was a betting man I'd take you up on that. We all know that there were limited resources allocated for the 1M project and BMW surely knew the plant would be production limited due to the new X1 pushing factory output capacity. So they must have determined that whatever limited run that could produce would be profitable. And if the car had a positive reception (which it certainly has so far) all the hysteria generated by the limited availability would serve as "free" advertising and help build awareness and demand for the next gen 1M, which would in turn justify a more thorough design. So I wouldn't be surprised if ~600 is all get and seriously doubt we'll get more than 1000.

The ony uncertainty I have is if my dealer will honor our $1k over ED invoice deal when they get their allocation (I'm #1 on their list).

[DiavelM3]

Originally Posted by Red135

Don't be so interested in being right, just acknowledge that there is more than one potential outcome.

Really dude? How about you reread my post??? This isnt about me being right or wrong. You are only re-wording what i said in the post. Right or wrong? Yeah exactly, take your own advise....

Let me break it down for you: This is what you said "that there is more than one potential outcome"

Here is what i said: "Just saying, anything is possible with this car. You may be one of the lucky few that ever get to own one of these new 1M's. On the other hand, we ALL (on this forum) may be the proud owners of one... "

[Red135]

Really dude.

[KingOfJericho]

Originally Posted by Red135

And this campaign was on television? Or was it on the internet? BMW didn't even announce the unveiling was happening. BMW fan sites and forums did the marketing, not BMW. This is a special production vehicle for a limited customer base. The lack of an automatic is evidence of that; it easily limited the market. BMW's claims of cost aside.

You're coming off as extremely naive. Hype can be, and certainly was, generated in very non-typical ways. There were at least 2 "plants" on this forum who did nothing but chum the waters for more than a year before BMW admitted that they were green-lighting the 1M. People were in a frenzy long before a single dealer would take a deposit. The market for this car is not huge but it is dedicated, vocal, and enthusiastic. Being that, I am 100% sure that every person who genuinely wants this car will be able to get one.

[skyphab]

I'm also more into the "you'll get the car if you want to" thinking. But you won't get it immidiately, you'll have to wait.

I think that's the only point: The 1M might not be limited in quantity but it's limited in terms of the customer's patience.
And about the production capacity: In the end it's not about how many cars BMW wants to sell, but what cars have the highest profit margin. The 1M is expensive but volume cars are others and I guess the X1 will sell pretty good.

[cracka]

"Some people will have to wait a few months to get their 1M, but if they can wait, there should be enough."
- Matt Russell

That's what I'm counting on at this point. I can wait.

[Papethova]

Dealerships arent going to be on your side. If they are in the know about allocations they are going to play the consumer to get as high a bid price as they can. If they arent in the know then they are going to do the same to maximize profit on the unit they feel might be their last.

The general public isnt filling the wait lists. Its us on these forums. Im sure numerous people have spots at numerous dealerships. We feed the hype and desperation to the dealerships by demanding to get on a list months before a car is announced or released, then when the ball is rolling they return that hype to us and others wanting to get on the list to maximize their profits and create this frenzy. One dealership tried to get me to pay a 5k mark up on my 135, 2 days later I ordered elsewhere at $500 over INVOICE, almost an 11k difference.

How many people are willing to pay 5k above MSRP? once those few are done the dealership cant demand a premium they are forced to sell at MSRP, when that batch of customers is done they are forced to discount. The line of future 1M owners is not as long as we think. We are in a bubble on this site.

[KingOfJericho]

If you're paying a penny more than MSRP, it's time to find a new dealer. My dealer doesn't play those games and the ones that do do not deserve our business.

[21450]

Originally Posted by KingOfJericho

Because I've seen this all before. You guys are falling victim to MARKETING. When has BMW released a car that was completely sold out before the first one even touched US soil? Never. It just wouldn't make sense. They are going to sell as many as they can to all who want them. That means that some of you will be waiting longer than others but anyone who wants one will have one. iPad2 anyone?

Uh...30 Frozen Grey M3s sold out in 12 minutes

[KingOfJericho]

The M3 is still readily available. We're talking about a model of car, not a specific color. The color was the only unique option on that run.

[hlmiii]

Originally Posted by KingOfJericho

The M3 is still readily available. We're talking about a model of car, not a specific color. The color was the only unique option on that run.

Ok. If you need the exact model that disproves the "it'll be available because BMW works that way" concept ...
2010 M3 GTS
Doesn't matter how much anyone wants one. No one can get one new from dealer or AB.
(Yeah, it wasn't for the USA, but the logic of "when has BMW released a car that was completely sold out" applies.)

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

A little overtime authorization could easily pump out a ton of cars.

How? Speed up the robots? Double the line speed? Don't dry the paint? Leave some parts in a bag to be assembled by the owner??

I don't understand why the situation with lack of physical capacity is dismissed or ignored here. Just seems like some of us are hoping for some sort of conspiratorial agenda where corporate BMW effectively wants to forego easy revenue. The company isn't making up lost volume through higher pricing.

Doesn't make sense.

[DCC]

Originally Posted by KingOfJericho

Because I've seen this all before. You guys are falling victim to MARKETING. When has BMW released a car that was completely sold out before the first one even touched US soil? Never. It just wouldn't make sense. They are going to sell as many as they can to all who want them. That means that some of you will be waiting longer than others but anyone who wants one will have one. iPad2 anyone?

Mini Cooper S GP (only 414 came to the USA)

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by hlmiii

Ok. If you need the exact model that disproves the "it'll be available because BMW works that way" concept ...
2010 M3 GTS
Doesn't matter how much anyone wants one. No one can get one new from dealer or AB.
(Yeah, it wasn't for the USA, but the logic of "when has BMW released a car that was completely sold out" applies.)

How? Speed up the robots? Double the line speed? Don't dry the paint? Leave some parts in a bag to be assembled by the owner??

I don't understand why the situation with lack of physical capacity is dismissed or ignored here. Just seems like some of us are hoping for some sort of conspiratorial agenda where corporate BMW effectively wants to forego easy revenue. The company isn't making up lost volume through higher pricing.

Doesn't make sense.

ok... let's try again..

The line at Leipzig can both be extended (making the line longer and allowing more employees) as well as the fact the line is NOT running 24 hours per day.. there are NOT three shifts of production. These were items that were mentioned by the tour guide giving us a tour of the plant.
I sure hope THIS made sense

[hlmiii]

M3 A -
If you have familiarity with the process then you know BMW does not just quickly and blithely bring in additional people and set up an additional shift.

It's not like operations that have excess capacity, parts, and employees hanging around. Part time and/or contract people are not available on call and the company doesn't use them on the lines. The lines don't run 24/7 for a reason - staff and facilities are not handled that way for quality and safety reasons.

That was covered and emphasized in detail in all three of the tours I have seen. It's how the company operates its production. That makes sense ... and it is very difficult to understand that Germany - which clearly controls the operations here - would be radically different.

All I'm saying is that everything I've participated in during the past eight years underscores the unlikelihood of a simple "just turn up the volume" approach. And if it were that simple why wouldn't BMW just do that instead of precluding the extra profit to be gained? That is what doesn't make sense.