Suspension Install Best Practices

[timhatimay]

As mentioned get a set of E sockets. You will need them for the rear, and also as mentioned for the front strut bar is ever needed. They are on plenty of other places on the car as well, so might as well get the set for future use! The rear is very easy (cake) EXCEPT putting the bolt back into the camber arm to re-assemble everything. It was so much easier to use a wheel pin in the hub to position it. 2 people here will help to position and slide the bolt in. Its not that difficult just tedious, and may take a little time. Be sure to remember the order of bushing for the rear shock mount so you can properly re-assemble this part as well. Nice work on the sway, and good luck on the suspension!

Tim

[Yvette]

interesting, he left 3 bolts on top when unmounting struts from the shell.
I wonder if it works on e82 as well.

[Bimmer-Bob]

Hey, after installing coilovers and camber plates, will I need an alignment ASAP or can it wait two or three weeks? I've heard some people saying you should give time for the suspension to "settle" a little bit.

I know with the M3 front control arms that toe will be way out, but since I won't be installing those is it safe to assume that the car will be pretty much driveable right after the suspension install, even before the alignment is performed?

Finally, since the car will be lowered and camber will be out of factory specs dues to the camber plates, do I need to go to a specialized shop to get the alignment done, and will I need to provide alignment specs for them? Or can I go anywhere that I could normally go? There are a couple of alignment places around, but no good performance shops in my area. I could also go to the dealer but that would likely be expensive, and I'm not sure they would align the car out of spec anyway.

Thoughts?

[vitig]

Originally Posted by Bimmer-Bob

Hey, after installing coilovers and camber plates, will I need an alignment ASAP or can it wait two or three weeks? I've heard some people saying you should give time for the suspension to "settle" a little bit.

I know with the M3 front control arms that toe will be way out, but since I won't be installing those is it safe to assume that the car will be pretty much driveable right after the suspension install, even before the alignment is performed?

Finally, since the car will be lowered and camber will be out of factory specs dues to the camber plates, do I need to go to a specialized shop to get the alignment done, and will I need to provide alignment specs for them? Or can I go anywhere that I could normally go? There are a couple of alignment places around, but no good performance shops in my area. I could also go to the dealer but that would likely be expensive, and I'm not sure they would align the car out of spec anyway.

Thoughts?

I alignment a few little in my house after install m3 front arms.Whit a two suports and a cord,this worked well.

Do you speak spanish?.

[Bimmer-Bob]

Originally Posted by vitig

Do you speak spanish?.

A little, but not well enough to discuss technical car stuff very effectively...

Where in Spain are you? Do you know of any good shops in Andalucia? I'm in Cadiz province.

[vitig]

I'm on the other side, asturias. I wondered why I do not understand the value of the pieces that you bought in dinan,the upper rear mount.For if it is necessary to order them for me.


Where did you buy the pss9?.

[Bimmer-Bob]

I got my PSS9's from Turner Motorsport, but I think they stopped selling them.

[vitig]

How made the rear upper shock mounted of dinan that you mounted.Do you think is neccesary?.I answered it because i change the shocks and i think if should mount it.

[Bimmer-Bob]

Originally Posted by vitig

How made the rear upper shock mounted of dinan that you mounted.Do you think is neccesary?.I answered it because i change the shocks and i think if should mount it.

I haven't installed it yet - it's on backorder from Dinan.

[Bimmer-Bob]

So nobody has any (productive) comments about weather or not an alignment is immediately necessary following a coilover install vice waiting a couple of weeks? My daily commute is very low mileage, so I'm not terribly concerned about uneven tire wear in such a short time - I'm concerned more with drivability following the install. Thanks.

[ianc]

The chief thing you need to be concerned about is the toe-in.

If you are installing the M3 control arms, you will be in very bad shape, if not, then you're probably OK.

If you have the car on the lift and you want to adjust the toe, then just use a tape measure and measure from a specific tread on the left tire to the same tread on the right tire. Do this at the front of the tire and the rear. Compare the measurements. You want about 1/16th of an inch less in the front than the rear.

It is important for the wheels to be pointed straight ahead when you make this measurement.

If you need to adjust, you can do it by alternately lengthening or shorting the tie rods by means of the adjusters on them. Turn the same amount on each (be careful about this) to maintain the steering wheel's centered position. HTH,

ianc

[Bimmer-Bob]

Originally Posted by ianc

The chief thing you need to be concerned about is the toe-in.

If you are installing the M3 control arms, you will be in very bad shape, if not, then you're probably OK.

If you have the car on the lift and you want to adjust the toe, then just use a tape measure and measure from a specific tread on the left tire to the same tread on the right tire. Do this at the front of the tire and the rear. Compare the measurements. You want about 1/16th of an inch less in the front than the rear.

It is important for the wheels to be pointed straight ahead when you make this measurement.

If you need to adjust, you can do it by alternately lengthening or shorting the tie rods by means of the adjusters on them. Turn the same amount on each (be careful about this) to maintain the steering wheel's centered position. HTH,

ianc

Thanks a ton. I'm not doing the M3 control arms yet, so it sounds like I'll be okay waiting a bit on the alignment if needed. I'll be sure to check the toe, though, just in case - thanks for the tip.

[timhatimay]

BimmerBob,

I would think you don't want to perform the string alignment (or measuring tape) on a lift...you would want the tires on the ground and suspension loaded with the car's weight. When I installed my springs/shocks, I didn't notice that the car was very far out of alignment (i.e. undriveable), but depending on the new height and coilovers there could probably be a noticeable change in alignment.

Probably the camber plates will be a big change to the overall alignment too (obviously the camber, but could affect other specs as well), and I would suggest getting the alignment done soon after the install. Probably most shops are capable of performing the alignment, but working with camber plates, coilovers, etc may be out of your average shops realm of expertise. Also if you are adjusting the ride height, I think a corner balance is usually recommended with the alignment. I had some problems the first time I got an alignment at an NTB, and learned my lesson after that. A good performance shop can likely give you the best settings to suit your driving conditions, style, and modifications.

I think the alignment can make a major change in the way the car drives and feels, and with all the great modifications you are doing, finding a good qualified performance shop to apply appropriate settings may be worth the drive or inconvenience.

Tim

[ianc]

I would think you don't want to perform the string alignment (or measuring tape) on a lift...you would want the tires on the ground and suspension loaded with the car's weight.

That would be ideal, but it adds hugely to the difficulty of getting a good measurement and adjusting properly afterwards. I measured unloaded and got very close to the final setting the alignment shop was able to achieve after adding M3 controls arms using this method...

ianc

[thez99]

Ok so this is sorta adding to BB's question about the alignment. I know nothing about measuring toe, and adjusting, etc. So if I were to have springs and shocks installed along with the front control arms and a front m3 bar, what would be my best choice for an alignment. Id obviously be having the setup installed by a good shop, likely a bimmer shop thats close to where ill be moving to next spring, they perform alignments. Question is, once all those items are installed, will they just be able to do the alignment and set everything to where it should be to ride perfect and as it should, or do i actually need to give them specs, etc.???

Like I said, I know NOTHING about these numbers and specs for toe, etc.

[Xaeryan]

Originally Posted by thez99

Ok so this is sorta adding to BB's question about the alignment. I know nothing about measuring toe, and adjusting, etc. So if I were to have springs and shocks installed along with the front control arms and a front m3 bar, what would be my best choice for an alignment. Id obviously be having the setup installed by a good shop, likely a bimmer shop thats close to where ill be moving to next spring, they perform alignments. Question is, once all those items are installed, will they just be able to do the alignment and set everything to where it should be to ride perfect and as it should, or do i actually need to give them specs, etc.???

Like I said, I know NOTHING about these numbers and specs for toe, etc.

Unless you are purchasing camber plates or playing with the front upper strut alignment pin (or something is terribly wrong with your suspension - damage, etc.), the only thing they should need to adjust anyway is toe (absolutely MUST be corrected after M3 front control arms), which any alignment shop should be qualified for getting you within spec. You shouldn't need to give them any specs, but it might be worth having them handy in case they ask; try this thread: http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showt...alignment+spec
Front bar doesn't require any alignment changes on its own.

[Bimmer-Bob]

Originally Posted by Xaeryan

Unless you are purchasing camber plates or playing with the front upper strut alignment pin...

Actually, I am installing Dinan camber plates, which requires removal of the alignment pin.

That link you provided appears to be dead, btw.

[Xaeryan]

Originally Posted by Bimmer-Bob

Actually, I am installing Dinan camber plates, which requires removal of the alignment pin.

That link you provided appears to be dead, btw.

Link fixed; copy/paste error.

My post was in response to thez99, relative to installing "springs and shocks", sorry for the partial thread jack.

[thez99]

Originally Posted by Xaeryan

Link fixed; copy/paste error.

My post was in response to thez99, relative to installing "springs and shocks", sorry for the partial thread jack.

Thanks man. Yea i def dont plan on messing with camber plates, etc. The most ill ever intend on doin to the susp. is spring. shocks and the front bar, I really dont even think id go for the arms tbh. Also, when replacing springs and shocks, is it usually a good idea to replace your strut mounts and spring perches? I was looking at some of that shit last night, not too expensive but why bother if its not necessary right? Would this depend on how many miles you have as well?

[Xaeryan]

Originally Posted by thez99

Thanks man. Yea i def dont plan on messing with camber plates, etc. The most ill ever intend on doin to the susp. is spring. shocks and the front bar, I really dont even think id go for the arms tbh. Also, when replacing springs and shocks, is it usually a good idea to replace your strut mounts and spring perches? I was looking at some of that shit last night, not too expensive but why bother if its not necessary right? Would this depend on how many miles you have as well?

It's not usually necessary, and the BMW Performance Suspension doesn't come with them. However the front upper strut mounts are quite soft and what you'll find is if you've slammed any potholes real good, they may be warped when you take them out. They are easy enough to reform with some gentle coaxing from a soft mallet (or just buying new ones) HOWEVER, they will just go back to warped form if you don't straighten out the strut tower itself - yes, the front strut tower on these cars are pretty weak and easily mushrooms during a hard bottom-out, which is what allows the upper mount to deform (and also will throw off alignment relative side to side). I tapped mine back to form by placing a piece of wood on it and hammering the crap out of it with the car jacked up and the suspension off. Still slightly off (.1 difference between left and right at same alignment pin position).

Bob, to try and answer your question, I don't know based on your setup how far out of alignment it might be after install. My install was the BMW PS, and it didn't require an alignment at ALL after install. But I do know that if you get it aligned right away, and some settling occurs, the most it would do to the alignment is give you a hair more negative camber (good) and a hair more toe-in. In other words, you should still be well within spec after the settling occurs.

[Bimmer-Bob]

Originally Posted by Xaeryan

Bob, to try and answer your question, I don't know based on your setup how far out of alignment it might be after install. My install was the BMW PS, and it didn't require an alignment at ALL after install. But I do know that if you get it aligned right away, and some settling occurs, the most it would do to the alignment is give you a hair more negative camber (good) and a hair more toe-in. In other words, you should still be well within spec after the settling occurs.

Cool - I'll probably just try to get the alignment done ASAP then and not worry about any settling. Thanks, as always.

Now if only Dinan would ship these parts!

[Bimmer-Bob]

Well, I finally got around to starting this job today. Backordered parts, a long vacation, and Christmas all conspired to delay the project.

Anyway, I got the rears done. It took me most of the day, but I didn't hurt myself or break anything. Lining up the suspension arm to put everything back together was definitely the biggest pain in the ass. Eventually I found I could use a screwdriver as a prybar to get everything lined up, and then use my free hand to hammer the bolt through with a rubber mallet. My only concerns are 1, that I'm not sure if I got the upper shock mounts exactly right. I was using a combination of OEM, Dinan, and Bilstein hardware and it wasn't super clear what went on which side of the shock tower (inside the trunk or inside the wheel well). I tried to make it as close to the original set up as possible, hopefully it worked out. The 2nd thing is that I didn't re-use the upper spring perch, and I'm worried that perhaps I should have. Thing is, I couldn't figure out anyway it could fit, because the Bilstein kit has an adjusting mechanism that sits on top of the spring, so there's no way for the upper spring perch to seat correctly. Crossing my fingers on this one.

Tomorrow or the next day I will tackle the struts. Expecting a more difficult job, but hopefully not too bad.

Right now I measure almost exactly a 1" drop at the rear, which is pretty perfect IMO.