2012 135i In the Snow

[bayer]

Originally Posted by Anthony@RWHP

Do they salt the roads bad where you're at ? Ughh, snow is the last thing I'd want to deal with, looks miserable. I've never seen it in person living here in South Florida my entire life

Salt only helps after they plow and if its warm enough (I think above 20 ish). If it gets too cold salt won't work and they switch to sand, or do nothing

The other thing is usually only major roads & highways are plowed first, so a lot of back roads don't get plowed or salted for days after a storm. Its all these times that snow tires rock.

[roo97ss]

Originally Posted by Delrin

I am probably the 1%, but I bought snow tires for our 4wd SUV. With all seasons it was good traction off the line, but I hated how squirely it was under braking or lane changes with the all seasons.

Plus I didn't want to be the subject of a big dumb SUV rant by getting stuck in a ditch

same for me, i always have as well. No matter how complex the system is that drives your car, whether simple 4wd, or awd, stability control or not...it's only 1 thing that connects it to the road and that's 4 small patches of rubber. skimp on that and the electrical and mechanical worksmanship is literally lost in translation.

Snows on a 530xi, snows on an x3...

[BrokenVert]

Not always the case. My 2001 302 Mountaineer will not die when it comes to snow. Its BFGs are singlehandedly the best AS tires in the world as far as im concerned. Enough grip to tow in the summer and enough bite to drive at 30 mph in unplowed 1 1/2 ft snow to get around traffic (yes thats been tested, only 1 lane was plowed on a 3 lane highway, and I said eff it to get around the traffic)

That being said, snow tires on my 1 always happen.

[Detailer]

Even with good winter tires, that car sucks in the snow, it get stuck everywhere and it's dangerous how slow it moves forward with its 1 wheel drive.

That's why I rather ride this when it snows and not have to shovel my way out of parking spots.

4wd > 1wd

[KingOfJericho]

Hmm... you seem to be the only one in this thread who thinks it "sucks" in the snow. Sounds to me like an input issue.

FWIW, I've found that people with auto cars have a tougher time moving forward than those who row their own boat because the auto does not give you enough of a tactile feel when accelerating in the white stuff. I think if you let your foot off the brake in an auto you'll go something like 8mph. Most people will hit the gas from a stop which will spin the wheels very quickly and not allow the car to gain traction, thus giving the illusion that the car just can't get a grip.

[Sinister Crayon]

Originally Posted by KingOfJericho

FWIW, I've found that people with auto cars have a tougher time moving forward than those who row their own boat because the auto does not give you enough of a tactile feel when accelerating in the white stuff.

Heh... maybe I'm the exception that proves the rule, but my DCT is great in this stuff. Yeah, maybe not a traditional auto but still an automatic. I would tend to agree though that driving a manual is slightly easier in the snow because of the control, but a DCT is pretty damned close. It helps if you treat it like a manual (which I do).

[BrokenVert]

I turn off all traction control in the snow.

I find, especially with hills, that even DTC kills the engine power too soon and causes many problems.

Just have a light foot and the car is great in the snow.



Case in point. Last year I was driving somewhere in the snow with a friend behind me. It wasnt snowing, but there was snow on the street. For fun I decided to crab the car down the street.

I made him crap his pants in terror. Yet I was in complete control...fun times

[bayer]

Originally Posted by BrokenVert

I turn off all traction control in the snow.

I find, especially with hills, that even DTC kills the engine power too soon and causes many problems.

Just have a light foot and the car is great in the snow.

I would agree with this, I do the same thing when I am parked in a lot of deep snow, steep driveway or just plowed in. The DSC robs all the wheelspin and momentum needed to keep moving. I turn it back on though when I get out of whatever mess I am in.

[Detailer]

Originally Posted by KingOfJericho

Hmm... you seem to be the only one in this thread who thinks it "sucks" in the snow. Sounds to me like an input issue.

I may be expecting too much from a car in the snow because I've always had AWD before.

And I didn't cheap out on tires either. I got the best tires available, the Nokian Hakka 5.

[RPM90]

Originally Posted by BFD99

I'm still looking forward to testing out my Conti DWS on the light snow that we get here in Oklahoma!

This is my 3rd winter with my DWS.
I was VERY concerned going into this winter as my DWS have some miles on them now, and many of the sipes are no longer visible. So, I was concerned at how well or not well I'd be able to get around this winter.

Up until last week, the Chicago area had no snow, and we've had very mild temperatures. So, driving on my 3rd winter with these all seasons has been no problem. I'm getting all the benefits of high performance all seasons driven on cold and wet roads, and the DWS excel in those conditions much better than snow tires.

Then, the snow last week. Temps plummeted, roads covered in 2-4" of snow or snow-slush mix. For some strange reason the snow plows decided not to use much salt. Last Thursday evening was the worst of it as it had been snowing all day and the temps took a dive.
I had to work til 9:30pm. My 135i had been sitting in the lot since 8am that morning. I get to my car and spent 15 minutes getting the snow and ice off the windows while the engine and cabin warmed up.

I belted myself in, put the lever into 1st and said, "Ok, let's see what happens." to the co-worker I was giving a ride to.
But, for fun I turned the TC to dynamic so that I could do a sweet donut in the fully snow covered lot.
The donut was executed beautifully right in front of security in one of their cars. He didn't care.

I left it in Dynamic traction mode so that I could get wheel spin when/if needed.
I was very happy to discover that the DWS tires still worked well even after about 20K miles on them, much to my relief.
NO, traction was not great, and there was good amount of wheel spin when taking off from a stop. But, overall the traction was good for a RWD, high torque/high hp car running all season tires.

Experience counts when driving in these conditions. Meat heads with AWD and snow tires can easily get themselves in trouble as they don't seem to understand the serious lack of traction in conditions like these, and so they want to drive as if the roads are clear and warm.
Drive for the given conditions and you can get from point A to B safely yet slowly.

I did experience a moment where more tread or winter tires would have helped. The majority of my commute is on the highway.
When I merged onto I65 the road was NOT plowed! The 3 lane on each direction highway did not have a plowed surface and lane markers could not be seen as they were covered in about 3"+ of snow and slush.
I proceeded with caution on the right lane of the highway.
Semi's were plowing full steam with no regard to holding their lane cause you couldn't see the lanes.
Top speed was about 40mph, faster than that and my 135i wanted to ride up and float on the snow and/or firm slush.
The cars were all driving about that speed, but the semi's were passing us causing much excitement.
At one point, a semi was passing me on the left, the snow/slush was getting deeper at the same time, in my lane. My right front hit the deeper snow/slush and started to pull my 135i towards the right and guard rail.
Nasty. I lightly got off the throttle, and lightly lightly held my steering wheel allowing the front tires to find some traction and pull me back straight.
At that point, deeper tread or snow tires with better tread would have come in handy as my car probably wouldn't have gone light on the front end.

Over all though, I'm very happy with the Conti DWS tires. These are the best all season tires I've ever had in terms of handling the most extreme road conditions. Also, these are the best wet road tires I've ever had, and they are great on wet roads in warm and cold.

Since that "snow storm", road conditions have been mild, just damp/wet and cold, no need for snow tires at all.
This winter's conditions are not so good for snow tires. Snow tires would have resulted in excessive tread wear, squishy performance, reduced traction, reduced mpg, and lot's of tread and road noise. There is no denying snow tires superior performance on snow covered roads, but we haven't had much of that at all.
The majority of vehicles around here don't use snow tires.

[BFD99]

Great to hear man, thanks for sharing your story, makes me love my DWS even more!

[RPM90]

Originally Posted by ken1137

Couldn't agree more since we had the same storm here in Chicago. The 135 is great and fun in the snow with the proper wheels. All cars without snow shoes were spinning last night as I hummed past them. Albeit, under the speed limit which gives you an idea of how slow they were and how bad their cars were in the snow.

Ken, you're exaggerating.

Since the majority of vehicles around here run all season tires, by your assertion, pretty much all other vehicles were spinning out.
I didn't see that happen at all.
In reality, I was quite surprised at the lack of spin outs, especially in NW Indiana where lake effect can make things worse.

Given the mild conditions this year, snow tires lessened overall performance.

[ken1137]

Originally Posted by Delrin

Salt only helps after they plow and if its warm enough (I think above 20 ish). If it gets too cold salt won't work and they switch to sand, or do nothing

The other thing is usually only major roads & highways are plowed first, so a lot of back roads don't get plowed or salted for days after a storm. Its all these times that snow tires rock.

Actually, here in Chicago the salt is pretreated with calcium chloride for colder temps. +1 on the Snows. Today was iced over during the sleet storm and I passed a Porsche Cayenne in my snows. He was doing 20 in a 40 mph zone. I assume he had all weather tires and/or a brand NEW Porsche

[ken1137]

Originally Posted by RPM90

Ken, you're exaggerating.

Since the majority of vehicles around here run all season tires, by your assertion, pretty much all other vehicles were spinning out.
I didn't see that happen at all.
In reality, I was quite surprised at the lack of spin outs, especially in NW Indiana where lake effect can make things worse.

Given the mild conditions this year, snow tires lessened overall performance.

Uummm, not cars spinning out, but wheels spinning prior to catching and moving forward.

[NYC6]

DWS's go on my 1 tomorrow due mostly to good reviews here.

[bayer]

Originally Posted by RPM90

Snow tires would have resulted in excessive tread wear, squishy performance, reduced traction, reduced mpg, and lot's of tread and road noise. There is no denying snow tires superior performance on snow covered roads, but we haven't had much of that at all.
The majority of vehicles around here don't use snow tires.

I'll give you the first 2 and with my previous Bridgestone WS-50 the next 4! At least with the WS-70 I don't notice any more road/tire noise, reduced or traction or MPG over my summers. I think tire makers are getting better with technology about not making them such a penalty.

One thing for sure with this mild winter so far, kinda makes me wonder why I bothered!

[Sinister Crayon]

Originally Posted by Delrin

I'll give you the first 2 and with my previous Bridgestone WS-50 the next 4! At least with the WS-70 I don't notice any more road/tire noise, reduced or traction or MPG over my summers. I think tire makers are getting better with technology about not making them such a penalty.

One thing for sure with this mild winter so far, kinda makes me wonder why I bothered!

I will say that compared to my summer RFT's (stock) the WS-70's are actually freakishly quiet. Even at highway speeds the sound of the tires is easily overcome by the sound of the wind past the A-pillar of my windshield. It may also be because I'm running narrower 17" WS-70's that simply don't have as much tread on the road. The steering was also made a lot lighter by these tires which I don't really like all that much, but I figure another 6 weeks and I might be able to get my summers back on.

Another thing I have realized with the WS-70's is that they get awfully greasy when the temps exceed about 45F. Especially with this winter being so wild in temperature swings (we've literally gone from 65 degrees to 14 degrees in 48 hours here) it gets tiring because the warmer weather performance really isn't there. Hell, when it's warm I can have my cruise control set, start to go around a bend (off-ramp type downhill bend) and my cruise control deactivates because it senses the rear end slipping a little because of the greasiness.

[NYC6]

Just got back from the shop after they installed the DWS's.
Didnt get a chance to put them through the paces yet but I can say that they handle rough road/small pot holes a lot better than the run flats. Of course its not Caddy cushy ride comfort due to the suspension and low profile tires but much better than the jarring RFT's. So far so good.

[2012_135i]

I used to do quite well in the snow. Now I'm in Hawaii.

2012_135i