125i or 135i

[E92325i]

Originally Posted by Taymaishu

With the 325, you're talking about a different engine, different weight, different wheelbase and a different chassis, so it's not really fair to compare to the 125. The only thing they have in common is the "25i"

No shortage of performance on the 125i.

Fair enough mate, i was just giving my opinion on the 325i vs 335i which i both driven extensively. I also mentioned that i hadn't driven the 125i or 135i

In regards to engines, they are both pretty similar except for the 20nm and 0.5 litre displacement advantage that the 125i has?

Again, i wasn't denying that the 125i is an awesome car but if i was to go it a second round with either the 1 series or 3 series... it would 100% have to be a 135i/335i.

[sparoz]

You usually have regrets of what you haven't done, but not what you've done.

(Getting ready for YouKnowWho, I hope the sun comes out sooner or later.)

[dh58]

I have decided to wait it out, I might not get the exact color / options I want but at least every time I drive I'll have as much fun as I can have.

[QSH17Z]

I'm a massive fan of my 125i but I haven't driven a 135i though. I get enough of a kick out of "rowing" mine along without worrying about turbos. However, you've mentioned that performance is a big priority for you so I'd say forget the 125i as you will always want a 135i.

I'd also say if you really really want a specific colour / trim / options then why not approach a few dealers and negotiate. I was very surprised with what I managed to get as I only wanted a rough price but walked out with a factory order! If you can find out if the company you work for is a member of BMWs EPP (corporate plan) then IMHO you're halfway there. That will provide an excellent base to start negotiation and you get two years free service thrown in. I, like others was easily able to get 10% off the driveaway RRP on a factory order and it's my first new BMW so no existing relationship with the dealer either. The two hardest things are deciding on exactly what you want optioned and then waiting around three months for it to arrive. But you'll get exactly what you want and that's gotta be worth waiting for

[dh58]

Originally Posted by QSH17Z

I'm a massive fan of my 125i but I haven't driven a 135i though. I get enough of a kick out of "rowing" mine along without worrying about turbos. However, you've mentioned that performance is a big priority for you so I'd say forget the 125i as you will always want a 135i.

I'd also say if you really really want a specific colour / trim / options then why not approach a few dealers and negotiate. I was very surprised with what I managed to get as I only wanted a rough price but walked out with a factory order! If you can find out if the company you work for is a member of BMWs EPP (corporate plan) then IMHO you're halfway there. That will provide an excellent base to start negotiation and you get two years free service thrown in. I, like others was easily able to get 10% off the driveaway RRP on a factory order and it's my first new BMW so no existing relationship with the dealer either. The two hardest things are deciding on exactly what you want optioned and then waiting around three months for it to arrive. But you'll get exactly what you want and that's gotta be worth waiting for

Thanks QSH17Z but I wanted to buy second hand because I can save 10k-15k+. Basic standard will be 75k? With metallic paint option will be 1k? Sunroof 2.5k-ish. So $78k-ish. Its unlikely I will get that down by 8k or more. The cars I am looking at on carsales are around the 60-63k mark. There is a big difference.

[Gazmoses]

Originally Posted by dh58

I am in the city and drive during peak hours

I do alot of highway kms

Have you tried the 123d??

I can't deny taking the 135i for a test drive was one of the sweetest things ever... that first freeway onramp... maaaaaan never done anything like it.

Coming from a history of relatively low powered cars, I found the 123d impressive all the same... and more than adequate for a daily drive and the occasional squirt on the freeway. Clocking up 1000 ks per tank doesn't hurt either.

If you wanna have some real fun on the track and be able to blow away 99% of the cars at the lights, then no doubt anything less than the 135 would be just settling.

At the end of the day, you just have to test drive all your options and work out what is the best fit for you based on the sort of driving you do.

[dh58]

Originally Posted by Gazmoses

Have you tried the 123d??

I can't deny taking the 135i for a test drive was one of the sweetest things ever... that first freeway onramp... maaaaaan never done anything like it.

Coming from a history of relatively low powered cars, I found the 123d impressive all the same... and more than adequate for a daily drive and the occasional squirt on the freeway. Clocking up 1000 ks per tank doesn't hurt either.

If you wanna have some real fun on the track and be able to blow away 99% of the cars at the lights, then no doubt anything less than the 135 would be just settling.

At the end of the day, you just have to test drive all your options and work out what is the best fit for you based on the sort of driving you do.

I didn't even know the 123d existed! I just googled it now thinking it was going to be a hatch. Seems like a little bargain.

However if it was JUST about the looks I would go for an Audi. However I need performance too. I do like to have fun

[Gazmoses]

Pfft hatch... dunno how anyone can spend more than 20k on a hatchback they all look the same to me... thats what suzuki swifts are for.

Yeah both the hatch and coupe got released around nov last year.

And if you plan on going auto, the 123d 0-100 sprint is 7.1 secs vs 7.0 secs in the 125i auto... all while using 5.6l per 100ks.

Torque maxes at 400nm like the 135, albeit over a shorter rev range. 80-120 is done in 5.5 secs.

[Tintin]

Originally Posted by dh58

I am in a real dilemma. And have come to ask your opinions..

I have been looking to buy a second hand 135i but the color and options I want never comes up

Now I have found EXACTLY what I want in a 125i. So the dilemma is do I get the car I want in everything but the performance (pretty big for me) or do I sacrifice other things to get the performance I want?

And is there THAT much of a difference between the two?

hi, i dont see that much of a price difference in the 2nd hand market to justify a 125i. In-fact, there was a demo 125i at my local dealer for $8ok that I saw this weekend...at the same time there was a 135i on carsales for $58k !!! I know its about the options/age and Kms -but still.

another thing, would you consider a 325i coupe??

I want to get the performance of a 135i as an upgrade from my MINI but occasionally get really seduced by the lines of the E92. Also, I'm no racer and even the MINI is fast enough for me..

i find no matter what i get, I start lusting after something else for some other reason within one year.

oh well - the decision process in getting a car is all part of the fun...

[MikeVictor]

Originally Posted by dh58

I am in a real dilemma. And have come to ask your opinions..

I have been looking to buy a second hand 135i but the color and options I want never comes up

Now I have found EXACTLY what I want in a 125i. So the dilemma is do I get the car I want in everything but the performance (pretty big for me) or do I sacrifice other things to get the performance I want?

And is there THAT much of a difference between the two?

Hi dh58,

What colour and options are you after? So people on the forums are turning their cars over already and may have something you're interested in. Mine's not for sale though.

The performance difference engine-wise has been covered by others, and clearly from your own thoughts you know it's the way to go.
Another difference worth mentioning that often gets overlooked are the better brakes on the 135i, the Brembo units are just great IMO.

For the "slight" understeer on the initial turn in, this is easily corrected by some simple and cost-effective suspension mods, which a lot of us have done or intend to do. When you do get your car, most people would also agree with me that the best suspension mod you can do is get rid of the Runcrap tyres! If you're worried about a puncture, BMW sells a "Mobility kit" which is an air compressor and a bottle of glue that will patch your tyre and let you get home or to a garage ok.

Good hunting and let us know what you end up buying.

[Steveointo]

Not to throw a spanner into the works here guys, but I would not be doing myself justice as a proud 123d owner if I did not suggest to DH58 to consider the 123d instead of the 125. I wouldn't go so far as to suggest it over the 135 (unless the idea of having as much torque as the 135 and only visiting the petrol pump twice a month excites you), but I decided to choose the 123d OVER the 125 when I bought it a few months ago. I got it from the very first shipments of diesels to ever hit the shores of Oz and after a bit of tuning, I am very happy with the performance.

Now before you all beat the crap out of me for owning a diesel, I have to let you know that my old car in Canada was an 04' M3 convertible and if you asked me a year ago if I would EVER own a diesel, I would have laughed my ass off. However, when I saw how insanely expensive cars are over here (I sold my M3 for $25k and can't even buy the same USED car here for $100k!), I just couldn't justify spending $100k on a 1 series after buying my M3 back in Canada for $50k.

Bang for the buck, I feel the 123d is comparable (& maybe edges out) the 125 petrol, all things considered.

Just my 2 cents worth!

[m 135]

That looks great,better than any 125 i have seen

[Jeef Beef]

Originally Posted by Steveointo

Not to throw a spanner into the works here guys, but I would not be doing myself justice as a proud 123d owner if I did not suggest to DH58 to consider the 123d instead of the 125. I wouldn't go so far as to suggest it over the 135 (unless the idea of having as much torque as the 135 and only visiting the petrol pump twice a month excites you), but I decided to choose the 123d OVER the 125 when I bought it a few months ago. I got it from the very first shipments of diesels to ever hit the shores of Oz and after a bit of tuning, I am very happy with the performance.

Now before you all beat the crap out of me for owning a diesel, I have to let you know that my old car in Canada was an 04' M3 convertible and if you asked me a year ago if I would EVER own a diesel, I would have laughed my ass off. However, when I saw how insanely expensive cars are over here (I sold my M3 for $25k and can't even buy the same USED car here for $100k!), I just couldn't justify spending $100k on a 1 series after buying my M3 back in Canada for $50k.

Bang for the buck, I feel the 123d is comparable (& maybe edges out) the 125 petrol, all things considered.

Just my 2 cents worth!

Mate, your car looks MEAN! You gotta show up at our next drive day No one's gonna beat you here for driving a 123d, quite a few of us have had one as a loaner - and the response has been universally "it's awesome". dh58, you should definitely take a look at this option and take her for a test drive.

Tay, Blader and sparoz raised some excellent points about why the 125i is a fine car. However, I'm gonna have to play devil's advocate and disagree. The 135i has (but the 125i doesn't)

1. 6 piston Brembos at the front, and 2 pistons at the back. These things are BEAST.
2. Same GETRAG 6spd gearbox as the E9x M3 if you choose the manual, or a much more aggressively tuned ZF Steptronic if you go auto. The differences between the autos in the 25i and 35i are quite significant.
3. 'Electronic differential lock', or the eLSD. It uses the DSC system to try an mimic the operation of a true LSD. To be honest, it doesn't actually work too well and it's definitely no replacement for a proper Quaife, but hey it's better than nothing.
4. Extensive tuning options for the N54. You can easily get 400hp just from a simple piggyback such as JB3 or Procede. Exhaust/intake/intercooler upgrades are also readily available.
5. A chassis that can take advantage of the massive reserves of power with simple suspension upgrades such as an M3 sway bar and control arms.

Now in interests of fairness, there are obviously downsides

1. Reliability issues. First thing that comes to mind is the HIGH PRESSURE FAIL PUMP. Having two turbos also means there's another (expensive) component that can potentially break.
2. Power that can overwhelm the stock M-sport chassis. The car tends to understeer as you fling it into a corner, but then snap oversteer if you apply a bit too much power. The 125i is lighter at the front and more progressive.
3. Speeding tickets

Finally, what colour combination do you actually want? It seems to be that you are quite convinced by the 135i now anyway.

[Steveointo]

Thanks! I really don't want to be seen as dissing any particular model, but I just thought it might be helpful for somebody buying new to hear about my thought process as I went through exactly the same buying decisions just a few months ago.

In retrospect, I'm glad I didn't push to spend $100k on a 135 as that former "pinnacle" of the series will now be bumped from the #1 spot with the new 1M out soon. I'm also feeling a bit stung as here I thought my quad exhausts would give me that "M look", but alas it will only be a shadow of the real thing coming soon...



I see, too, that the placement of the 1M quad exhaust is in between the placement of the M3 and the M6 - interesting. For sure my car will not have a true M look at all.

The good news is that I'm sure there will be a $120k price tag for the 1M, so I guess it still comes down to bang for the buck, eh?

[Steveointo]

I digress! After reading Jeef Beef's post about all the power reserve mods available for the 135, it looks like you can have a real 1M opponent for sure! I guess that IS an obvious advantage of owning a 135, eh? If a new 135 costs about $100k, then how much to do all the mods you mentioned above? 10k? 20k?

[Jeef Beef]

Originally Posted by Steveointo

Thanks! I really don't want to be seen as dissing any particular model, but I just thought it might be helpful for somebody buying new to hear about my thought process as I went through exactly the same buying decisions just a few months ago.

In retrospect, I'm glad I didn't push to spend $100k on a 135 as that former "pinnacle" of the series will now be bumped from the #1 spot with the new 1M out soon. I'm also feeling a bit stung as here I thought my quad exhausts would give me that "M look", but alas it will only be a shadow of the real thing coming soon...



I see, too, that the placement of the 1M quad exhaust is in between the placement of the M3 and the M6 - interesting. For sure my car will not have a true M look at all.

The good news is that I'm sure there will be a $120k price tag for the 1M, so I guess it still comes down to bang for the buck, eh?

Your rear bumper houses the quads quite well and gives it a unique look I reckon. Never gonna mistake it for a 1M, but why would you want that anyway?

Not sure whether the 1M will be that detrimental on the status of the 135i when it comes out. Sure, I won't be driving the 'hero' model anymore, but if you look at the 335i/M3 lineup, the 335i is still freakin awesome.

Originally Posted by Steveointo

I digress! After reading Jeef Beef's post about all the power reserve mods available for the 135, it looks like you can have a real 1M opponent for sure! I guess that IS an obvious advantage of owning a 135, eh? If a new 135 costs about $100k, then how much to do all the mods you mentioned above? 10k? 20k?

A 135i coupe will not cost $100k. I got mine for 78k driveaway, brand new (and it seems most members here have got theirs sub-80k) so it'll be a significant price gap between the 135i and 1M.

The JB3 chip will cost around $800 and you can install it yourself. It can run on Map 5 (380hp - 400hp off the top of my head?) with no supporting mods. I would probably put in a BMS DCI intake for less than $200 to free up air delivery to the turbos. So that's about $1,000 for a massive increase in performance.

Still, with mods I wouldn't call my 135i a real 'competitor' to the 1M. The M coupe has a unique suspension tune, an M differential and other bits.

[Steveointo]

A 135 for less than $80k?! I paid $80k for my 123d! As of a few months ago, a 135 not even fully loaded was exactly $100k at the BMW dealership in Rushcutters Bay. Did they go up in price over the last couple of years?

[Steveointo]

My wife is reminding me that we were looking at convertibles with the M pkgs, etc., which adds on an extra $10k +, but I still thought a base 135 would run $85k at least.

[BigBoss168]

Originally Posted by Steveointo

A 135 for less than $80k?! I paid $80k for my 123d! As of a few months ago, a 135 not even fully loaded was exactly $100k at the BMW dealership in Rushcutters Bay. Did they go up in price over the last couple of years?

I paid $75k for mine, although I have no options other than metallic. One or two members on this forum did even better than that I think.

[dh58]

Am replying quickly before I reply properly later.

In response to Jeef Beef's question and others that have asked, this is what I am looking for:
Grey (space grey or graphite)
Auto
sunroof
satnav (would reaaaaly like it but it is something I would give up if need be)

There was one recently, graphite, auto and sunroof for 59k on carsales but it looked like it had not been taken care. So I skipped it. The difference between 65 to 78+ is quite significant.

[sparoz]

Originally Posted by Steveointo

My wife is reminding me that we were looking at convertibles with the M pkgs, etc., which adds on an extra $10k +, but I still thought a base 135 would run $85k at least.

Depending on options - for someone like me who is willing to trade weight with those little things for convenience and integration - the price is a lot more than the 78k. Besides I bought it when the short supply was low - ie not much discount.

123D is definitely something to consider if compared to the 125i. I would have bought the 123D instead of 125i for my wife's car if it was available then. Loved the 120D hatch she had - we only need to refill it once every 6 weeks or so.

[Blader]

My car which was a great deal came to just over $68K as built to order.

I hate to say it boys and girls but if you prefer the sound of the 123d to the 125i with the roof down you either are tone deaf or you play your music very loudly