Power surges. Out of ideas...help

MZWIE · 09-30-2014, 02:22 PM

I've asked for help before. I really am out of ideas.

Car is 2008 135 w/AT and 105k miles. No tunes added or any other motor mods.

So far:

- New plugs
- New coils
- New VANOS solenoids
- Intake valves cleaned
- No codes
- HPFP and injectors were replaced a couple of years back.

Engine still surges at random. Dealer is no help because no codes. At this point I'll take even the most far fetched suggestion.

There must be an answer somewhere....heeeeelp.

Dackelone · 09-30-2014, 02:39 PM

Did you use spark plugs bought from a BMW dealer? Only those will be sure to work correctly. I've seen guys here replace everything only to find out it was their aftermarket spark plugs.

Where did you buy you coils from?

What about carbon buildup? Might be time to pull the intake manifold and have a looksee.

Have you tried switching fuel brands ? HPFP recall done? Has it ever been replaced ?

Have you checked those vacuum lines at the left side of the valve cover going from the res to the wastegate solenoids. Pull the valve cover off and have a look. They often crack from the heat of the turbos.

Dack

Ed P · 09-30-2014, 02:54 PM

Is it just me, or do we ALL wish Dack was our next-door-neighbor?

Hey Dack, what do you think of living in Florida!? On a saltwater canal, with free access to my hot tub, dock, and wif... er, boat!

Dackelone · 09-30-2014, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ed P

Is it just me, or do we ALL wish Dack was our next-door-neighbor?

Hey Dack, what do you think of living in Florida!? On a saltwater canal, with free access to my hot tub, dock, and wif... er, boat!

Maybe you guys should come over here, and move to Germany!

Ed P · 09-30-2014, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dackelone

Maybe you guys should come over here, and move to Germany!

Been there, done that. Too cold!

Year-round 1er driving in FLA! And always have summer tires on her!

MZWIE · 09-30-2014, 05:00 PM

Dack

Plugs and coils from BMW.
HPFP recall Done. Pump and injectors replaced.
Valves cleaned.

vaccum Lines not checked. Not sure exactly what you mean by left side. Which way are you facing. Pic perhaps if you can Provide one.

Dackelone · 09-30-2014, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by e34m5

vaccum Lines not checked. Not sure exactly what you mean by left side. Which way are you facing. Pic perhaps if you can Provide one.

When standing in front of the open engine... on the left side(passenger side) you need to inspect the vacuum lines going from the vacuum res to the wastegate solenoids.

cheshirecat79 · 09-30-2014, 05:25 PM

I would check measured throttle input % through an app like torque to see if you can pinpoint any spikes and isolate whether it's an engine or signal issue.

MZWIE · 10-06-2014, 09:15 AM

Vaccum lines checked out ok....what's next

Dackelone · 10-06-2014, 09:28 AM

What kind of spark plugs did you use? And where did you buy them from?

Also... when you say: - New VANOS solenoids. Do you mean the sensors that bolt up to the head on the front of the engine? Those go bad.

Have you tried switching fuel brands ? What's your air filter look like? Just a thought.

ONDEMAND · 10-06-2014, 09:32 AM

Please give an example of what the "surge" is. When do you experience it and what are you doing (throttle, pre-post-or durning shift) at the time?

This may be a different issue but with my manual transmission, at slow speeds the car will often hang at a particular rpm or sometimes increase rpms a bit while the clutch is in for the 1-2 shift. in other word you go to shift from 1-2 at say 2,500 rpm and with the clutch in the rpms dont drop they literally stay at 2,500 until you begin to let the clutch out. Its really odd but both 135s ive owned did this. Dealer didnt do shit for it when I had them look at the first car.

Ive just grown to accept it happens here and there.

MZWIE · 10-06-2014, 09:44 AM

Spark plugs purchased at dealer.

VANOS solenoids at the front end of engine. Also from dealer.

The surges feel like a momentary loss of power. It's not an RPM blip but more like turning off a switch and then on again very quickly.

It happens also when using cruise control. Also when leaving a gear selected. It never happens under acceleration. Only seem to happen when cruising, but not at any particlaur speed, RPM or gear.

So far i've not been able to isolate it to a particular set of conditions.

Next question. Could it be transmission related. I have an AT.

3002 tii · 10-06-2014, 09:53 AM

Since no codes means you're not at risk of losing codes, how about just disconnecting battery and reconnect?

MZWIE · 10-06-2014, 10:04 AM

^^ Ok...but what will that do...

RoundelM3 · 10-06-2014, 10:09 AM

You may also want to re-set the throttle adaptation - there are a few threads on here about how that's done (very quick and easy). Also, what about the O2 sensors - have they been checked or replaced? Even though your injectors were replaced, you may want to have them checked out as well as the throttle body. It also could be something vacuum-related as previously suggested, or, possibly something related to the DTC (which can cut power momentarily). Might possibly be a sensor somewhere, although that should throw a code. I think if it were my car, I'd find a really good Indy shop and let them check it over completely.

09-30-2014, 02:22 PM	#1
MZWIE Lieutenant Colonel 388 Rep 1,660 Posts Drives: M2 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: GEORGIA iTrader: (0)	Power surges. Out of ideas...help I've asked for help before. I really am out of ideas. Car is 2008 135 w/AT and 105k miles. No tunes added or any other motor mods. So far: - New plugs - New coils - New VANOS solenoids - Intake valves cleaned - No codes - HPFP and injectors were replaced a couple of years back. Engine still surges at random. Dealer is no help because no codes. At this point I'll take even the most far fetched suggestion. There must be an answer somewhere....heeeeelp.
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09-30-2014, 02:39 PM	#2
Dackelone European Editor 10539 Rep 22,992 Posts Drives: N54 e82 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Bayern, Germany iTrader: (1)	Did you use spark plugs bought from a BMW dealer? Only those will be sure to work correctly. I've seen guys here replace everything only to find out it was their aftermarket spark plugs. Where did you buy you coils from? What about carbon buildup? Might be time to pull the intake manifold and have a looksee. Have you tried switching fuel brands ? HPFP recall done? Has it ever been replaced ? Have you checked those vacuum lines at the left side of the valve cover going from the res to the wastegate solenoids. Pull the valve cover off and have a look. They often crack from the heat of the turbos. Dack __________________ Dackel's European Delivery Museum Guide
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09-30-2014, 02:54 PM	#3
Ed P Second Lieutenant 29 Rep 277 Posts Drives: 2016 Z4 Sdrive28i Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: St. Petersburg, FL iTrader: (0)	Is it just me, or do we ALL wish Dack was our next-door-neighbor? Hey Dack, what do you think of living in Florida!? On a saltwater canal, with free access to my hot tub, dock, and wif... er, boat! __________________ 2016 Z4 Sdrive 28i Black Sapphire Metallic over Black Kansas Leather ... gone but never forgotten ... 2013 135i M-Sport Mineral Gray over Oyster Boston Leather
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09-30-2014, 05:00 PM	#6
MZWIE Lieutenant Colonel 388 Rep 1,660 Posts Drives: M2 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: GEORGIA iTrader: (0)	Dack Plugs and coils from BMW. HPFP recall Done. Pump and injectors replaced. Valves cleaned. vaccum Lines not checked. Not sure exactly what you mean by left side. Which way are you facing. Pic perhaps if you can Provide one.
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09-30-2014, 05:25 PM	#8
cheshirecat79 Captain 32 Rep 919 Posts Drives: 370z & 135i Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Port Saint Lucie, FL iTrader: (0)	I would check measured throttle input % through an app like torque to see if you can pinpoint any spikes and isolate whether it's an engine or signal issue.
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10-06-2014, 09:15 AM	#9
MZWIE Lieutenant Colonel 388 Rep 1,660 Posts Drives: M2 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: GEORGIA iTrader: (0)	Vaccum lines checked out ok....what's next
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10-06-2014, 09:28 AM	#10
Dackelone European Editor 10539 Rep 22,992 Posts Drives: N54 e82 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Bayern, Germany iTrader: (1)	What kind of spark plugs did you use? And where did you buy them from? Also... when you say: - New VANOS solenoids. Do you mean the sensors that bolt up to the head on the front of the engine? Those go bad. Have you tried switching fuel brands ? What's your air filter look like? Just a thought. __________________ Dackel's European Delivery Museum Guide
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10-06-2014, 09:32 AM	#11
ONDEMAND oooooo 53 Rep 320 Posts Drives: with 3 pedals Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: USMFA iTrader: (0)	Please give an example of what the "surge" is. When do you experience it and what are you doing (throttle, pre-post-or durning shift) at the time? This may be a different issue but with my manual transmission, at slow speeds the car will often hang at a particular rpm or sometimes increase rpms a bit while the clutch is in for the 1-2 shift. in other word you go to shift from 1-2 at say 2,500 rpm and with the clutch in the rpms dont drop they literally stay at 2,500 until you begin to let the clutch out. Its really odd but both 135s ive owned did this. Dealer didnt do shit for it when I had them look at the first car. Ive just grown to accept it happens here and there. __________________ 2011 135i - Gone but not forgotten \| 2017 M2 - Powering out of a corner near you!
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10-06-2014, 09:44 AM	#12
MZWIE Lieutenant Colonel 388 Rep 1,660 Posts Drives: M2 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: GEORGIA iTrader: (0)	Spark plugs purchased at dealer. VANOS solenoids at the front end of engine. Also from dealer. The surges feel like a momentary loss of power. It's not an RPM blip but more like turning off a switch and then on again very quickly. It happens also when using cruise control. Also when leaving a gear selected. It never happens under acceleration. Only seem to happen when cruising, but not at any particlaur speed, RPM or gear. So far i've not been able to isolate it to a particular set of conditions. Next question. Could it be transmission related. I have an AT.
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10-06-2014, 09:53 AM	#13
3002 tii Lieutenant General 2282 Rep 12,565 Posts Drives: Z4 M, X5, GX460 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: CT iTrader: (99) Garage List F15 X5 xDrive35i [8.75] E86 Z4 M [10.00] F10 550i (Retired) [9.17] F25 X3 xDrive35i (R ... [9.43] E82 135is (Retired) [9.50] E85 Z4 M (Retired) [9.41] E90 328i xDrive (Re ... [9.25] E86 Z4 3.0si (Retired) [9.24]	Since no codes means you're not at risk of losing codes, how about just disconnecting battery and reconnect? __________________ Follow for latest mods
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10-06-2014, 10:04 AM	#14
MZWIE Lieutenant Colonel 388 Rep 1,660 Posts Drives: M2 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: GEORGIA iTrader: (0)	^^ Ok...but what will that do...
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10-06-2014, 10:09 AM	#15
RoundelM3 Major General 1835 Rep 6,990 Posts Drives: 15 F80 M3, 22 G01 X3 30i Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Clayton, NC iTrader: (2) Garage List 2022 BMW X3 [9.83] 2015 BMW M3 [6.50]	You may also want to re-set the throttle adaptation - there are a few threads on here about how that's done (very quick and easy). Also, what about the O2 sensors - have they been checked or replaced? Even though your injectors were replaced, you may want to have them checked out as well as the throttle body. It also could be something vacuum-related as previously suggested, or, possibly something related to the DTC (which can cut power momentarily). Might possibly be a sensor somewhere, although that should throw a code. I think if it were my car, I'd find a really good Indy shop and let them check it over completely. __________________ 2015 F80 ///M3 Sedan 7DCT Tanzanite, 2022 X3 sDrive30i 8AT Brooklyn Grey
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