[SCA]

Originally Posted by CALIF65GM

Unf**kin believable. :mad: :mad:

And WTF is BMW thinking giving the names of the respondents out to the CAs??

They always have. BMW NA also provides the names of those that have rated their last service visit to BMW Service Departments. I have been confronted in person a few times. Total . If the service sucked and you screwed something else up on my car, you are damn right you will getting a bad rating.

[johnfkitchen]

Originally Posted by Armen52

snip-In my opinion 5 is outstanding service, 4 is good service, 3 is okay service, 2 is poor service and 1 is horrendous service. -snip

Well, here is the issue. I'd normally agree with this expectation. In a logical world, and based on usual practice, this makes total sense.

However, I spoke with my Sales Advisor, and he tells me that BMWNA regards a "4" as merely satisfactory. A "4" means a "100% OK" performance. Now why they would allocate three scores for less than 100% performance (1, 2 and 3) and only one to above "satisfactory" (5) beats me. But I guess I can't change that. The fact is that this is how it's done. Maybe they expect people to screw up mightily.

So, we may not like it, but BMWNA defines the rules, and we have to play by them, or we penalize the sales person.

The mind boggles at what a score of "1" might mean. Maybe we should have a competition for the most inventive reason for giving a score of "1". Maybe, "salesman left a skunk in my trunk".

[Amil]

Originally Posted by HRC

If you need service, go to the dealer. You don't need to go thru the sales guy for anything. It will just be some tension if you guys see each other. Sorry about the messy situation, it really sucks I'm sure. Hopefully time will ease the tension.

Danny

wowowowow If i got this letter id be very ticked off that BMW gave away my identitiy

my salesperson deserves all 2's from my last car purchase...(we've been buying from him for the past 10 years) but he asked for 5's so i threw away the survey instead...


this is bs and you should yell at the GM and BMWNA

[tim916]

This ridiculous (and meaningless) survey system is a big problem and BMWNA needs to makes changes to it ASAP. It really puts customers in an uncomfortable position seeing as how if they don't give all 5's they might get a rude e-mail from their CA, or get hassled by the service department.

It is absurd that a company would have a system in place that generates ill will between customers and sales/service people.

The original poster should forward that e-mail on to both the GM at the dealership and to BMWNA. I hope the guy does get fired, because he is obviously does not deserve the job. I have worked in sales, and I would never imagine to communicate with a customer in such an unprofessional manner. Unbelievable.

[F32Fleet]

Funny how those survey's are out of wack to begin with. I seriously doubt the sales dept gets many surveys with 3's, 2's, or 1's just because I doubt anyone would actually have bought the car if their experience was that bad.

This is sad behavior indeed.

[deutschmann59]

Huh...this is a very helpful post for people thinking about getting a new BMW or are in the process of it. I wish this post was on here about two months ago. I kind of feel bad now because I gave some 4s to my dealer and seeing how 4 equals like 70%, I guess I really should have given all 5s. Now I feel bad

My dealer mentioned to me something about a survey, but I didn't know it was over the phone. I thought it was a mail survey or something. At least then I would have been able to sit down and really think about the answers, and really read into them.

Yes this survey is a lot of BS, pardon my french. That is really stupid how they give out your name and the choices you made...like BMW is trying to make sure you don't go to the same dealer the next time you buy a BMW (hmmmmm....). I mean, obviously the dealers get mad when they find out how you rated them, and it looks like they'll treat you badly when you come back and they remember you based on how you rated them. That is really stupid.

BMW, if you are reading this message, DON'T GIVE OUT OUR IDENTITIES ON THIS SURVEY. God I can't believe how stupid that is. This is how it should work: the dealer should get the results after every year, or every quarter, without knowing the buyer's identities. If they need to find out how every person's experience was personally, the dealer should give you a short survey to fill out and mail it to BMW. That would make sense. Then at least we would have time to think about our answers, and read what each rating really means.

Man, for as sophisticated as BMW is, you'd think they'd have a better customer service rating system that this!

[deutschmann59]

Originally Posted by SCA

BMW NA also provides the names of those that have rated their last service visit to BMW Service Departments.

Speaking of this, I did another survey when I had my alarm installed. I know I gave some "4" ratings here. They told me it would only take an hour, even though it took three (but only charged me for 1.5) but when they unplugged my battery, they never set the clock, so I had to reset that. Not a big deal, but I didn't give them a perfect 5 for that instance. Would you?

[bookman2]

Originally Posted by silverado

I would email him only and tell him that his email is terribly inappropriate, that you gave him a fair score and that you choose not to forward it to the GM and BMWNA.

I would do just the opposite and see him fired! He deserves no less. :mad:

[scottjones]

Being that I have been in automotive sales and auto sales management, I can tell you that the surveys are important because not only does it rank a sales associate, but the dealership amongst it's peers as well. On a local and national level. So....

You giving a 4 out of 5 was kinda harsh. Especially if they did you good. Trust me, you'll see it in how they treat you, even if they say you wont. Find another dealer to goto because that salesman sounds like a real weiner.

The letter he sent was extreamly rude however and not up to what I would expect from a BMW representative. So, if you want to press it and get some kiss assing done, contact the sales manager, regional sales manager and BMW NA. You'll be glad you did... however, you may end his career at BMW.

[Athos]

Originally Posted by sharp1183

Speaking of this, I did another survey when I had my alarm installed. I know I gave some "4" ratings here. They told me it would only take an hour, even though it took three (but only charged me for 1.5) but when they unplugged my battery, they never set the clock, so I had to reset that. Not a big deal, but I didn't give them a perfect 5 for that instance. Would you?

No.

[tim916]

Originally Posted by sharp1183

Speaking of this, I did another survey when I had my alarm installed. I know I gave some "4" ratings here. They told me it would only take an hour, even though it took three (but only charged me for 1.5) but when they unplugged my battery, they never set the clock, so I had to reset that. Not a big deal, but I didn't give them a perfect 5 for that instance. Would you?

I don't think a 5 would be appropriate seeing as how the job took three times as long as it was supposed to. Some people might say the clock thing is trivial, but IMO details like that count in making the customer "super-satisfied" with the service.

[djfreex]

That sales guy should get 1s and has no business working at a BMW dealership.

Bump that!
Totally unproffessional.

[noflash]

Yes, he should not have sent that email.

BUT, you have to inderstand his perspective. I haven't seen anyone in this thread yet say that they have worked on a similar bonus system.

I have.

It is excruciatingly painful when you are in the mindset to do everything just right to make the customer happy. You are thinking about getting that five with every single interaction with the customer. That five is everything.

Then when you don't get it and it turns out to be some whim of a response without really thinking about the level of survice you received, it sucks ass!

I mean, come on, what difference to you does it make if you give a 5 or not? They asked you and you said, "I dunno, I guess give them a 4".

Were there really any problems? Did he not handle everything as well as expected?

I do agree that he should've refrained from sending that email.

I just wanted to offer another perspective.

[CC 330i]

When I got the survey I gave them all 5's. I felt a little odd doing so, but the Sales Manager asked for all 5's when I did the deal, and I had a good experience there so I went ahead and gave them all 5s.

Now about a month later, I find it very difficult to get a service appointment, and when I call for service or a question, I wait on hold, sometimes for more than an hour. They still claim they can't activate my alarm, when I know at least 5 people on the board that have the alarm activated.

On a side note: I just got my review from my manager who LOVES me, and I do an EXCELLENT job for my company. I am one of the top 2 people in my department in all aspects of the job: productivity (even with the time I spend on this board), customer satisfaction, knowledge, etc. We use a 1-5 review scale for about 10 review items. I got eight 4's, one 3, and one 5. A "4" means "exceptional" and a 5 means "clearly outstanding". My average score was 4.0. I feel that that an average of "EXCEPTIONAL" is very good, and I feel that it is fair. It gives me something to work toward.

I think it is so STUPID that BMW expects all 5's. Who are they trying to kid? They expect every dealership to be perfect on all aspects? What does a 4 mean, what does a 3 mean? It has gotten to the point that the whole system is a farce. I can understand how they want all their dealerships to get to the point where they are all 5s, but they seriously can't expect that their dealers are all at the "5" level right away, can they?

The e90 was a very new car, but I still knew more than my salesperson (who was very good). This is almost always the case when I shop for a car, so I have gotten used to it. But I still gave him a 5 on everything because this seems to be the norm rather than the exception these days. I really expect more from a "premium" brand such as BMW, but hey, I am pretty generous, and I got a great deal from the dealer, so I gave them all 5s. I guess I will privately discuss the dealer shortcomings directly with the dealership GM, and MAYBE I will get some resolution as the months go by.

Oh yeah, and the email you got was perhaps the most unprofessional thing that I have ever heard of in the world of sales. I think you should Carbon Copy that to BMWNA, the GM of the Dealership, and then to the local Better Business Bureau.

[drfluid]

Thanks for all the good advices and thoughtful replies.

I emailed back to my dealer that I was sorry about what had happened right after I got the email, but hasn't replied back.
So I emailed again saying that he should've asked why I rated 4, no matter what I thought the 4's or 5's meant to be to a dealer, instead of being in a belligerent manner and arguing.

I'll keep posted.
Again, thanks for all your interests and concerns.. I'm much relieved after reading all the posts up here.

[silverado]

While I undestand the concern about letting the dealer know the identity of the rater, I can't see it resulting in worse service from the dealer. a) they can't refuse you service and b) they will know you don't just hand out 5's. So I think if anything it would result in better service to you, albeit probably with a lot of hidden resentment.

Also, if you think about it, you give BMW your opinion knowing that they know who you are (since they called you) and the dealer is an agent of BMW. So I don't see it as BMW divulging private information. If you don't want them to tell the dealer who you are, then do not participate when they call you and instead fill a generic rating (or write your own letter) on paper and send it in.

In this particular case, the salesman is clearly unprofessional and he is the one who made a mistake. The problem is not the fact that they gave him the information (which is supposed to help him improve his service) but what he did with the information.

[metallic]

drfluid, can you tell us which dealership is that? And what's his name?

[E90Mono]

I worked on this type bonus for 10 years. Yes, it's tough but that's the point. I am now a business owner and I want to know good or bad what my customers think. How else do you make your business better?
The problem may be with BMWs' rating system. (I would like to know if they have a different survey system in Europe, SA, etc...) Take the survey issue out of the question as you can't control that. What you control are your answers. When I received my call last week for the survey I took probably 20-25 minutes to complete because I took time to think about the questions. If you want your dealer and salespeople to
be of the quality you should get with a $40K+ vehicle, tell the truth and the resulting bonus or not is their problem. If you don't answer truthfully about your feelings, then don't complain when you get treatment that doesn't meet the quality you expect from BMW. If you care about their business you'll be honest and not game the survey.

The salesman who sent the email is not your problem either. Let the GM and BMWNA know what happened. Your job is just to make the payments. Let the dealer handle his problem with the salesman. Make the decision about where you go for yourself, but IMO keep going to the same dealership if it is convenient and they handle service and warranty up to your expectations. Good Luck.

[Dani]

My dealer didn't tell me to give 5s but told me that that is the ONLY sore that is considered good. He simply made it clear that if I was happy with his service and wanted to give him a good revieve 5 was the only thing considered a good score. There was no telling me or even asking me to give 5s; he just explained how BMW judges their scoring system.
If I had given 4s and gotten that email I would be very happy I didn't give 5s because clearly a person like that does not deserve them. You should really post a poll to see how many people would complain to his superiors. My vote would be yes...

[yetdog]

Originally Posted by Dani

My dealer didn't tell me to give 5s but told me that that is the ONLY sore that is considered good. He simply made it clear that if I was happy with his service and wanted to give him a good revieve 5 was the only thing considered a good score. There was no telling me or even asking me to give 5s; he just explained how BMW judges their scoring system.
If I had given 4s and gotten that email I would be very happy I didn't give 5s because clearly a person like that does not deserve them. You should really post a poll to see how many people would complain to his superiors. My vote would be yes...

That seems like a fair thing to do, being the dealer. The original poster's email he received was in very poor taste - but aside from that - BMW's system for rating dealers does seem flawed.

[bmw330ipty]

I feel that he shouldnt report this to BMWNA or the manager of the dealership because most probably this will get the salesperson fired. No matter how rude the email was, it sucks to have a person get fired especially if they have a family and kids. Put yourselves in the shoes of the children, you would be sad if your dad lost his job and the family was struggling to pay the bills. This would just make the sales guy hate you even more.


I think that you should write a firm email back to the sales person and tell him that you think he was rude and has no right to send you such a nasty email. Say that its your right to provide a honest answer and that your intentions were not evil and to affect him. Also, tell him that you were seriously considering to report this to BMWNA and his superiors but that you felt sorry for his family (not him) and that you dont want to get him fired. And that you expect an apology for his nasty attitude.

hopefully that will slap him silly and humble him and respect you.

And maybe you can even send an anonymous mail to the dealer or BMWNA saying your experience and how they should improve etc. but dont give any names (your or salesperson) and that you feel insulted and disgusted by this kind of service.

[tbensous]

I think the email of the salesman was really rude and unappropriate. Just because of it, it makes it clear to me that he didn't deserve 5s.

Now, what I would do, is write back to him, to tell him why I rated 4s and not 5s, and I would tell him that his email was very unapproriate and not what I was expecting from a BMW sales person.

I would tell him, that he has the choice to either apologize for his attitude and I would let it go. Otherwise I would send an email to BMW NA, and his management to complain about his service.

That would give him a chance to realize how he treated a customer. He openly requested you not to come to his dealer, which is simply unbelievable and not professional.