If the new M3 and the 135i Cost the Same

[Ringleheim]

Originally Posted by TitoSkulls

For me, this isn't even a debate. The M3 over the 135i any day. Granted the M3 is larger than its predecessors, it's still an M car engineered to be fast and handle flawlessly at the limit. The 135i, although a remarkable car at its price point, is not what the M3 is.

If fuel economy is a big concern for you, than the M3 and any of its direct competitors are obviously out of the question. In Canada, the base price for the M3 coupe is around $72000. If the 135i cost $72000, I guarantee you'd definitely see more new M3's on the road than 1ers. At that price point, fuel efficiency is probably not your biggest concern.

The M3 is MUCH cheaper in the USA than Canada right now...and that substantiallly alters the analysis and was part of the original genesis of this thread.....and no, fuel consumption is not a big concern here. Just one of many factors to consider.

But I'd rather pay less for gasoline than more, if I can, and still be happy with the car I bought.

[0002s]

Originally Posted by Schumi71

The point is try and sort out which car I want to buy, and home in on the right set of purchasing parameters, at least for me. And to kick around a hopefully interesting debate.

AH....OK

M3 Sedan based on performace/resale/blah blah blah

1 Series based on bang for the buck and cheap mods

[Ringleheim]

Originally Posted by zbladejr

For me the M3 is akin to an AMG; it's a special package reserved for the most extreme performance oriented car in the line. BMW is doing it right by keeping the M's substantially different from non-M's. The legend of the M emblem would clearly make it more appealing to me than the 135 if price was the same.

On the performance side however, I have to ask 'aside from the few who can afford to track it regularly, how many of us are really going to be driving any of these cars at their limit more than just 0-70 getting on the highway? Who's going to limit-corner these cars on their backroads? You think you will, but you won't. Fifth Gear topped out the 135 against the cayanne S in a track comparo and that's just not a viable street driving scenario. (

)

Therefore, even at the same price, I suspect most of us would get just as much driving enjoyment out of the 135 as out of the M3, 99% of the time. But no-one in an M3 standing next to a 135i will say 'gee I could have saved $30K and had just as much fun'. The bottom line is that the M marque is exclusive and the lucky few who can afford it pay a lot extra for that exclusivity.

Do I expect to race a M3 off the line? No. I know the numbers and I'm not buying a 135 to see if the middle aged business executive next to me can shift faster or slower.

But give me the extra $30K on condition of spending it on a BMW and my 135i order changes to an M3 within minutes....if not seconds...lol

Saw the Fifth Gear episode you speak of, and it was fantastic.

Where's the $30K differential coming from? As earlier posted, it's more like $15K...

[white911]

I understand the question is if cost is not a factor; but, my car was parked next to a new M3 Coupe which was stickered at $71K and my car was $40,975 (with Premium, winter, sport and USB). Looks like $30K.

[zbladejr]

You're right Schumi. It's not $30K. If you look at base price the difference is $34.9 versus $56.5. So, more like $22K. plus an extra grand or so for taxes. But $15K is loading the 135 and keeping the M3 base. Either way, they are both wonderful and I can only hope to one day step up to a TT M1 with.....oh dare I guess....480 hp and 420 lbft torgue....:thumbup:

[BMWeber]

If I had answered this two days ago I would have had to think about it being the smaller size of the 1 and what not. But after driving 2 M3s yesterday M3 hands down. In my opinion there is no car that can touch it all around. I've driven new 911 twin turbos and Ferrari F430s and although the F430 is my ultimate car if it came down to owning one car it would be the M3. I think the only thing it would need to be a 10 out of 10 would be a set of carbon ceramic brakes. Not putting the Porsche or Ferrari down(both smoke the M3 in all out performance) I just could not see driving them on a daily basis.

[TitoSkulls]

Originally Posted by Schumi71

The M3 is MUCH cheaper in the USA than Canada right now...and that substantiallly alters the analysis and was part of the original genesis of this thread.....and no, fuel consumption is not a big concern here. Just one of many factors to consider.

But I'd rather pay less for gasoline than more, if I can, and still be happy with the car I bought.

Actually, the analysis is exactly the same. Let's compare apples to apples. A simiarliy optioned M3 coupe will cost you approx. $30,000 more than the 135i. If both cars started at $56000, guarantee the M3 would be most people's first choice ... I know mine would would be.

[plien69]

Being able to afford either is different from both having the same price. I'm gathering you want people's opinion of the relative merits of each car independent of its price.

Since it would be unfair to either bump up the 135's price to match the M3, or vice versa, the only way to ask the question that would remove price/value from the equation would be:
"If someone asked you which one you would prefer as a gift, the 135i or the E92 M3 which one would you pick?"

I would pick the M3.

[adc]

Originally Posted by ichiban

and better front end than the reg e90 3ers. Makes it unique. It costs about 8k to do that front end conversion on an e90 3er.

Just wanted to point out that starting this fall, all E90/91 cars will have that front end. :iono:

[jraymond]

wow, this has really pissed me off. Why didn't I think of the fact that the M sedan is only 16k more than my MSRP??? Oh well, I don't want that flashy of a car at the end of the day....I don't think.

[zbladejr]

Would insurance rates be any higher (significantly?) for the M3? Gas will be. These considerations could add significantly to cost of ownership differential, over say, 5 years....right?

[BMW Dreamer]

If I could get a new M3 for $36k HECK YAH. But I don't like the M3 wheels. I prefer the US 135i stock 18" 264's much more. Plus WAY easier to clean. I would miss the 135i.

BUT this is fiction, SO bring on the 135i YAH. Can't wait.

The M3 is a pig 3800#

[silvrevo]

Its not a huge v8 man,,,,,,,, come on 4.0 liters,,,,,,,

I just seen the m3 and a 135i.........

wasnt too impressed with the M3,, esp. at $70k msrp.

135i was like a tight buff bulldog, But I dont think the seats sink you down low like my 335i's do. Felt like I was an inch higer sitting in the 135i, and yes the buttons were all the way down,,,,,, I messed with it for 5 mins.

I did like the vert on the 1 series,very cool looking top,

Congrats to all that get a 135i here soon........

[Doolab]

Since we're all sharing our "individual tastes" a la BMW, I would still opt for the 135i over the M3.

Reason is simple, my formula for driving pleasure is this: lower mass + high HP = T-t-t-Tons of Fun! (provided you know how to drive well)
On the other hand, higher mass/larger dimensions + high HP = Grand Touring type of fun... or not.

Now there's no question that the M3 is a technological masterpiece that commands the higher premium and that keeps it exclusive to those who can afford it, but the 135i is closer to my ideal of smaller=more nimble... Even if it is less prestigious.

Here's an example of what impressions an Ariel Atom SC (a lightweight car with 300hp) got from the Top Gear guys and you'll get the idea of what I'm talking about.

[plien69]

Well sure, 300hp pushing 1000 lbs is serious fun.

But between the 135i and the E92 M3, we're talking a difference of only 3650-3373=277 pounds, but a difference of 114hp.

Put another way, the power/weight of the
Ariel = 3.3 lbs/hp
135i = 11.2 lbs/hp
M3 = 8.8 lbs/hp

The slightly lower weight of the 135i isn't enough to offset the extra power of the M3's V8.

I know we all wanted the weight of the E82 to be closer to 3000#, but contemporary realities meant that was unlikely to happen. BTW, in order to match the power/weight ratio of the M3, the 135i would have to weigh 2640 lbs.

In general I agree, lighter is better. But in this case, the M3's S65 engine outweighs (literally, pun not intended) the 135i's 277 pound weight savings, for me.

[JSierra]

Always wanted an M3, but thats farther down the road. I figured i would start with the 135i since i have never had a BMW before. We will see where it goes form there.

[Doolab]

You're right.... I forgot to mention that in my hands, the 135i would soon have a much more favorable power to weight ratio, courtesy of the easy power to be had from the turbos.

Cheers.

[Brainofjjj]

Funny, but i've been waiting on this thread for a week. I drove an M3 sedan last week and was amazed how agile and downright brutal it was. The engine was marvelous! However, with gas being so expensive and probably not going to change i can't live with a car that gets 15mpg. I'd also have to order one with almost no options to be able to afford it. I'm going tomorrow to drive a 135 to see if i smile as big as i did in the M3.
If so, i just might place an order for perf center delivery.
I dont need a car until fall anyway so i just might see if the lease rates change by then.....one can hope...

[boostin]

I would still take the 135i. The turbocharged motor is the reason. Its much easier (and to me, more fun) to extract horsepower from a turbo motor rather than a naturally aspirated motor. I want a turbo car for my next car and to drop $10k+ on a turbo for the E92 M3 would just be pointless, on my budget. Not to mention tossing around a car thats turbocharged, weighs 331 lbs. less than the M3, and has equal power would be really fun.

-Chris

[ktdw]

I probably would still take the 135, because its a better "fit" for my situation (parking in the city, better MPG, insurance, wife will drive too, etc.).

But when I watch videos of the M3 in action...I do start to wonder if its worth the extra $$. I mean, some of probably saw this on the E90post, but the sound of this modded M3 is awesome:

[slipkmaggot]

i would probably go with the m3 coupe just because it looks SO AWESOME

[white911]

I picked the 135I because it is my daily driver/commuter car. If I wanted an M3, I would have purchased any of the E46 M3s that I looked at which (to me) are way better looking then either of the cars.