Premium sound on 135i vs 335i

[N55_BBM]

Hey guys, I have an '11 135i with the HK premium sound. A friend of mine has an '07 335i and has the premium sound as well, it's the ilogic 7 or whatever it is (some thing as the HK?)

I noticed that his sound quality is VERY superior to mine.. I thought the sound systems were pretty much the same, but I guess they aren't? Or I don't have mine set up well?

[VP Electricity]

You have no center channel, which handicaps the Logic 7 function.

[SoCali E36]

You mean to tell me that the Harman Kardon does not have a center channel?!

[Technic]

Originally Posted by SoCali E90

You mean to tell me that the Harman Kardon does not have a center channel in the 1-Series?!

Yes.

[SoCali E36]

thats just sad on BMW's end.

[11N55]

Originally Posted by N55_BBM

Hey guys, I have an '11 135i with the HK premium sound. A friend of mine has an '07 335i and has the premium sound as well, it's the ilogic 7 or whatever it is (some thing as the HK?)

I noticed that his sound quality is VERY superior to mine.. I thought the sound systems were pretty much the same, but I guess they aren't? Or I don't have mine set up well?

How did you compare the 2? Did you listen to the same song? Different songs have different frequencies resulting in different sound. Yes the 135i is lacking a center channel but it does not make that much of a difference.

I am comparing my HK system to my fathers in his M3. The only noticeable difference is loudness! You cant hear yourself "YELL" in his but as far as clarity both are equal.

[boostm3]

Originally Posted by SoCali E90

You mean to tell me that the Harman Kardon does not have a center channel?!

for music listening, why do you care if it has a center channel? Even in expensive hometheater setups, the center channel is there to anchor the dialog.. But for hi fi music, center channel is superfluous, and true audiofiles always listen to music in 2 channel stereo. So, why should a center channel matter in a car music system, unless youre watching videos with dialog?

[N55_BBM]

I listened to the same song out of an ipod in my friend's 335 and my 135. His sounded significantly better, more clarity between low, mid and hi frequencies, better bass... i mean i dunno it just sounded better all around.

i wish i could run the same test at the same time at the same place. what i just said above was based on having listened to music in his car one day then the next day listening to it in mine and realizing how much it sucked

[kaigoss69]

Originally Posted by boostm3

for music listening, why do you care if it has a center channel? Even in expensive hometheater setups, the center channel is there to anchor the dialog.. But for hi fi music, center channel is superfluous, and true audiofiles always listen to music in 2 channel stereo. So, why should a center channel matter in a car music system, unless youre watching videos with dialog?

In a car, the main purpose of the center channel is to create a center image for all listening positions, not just the driver's seat. It has nothing to do with dialogue, it is for music.

[boostm3]

Originally Posted by kaigoss69

In a car, the main purpose of the center channel is to create a center image for all listening positions, not just the driver's seat. It has nothing to do with dialogue, it is for music.

why does music listening in a car require one, and music listening in the home does not?

[kaigoss69]

Originally Posted by boostm3

why does music listening in a car require one, and music listening in the home does not?

In the home, the speakers are usually on-axis with the listener(s) and far enough away that the entire couch, for example, could lie within the imaging "sweet spot". So 4 people could sit on a couch and "see" roughly the same location for the center image. In a car, the speakers are mostly off-axis, and the listeners sit very close to the speakers, such that center imaging cannot be achieved for more than one seat. For example, you could use time alignment to create a center image for the driver's position, but the passenger's seat would "see' the image far off to the right, not even close to center.

[boostm3]

Originally Posted by kaigoss69

In the home, the speakers are usually on-axis with the listener(s) and far enough away that the entire couch, for example, could lie within the imaging "sweet spot". So 4 people could sit on a couch and "see" roughly the same location for the center image. In a car, the speakers are mostly off-axis, and the listeners sit very close to the speakers, such that center imaging cannot be achieved for more than one seat. For example, you could use time alignment to create a center image for the driver's position, but the passenger's seat would "see' the image far off to the right, not even close to center.

Great explanation.. thanks much. Now, even though I have the HK upgrade, I will forever be missing that center channel.. Actually, I dont think it sounds too bad, but others who have heard it and the 335i premium upgrade say there's no comparison, or so I read in this thread. Sometimes, ignorance really is bliss... . i guess .

[kaigoss69]

Without the center channel, L7 has to create a "phantom" center image, and since the system is probably optimized for "all" listening positions in the car, it is a compromise no matter where you sit. Don't feel bad though, the imaging in the 3 series L7 system is not very good either, despite the center channel, because there is no tweeter in the center channel, only a mid-range driver.

[Blader]

Originally Posted by maxnix

Don't confuse us with real world considerations!

I think the 335i is an 11 speaker system while ours is but 8. Cabin size does make a difference.

The HK system in the 1 Series is a 10 speaker system

[daixloxbmw]

Originally Posted by maxnix

You're correct! It is 10 for the 1 and 11 for the 3 with the center channel midrange the only additional speaker. Might be more watts or larger low end speakers in the 3 though.

That's not accurate.

I currently have 10 in my 135i but my 335i has 13. There were 3 additional midrange drivers, one in the center of the dash and two in the rear sides.

http://www.bmw.harmankardon.com/en/v...cal-coupe.aspx

[gmartan]

Originally Posted by boostm3

Great explanation.. thanks much. Now, even though I have the HK upgrade, I will forever be missing that center channel.. Actually, I dont think it sounds too bad, but others who have heard it and the 335i premium upgrade say there's no comparison, or so I read in this thread. Sometimes, ignorance really is bliss... . i guess .

I don't think that it compares well to most decent car audio systems. The frequency response is fine as is the balance. What it is missing is any ability to fill the cabin with sound at reasonable volume levels. It just sounds thin until you really crank it. Then it sounds harsh. Well designed and engineered systems don't. I have owned many.