Cancel my order, what are my rights?

tarrant · 12-24-2008, 01:03 AM

Hey ... I have a situation that's a bit on the unpleasant side. I'm a bit confused about what my rights are in Ontario, as the Consumer Protection Act site differs from the OMVA FAQ about car order cancellations. Perhaps someone can help?

I had ordered a 135i automatic that was in stock at another dealer, on a Wednesday night. I started to realize on Thursday that this was a mistake, and I really wanted a manual. I called every number I had on the Friday, left multiple messages, but I guess nobody was around. They finally got back to me on the Saturday, but they apparently had already ordered the car from the other dealership.

The dealer accepted the cancellation, and then tried to sell me a demo, manual transmission car for the same price, without identifying it as such. They also claimed that a demo car is going through the best break-in period.

I had done a bit of research on these things on the web, and thought I could cancel within 7 days and get my deposit back within 15 days of cancellation, as per http://www.gov.on.ca/mgs/en/ConsProt/STEL02_167849.html . So I faxed in a formal cancellation and kept the fax receipt, within that period. My intention was to ultimately buy something through these guys, but I wanted to protect myself before time ran out.

Since then, my employer stepped in and helped me get a decent deal with a much more professional CA at a different dealership (Budds'). So I have my LMB 2009 135i, and I'm very happy with it.

I'm trying to get back my deposit, but the original dealer is claiming they need to withhold transport fees, new wheel locks, and re-PDI, for an approx $1200 cost to me.

My question is, is this for real? OMVIC's FAQ says signed contracts are binding and you're subject to the whims of the dealer; the Ontario govmt site says the dealer is subject to the whims of the consumer, within 7 days; and I thought I read somewhere that contracts signed on the premises (potentially under pressure, as in my case) are not binding anyway.

Anybody know what my options are?

Lester · 12-24-2008, 06:36 AM

You should get the full amount back. Phone up the manager and tell him that your lawyer will be contacting them if a full refund is not issued immediately. Tell the manager that you know what your rights are under Ontario Statute. Look up large law firms in Toronto, and give the manager the names of one of the largest. Tell him something like, One of the Partners from "Duey Scruem and Howe" will be contacting you tomorrow if this is not rectified immediately. Just the fact that you mention a law firm will get them moving. Also tell the manager that you will be contacting BMW Canada about their non compliance with Ontario Consumer Laws. Of course they are pissed, they had to move the car, pay for transport etc.

ec · 12-24-2008, 09:21 AM

I've heard you can ask your credit card company to reverse the charges. They can't charge you without delivering the car. Plus if they originally accepted the cancellation, they can't turn around later and say opps we don't accept the cancellation and need to charge you. Did they put down their acceptance in writing? There are a few other posts on this forum dealing with this sort of issue. Try a search.

tarrant · 12-24-2008, 01:29 PM

They hadn't put down their acceptance in writing, and I had made the mistake of deleting the voicemail where they had acknowledged it.
I'll try a search again. Maybe I wasn't using the right keywords earlier.
The laws are all based in Ontario, so it's a very localized question.

ZIPNBYE · 12-24-2008, 05:40 PM

If you committed to a car which the dealer didn't have, but transferred from another dealer, and then back out, they are within their rights to withhold the shipping costs. Another PDI sounds fishy, given that any dealer's PDI should be valid...but you may have to eat the shipping cost.

tarrant · 12-24-2008, 09:16 PM

Thanks for the help, all who have replied. This is my first car purchase, so I'm feeling a little lost. PDI is one of those grey area items that has a cost that's up to the dealer, but yet the dealer treated as something concrete. Meanwhile, I suspect PDI is purely labor effort, so the "cost" is highly variable and dependent on the salaries of the people involved, opportunity cost, etc.

I think that of the $1200, transportation costs may be just $100. So I can make a stink, possibly based on some legal argument, to save $1k, or I can make no stink and get my money away from these people. I'm hoping somebody knows what laws apply, since OMVIC seems to disagree with the Ontario Consumer Rights Act.

Definitely I'm never going back to this dealership again. I never lied to them, but was lied to multiple times. Just for that reason, I'm lost as a customer forever. I have funds available to cover this silliness, but I'm not willing to spend the stress or time.

12-24-2008, 01:03 AM	#1
tarrant New Member 0 Rep 18 Posts Drives: LMB 135i Coupe w/MPremComf Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Toronto, Canada iTrader: (0)	Cancel my order, what are my rights? Hey ... I have a situation that's a bit on the unpleasant side. I'm a bit confused about what my rights are in Ontario, as the Consumer Protection Act site differs from the OMVA FAQ about car order cancellations. Perhaps someone can help? I had ordered a 135i automatic that was in stock at another dealer, on a Wednesday night. I started to realize on Thursday that this was a mistake, and I really wanted a manual. I called every number I had on the Friday, left multiple messages, but I guess nobody was around. They finally got back to me on the Saturday, but they apparently had already ordered the car from the other dealership. The dealer accepted the cancellation, and then tried to sell me a demo, manual transmission car for the same price, without identifying it as such. They also claimed that a demo car is going through the best break-in period. I had done a bit of research on these things on the web, and thought I could cancel within 7 days and get my deposit back within 15 days of cancellation, as per http://www.gov.on.ca/mgs/en/ConsProt/STEL02_167849.html . So I faxed in a formal cancellation and kept the fax receipt, within that period. My intention was to ultimately buy something through these guys, but I wanted to protect myself before time ran out. Since then, my employer stepped in and helped me get a decent deal with a much more professional CA at a different dealership (Budds'). So I have my LMB 2009 135i, and I'm very happy with it. I'm trying to get back my deposit, but the original dealer is claiming they need to withhold transport fees, new wheel locks, and re-PDI, for an approx $1200 cost to me. My question is, is this for real? OMVIC's FAQ says signed contracts are binding and you're subject to the whims of the dealer; the Ontario govmt site says the dealer is subject to the whims of the consumer, within 7 days; and I thought I read somewhere that contracts signed on the premises (potentially under pressure, as in my case) are not binding anyway. Anybody know what my options are?
	Appreciate 0 Tweet Quote

12-24-2008, 06:36 AM	#2
Lester Brigadier General 295 Rep 3,350 Posts Drives: Join Date: Oct 2007 iTrader: (0)	You should get the full amount back. Phone up the manager and tell him that your lawyer will be contacting them if a full refund is not issued immediately. Tell the manager that you know what your rights are under Ontario Statute. Look up large law firms in Toronto, and give the manager the names of one of the largest. Tell him something like, One of the Partners from "Duey Scruem and Howe" will be contacting you tomorrow if this is not rectified immediately. Just the fact that you mention a law firm will get them moving. Also tell the manager that you will be contacting BMW Canada about their non compliance with Ontario Consumer Laws. Of course they are pissed, they had to move the car, pay for transport etc.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-24-2008, 09:21 AM	#3
ec New Member 0 Rep 23 Posts Drives: Join Date: Sep 2008 iTrader: (0)	I've heard you can ask your credit card company to reverse the charges. They can't charge you without delivering the car. Plus if they originally accepted the cancellation, they can't turn around later and say opps we don't accept the cancellation and need to charge you. Did they put down their acceptance in writing? There are a few other posts on this forum dealing with this sort of issue. Try a search.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-24-2008, 01:29 PM	#4
tarrant New Member 0 Rep 18 Posts Drives: LMB 135i Coupe w/MPremComf Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Toronto, Canada iTrader: (0)	They hadn't put down their acceptance in writing, and I had made the mistake of deleting the voicemail where they had acknowledged it. I'll try a search again. Maybe I wasn't using the right keywords earlier. The laws are all based in Ontario, so it's a very localized question.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-24-2008, 05:40 PM	#5
ZIPNBYE Let's save military ranks for those who earn it! 45 Rep 1,161 Posts Drives: ...on the Ragged Edge Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Edmonton, AB, Canada iTrader: (6) Garage List 2013 BMW e92 M3 Cou ... [7.50] 2013 BMW e84 X1 xDr ... [7.00]	If you committed to a car which the dealer didn't have, but transferred from another dealer, and then back out, they are within their rights to withhold the shipping costs. Another PDI sounds fishy, given that any dealer's PDI should be valid...but you may have to eat the shipping cost. __________________ Richard 2013 BMW M3 Individual -- Fire Orange (sold) 2013 BMW X1 xDrive35i M-Sport -- Valencia Orange (sold) 2011 BMW 1-series M Coupe (#205/220) -- Valencia Orange (sold) 2009 BMW 135i M-Sport Coupe -- Space Grey (sold)
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-24-2008, 09:16 PM	#6
tarrant New Member 0 Rep 18 Posts Drives: LMB 135i Coupe w/MPremComf Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Toronto, Canada iTrader: (0)	Thanks Thanks for the help, all who have replied. This is my first car purchase, so I'm feeling a little lost. PDI is one of those grey area items that has a cost that's up to the dealer, but yet the dealer treated as something concrete. Meanwhile, I suspect PDI is purely labor effort, so the "cost" is highly variable and dependent on the salaries of the people involved, opportunity cost, etc. I think that of the $1200, transportation costs may be just $100. So I can make a stink, possibly based on some legal argument, to save $1k, or I can make no stink and get my money away from these people. I'm hoping somebody knows what laws apply, since OMVIC seems to disagree with the Ontario Consumer Rights Act. Definitely I'm never going back to this dealership again. I never lied to them, but was lied to multiple times. Just for that reason, I'm lost as a customer forever. I have funds available to cover this silliness, but I'm not willing to spend the stress or time.
	Appreciate 0 Quote