[SpeedFreak!]

Originally Posted by eshamas21

I know this is really early to be asking but should we be excpecting a price increase from the 330i to the 335i? and if so how much do u guys think it will be?

It is way too early... but I would guess that it will be less then a thousand. A 1-2% increase would be the most in my professional opinion.

[SpeedFreak!]

Originally Posted by deadfresh

LOL I cant wait till the 20th. My money is on Tine

Yeah.. me neither.

[hector]

Originally Posted by deadfresh

LOL I cant wait till the 20th. My money is on Tine

mine too, nothing personal freak(speed), , it's just that the turbos will add more performance than a half-liter of displacement. GO TINE!!

[hector]

Originally Posted by SpeedFreak!

It is way too early... but I would guess that it will be less then a thousand. A 1-2% increase would be the most in my professional opinion.

if speed is correct and there are still only 2 models(328 and 335) then the price increase should be marginal because they can't move the whole line upscale, if the 335 is added to the line(325,330,335) then the increase will be on the order of the difference between the 325 and 330. let's hope that speed is right!

[wyrm11]

I've got $20 on Speed! that it won't be a turbo...who wants in on this?

[LIKEWATER]

I think SPEEDFREAK is correct.
335 naturally aspirated (n.a.)

Why would BMW introduce a twin turbo e92, (310 to 330hp) with the e9x M3's coming a year later with n.a. 400 to 440hp.
Who would buy an e9x M3 if you could just turn the boost up on a 335 and eclipse the n.a. power of a e9x M3.
I wouldn't and I have one on order.

There are many posibilities:
BMW has a v8 540 in the UK. How hard would it be to reduce the stroke and/or bore to make it a v8 535......ie v8 335. Just a thought.
The person who started this thread syas that he has a 535d on order.
Change a little of this and a little of that and you have a 335. Yet another thought.
Not to menion that BMW is so stuck on N.A. power in the USA.
Even Mercedes is making the move away from forced inducton towards large displacement N.A.

Only a few auto manufacturers make 105n.a. hp per liter.........Ferrari....BMW....Honda

[shimshimhada]

Originally Posted by SpeedFreak!

Oh yeah... I've studied his site at length. Extremely impressive. If I do go that direction (odds are that I will) then I will use many of his ideas. What a freakin' car!!!

DA MOTORSPORT released a turbo kit for the E46, what do you think?
http://www.da-motorsport.com/projeler/panos330tci/

[Daugbjerg]

Originally Posted by LIKEWATER

The person who started this thread syas that he has a 535d on order.
Change a little of this and a little of that and you have a 335. Yet another thought.

The 535d id the 3 liter diesel, with two turbos, not 3,5 liter

[LIKEWATER]

Originally Posted by Daugbjerg

The 535d id the 3 liter diesel, with two turbos, not 3,5 liter

Yes, Daugbjerg
I am aware of that.
I was toggling between the two possibilities although I believe n.a. to be the truth.

I'm sorry I did not make that toggle more clear.

[colonelburke]

But if the theory about buying a 335 turbo and then modding it to compete or surpass the M3 were true, wouldn't that also work the same way in Europe where they will get the turbo? It seems that if it is a deterent here, it would be one there as well shouldn't it? Am I making sense?

[Bimmerista]

Originally Posted by colonelburke

But if the theory about buying a 335 turbo and then modding it to compete or surpass the M3 were true, wouldn't that also work the same way in Europe where they will get the turbo? It seems that if it is a deterent here, it would be one there as well shouldn't it? Am I making sense?

You are,

Audi, MB etc. all use forced induction as well, and sales of their super high performers are not affected by that fact.

No, the lack of turbo in North America, if true, will have to do with marketing - the perception by BMW that people here do not associate BMW with forced induction, whereas in Europe this is less of a factor. It is for this same reason that North America doesn't get any 4 cylinder engines in the 3 series (or any other series). After the 318i thing BMW made a strategic decision to go 6 or more over here.

For this reason it is plausible that BMW not bring the turbo here (for now at least).

[LIKEWATER]

Originally Posted by colonelburke
"But if the theory about buying a 335 turbo and then modding it to compete or surpass the M3 were true, wouldn't that also work the same way in Europe where they will get the turbo? It seems that if it is a deterent here, it would be one there as well shouldn't it? Am I making sense?"


Yes, that makes since and you are right.
But ask yourself.... Would you buy a e9x M3 if you could get a twin turbo 3.0l that makes 320h.p. stock.

Remember the 1995 Toyota Supra twinTurbo 3.0l 320h.p.
500h.p. came relatively easy.

Audi and Merc. both use forced induction but mostly on their heavy hitters.
The AMG's and the S/RS's.

[colonelburke]

You know, I don't get the whole thing about people not associating BMW with forced induction. The people on this forum, and the other BMW forums (of which we all have cross memberships) are in the minority of people who really care and understand (?) about BMW. This girl in my office is not concerned about forced induction because she got a BMW for the badge and picked hers off the lot. She would have been just as interested if it had a turbo as long as it fit in her budget. I think she represetns a good portion of the customers.

[colonelburke]

Originally Posted by LIKEWATER

Originally Posted by colonelburke
"But if the theory about buying a 335 turbo and then modding it to compete or surpass the M3 were true, wouldn't that also work the same way in Europe where they will get the turbo? It seems that if it is a deterent here, it would be one there as well shouldn't it? Am I making sense?"


Yes, that makes since and you are right.
But ask yourself.... Would you buy a e9x M3 if you could get a twin turbo 3.0l that makes 320h.p. stock.

Remember the 1995 Toyota Supra twinTurbo 3.0l 320h.p.
500h.p. came relatively easy.

Audi and Merc. both use forced induction but mostly on their heavy hitters.
The AMG's and the S/RS's.

Yeah, I see your point. I am waiting for the 335i for the fact that it will be at the top of my budget and the power will be adequate. Does that mean that I will not mod the engine? No. But it is a real good starting point. Then again, the M club has a certain air about it that, if that is what you desire, cannot be acheived no matter how much you mod a 335. I am still hedging a little on the 335 and thinking of going CPO M3, but I am a saloon guy (family). Some of it depends on how the 335 looks as well (wheels, body kit, etc.).

[3aficionado]

Originally Posted by eshamas21

I know this is really early to be asking but should we be excpecting a price increase from the 330i to the 335i? and if so how much do u guys think it will be?

My price guess from an earlier thread: http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...2&postcount=15

There are good arguments for both lower pricing and higher pricing.

[DC52E55]

So, we can be sure that we are getting over 300 hps either way.

that means more waiting time for me. I have been waiting and waiting and waiting and waiting........................................... ...........................

[maq]

Originally Posted by LIKEWATER

Why would BMW introduce a twin turbo e92, (310 to 330hp) with the e9x M3's coming a year later with n.a. 400 to 440hp.
Who would buy an e9x M3 if you could just turn the boost up on a 335 and eclipse the n.a. power of a e9x M3.
I wouldn't and I have one on order.

From a marketing point of view, 100hp is enough a gap and turbocharging vs naturally aspirated is enough a difference that the 335 will absolutely not hurt the M3's sales. It's the whole package that matters. The 335 will be just a regular 3-series with a powerful engine, whereas the M3 is an authentic, widebodied, 100hp/litre M car with full M treatment (brakes, suspension, interior, etc.). Also, the M3 is targeted at a niche market, where 90% of the consumers know exactly what they want and what to expect. As for the 335, I bet 90% of its customers don't know what's really going under the hood and have no real clue about the difference between F/I and N/A.

If you insist on that a 300-something hp turbo 335 will hurt the M3's sales, so will a 300-something hp N/A 335. In fact, the N/A car might do even more damage. By introducing F/I with the top-of-the-line 3er, they are drawing a clear line between the traditional M customers and those who just want hp.

As for turning up the boost on a 335, it's not like everyone is into tuning. I'd be suprised if more than 5% of the 335 customers will actually tune it. Besides, BMW has not produced a turbocharged petrol engine in over 20 years, the aftermarket for the new engine has to be built from ground up. So don't expect a lot of cheap/good/reliable tuning options in the first few years.

All that being said, I for one will not buy a turbocharged BMW. I'm one of those people who wouldn't even S/C a 330. I'm a traditionalist myself, but I just don't see the point in making a 3.5L N/A engine for North America only.

[bmwrules]

What timeframe are we talking about as far as when the 335 coupe and sedan would be available in the USA? If it is soon my wife and I would probably postpone getting her 330 until the 335 comes out.

Of course if it is a 335 coupe we get, she might have to start driving my 545 while I drive the 335.

[stressdoc]

They could not meet the demand for the 2002turbo, and that was a rather unusual beast for its time. It is clear from the statements released by BMW AG that turbos are in the future across the broad range of BMW cars. I guess there will be doubting Thomases when ceramic engine blocks, hydrogen fuel, etc. are introduced.

[SpeedFreak!]

Originally Posted by maq

From a marketing point of view, 100hp is enough a gap and turbocharging vs naturally aspirated is enough a difference that the 335 will absolutely not hurt the M3's sales. It's the whole package that matters. The 335 will be just a regular 3-series with a powerful engine, whereas the M3 is an authentic, widebodied, 100hp/litre M car with full M treatment (brakes, suspension, interior, etc.). Also, the M3 is targeted at a niche market, where 90% of the consumers know exactly what they want and what to expect. As for the 335, I bet 90% of its customers don't know what's really going under the hood and have no real clue about the difference between F/I and N/A.

If you insist on that a 300-something hp turbo 335 will hurt the M3's sales, so will a 300-something hp N/A 335. In fact, the N/A car might do even more damage. By introducing F/I with the top-of-the-line 3er, they are drawing a clear line between the traditional M customers and those who just want hp.

As for turning up the boost on a 335, it's not like everyone is into tuning. I'd be suprised if more than 5% of the 335 customers will actually tune it. Besides, BMW has not produced a turbocharged petrol engine in over 20 years, the aftermarket for the new engine has to be built from ground up. So don't expect a lot of cheap/good/reliable tuning options in the first few years.

All that being said, I for one will not buy a turbocharged BMW. I'm one of those people who wouldn't even S/C a 330. I'm a traditionalist myself, but I just don't see the point in making a 3.5L N/A engine for North America only.

It has a lot more to do with perception then reality.

Think about the typical reaction to Turbo. When people hear Turbo... they immediately think high performance and top of the line. I'm telling you that... from a BRAND point of view... the Turbo does not fit BMW's largest market image... the US.

Think about this... What the M means to the BMW enthusiast is what Turbo means to the typical ignorant American. This is the core problem that BMW NA's brand management team has been facing... and Turbo lost. Simple as that.

Has everyone called their bookie?

[SpeedFreak!]

Originally Posted by stressdoc

They could not meet the demand for the 2002turbo, and that was a rather unusual beast for its time. It is clear from the statements released by BMW AG that turbos are in the future across the broad range of BMW cars. I guess there will be doubting Thomases when ceramic engine blocks, hydrogen fuel, etc. are introduced.

I, for one, don't doubt their presence in our future. My position is based purely on inside sources. I, too, believe we may one day see BMW bring the Turbo to America. But... that day is still quite a ways off.

[BMW F22]

i seriously dont think that the 335 will be a turbo. One thing i know for sure is that Supras had sales probs because it was turbo. That's why when Nissan came out with the Z and the G35, they're all NA. I dont care if people hear turbo and immediately thinks this and that. I am 99% sure that it wont be a turbo. i'll put $10 on this LOL ( im so fuckin broke)...ahh nvm $20 it is