[lux.sh]

Damn. BimmerForums.Com got problems.
Maturity of that board must be age of 15 or below.

So many people putting down our E90s.
Don't they know they are basically spitting to themselves?

Do I hear the word called "Envy"?
Whenever new model comes out, previous model owners always
rave about how new model sucks and blah blah blah.
this madness must stop. As much as I respect E36/E46, I wish
they can provide us the same respect that we give them.

I don't care what they say. E90 looks sweet in my eyes.
Although I agree, rear is still ugly compare to E46.

[ward]

people with the old stuff don't always like the new stuff

when the E46 came out I didn't like it right away (even though the e36 and e46 were out of my $$$$$ back then)

BMW designs take some time for some, but almost everyone will come around after some time

[ZenDriver]

It is pretty typical for the new 3 series to be critiqued rather harshly by the owners/fans of the previous generation, and it is a trend that I think has gotten worse under the Reign of Bangle. The new designs across the entire model lineup have each taken some time for the community to digest which generally makes the acceptance of a new model difficult. More so with the 3 series, who's owners are typically FAR more vocal and enthusiastic then the 5 or 7 series crowd.

It must also be stated that each incarnation of the 3 series has been a continued step in the direction of the dulling of BMW's automotive knife. The E36 lost some edge to the E30. The E46 was duller then the E36 and the E90 is damn near the 5 series of a decade ago. When the E202928292 comes out in 8 years (the E code numbers having gotten totally screwed up thanks to the bazillion specialty vehicles BMW is planning), we are all going to decry that it will have severely lost some edge compared to the beloved E90. Old crotchety bastards like me will make posts like this where we shall wax poetically about the E30, and none of the young whippersnappers will know WTF we are talking about.

Such is the cycle.

What color is your car? I saw 6 E90s in the Pearl yesterday...

[RichReg]

Originally Posted by ZenDriver

When the E202928292 comes out in 8 years (the E code numbers having gotten totally screwed up thanks to the bazillion specialty vehicles BMW is planning), we are all going to decry that it will have severely lost some edge compared to the beloved E90. Old crotchety bastards like me will make posts like this where we shall wax poetically about the E30, and none of the young whippersnappers will know WTF we are talking about.
Such is the cycle.

Ain't it the truth?

[timzerofive]

I know a few people with E46's, and all I got were envious praises, and perhaps a hint of bitterness?

[David328M-Sport]

Originally Posted by lux.sh

So many people putting down our E90s.
Whenever new model comes out, previous model owners always
rave about how new model sucks and blah blah blah.
this madness must stop. As much as I respect E36/E46, I wish
they can provide us the same respect that we give them.

Ever since the 3 series came of age in my opinion, which was from E36 onwards, I have placed deposits on the next model sight unseen, months in advance.

I have that much faith in BMW that if I could, I would put $500.00 deposit down TODAY for the 2011/2012 3 series without hesitation. Of course that is silly and not necessary, but you get my point.

Going from E36 to E46 was a big leap in quality. Going from E46 to E90 was a MASSIVE leap in quality.

Never mind about those who critisize the E90, as long as we all enjoy our new cars and know exactly what they are missing out on, do we really care about their opinions?

[Aussie_E90_SBLACK_325]

You are dead right David, I being an owner of the e30 e36 e46 probably found it hard to adopt the new model....however once i bought the new model it was impossible to get over the massive improvement with each generation. When i had the e30 boy did i think that was the $hi% but then i got the e36 AC kit coupe and wow now i was really happy with the improvement, i then traded it for my e46 and man I was blown away again (z3 in between) then i test drove the e90 and again it happened BLOWN AWAY. BMW are awesome in the way they can improve from generation to generation and to exceed my expectations on each upgrade. I think the e90 is the first model which i didnt have to get used to. When i got the invite to the Aussie Launch I said "Im buying it" So now i have exactly 5 days till delivery....yippieeee :rocks:

[JamieA]

My experience has been that most of the cars that take a while to capture the public have aged the best. The really interesting thing is that BMW have blazed the trail, and other brands are now coming out with design elements that put the BMW designs into a context. Perhaps that is one of the reasons some people have said that the E90 is too tame.

An 8 year model lifecycle is a long time these days, and BMW has the task of imagining the context and meaning of a 3 Series to the world in 8 years time, and design a machine that will still be relevant in 2012. You can see that with the E46 still being at the top of its game, when it was replaced BMW seems to do a very good job at this.

Cars of era past were more direct and raw and involving. These days cars are designed within the parameters of a myriad of global safety and environmental regulations that we have asked for through our govenments and regulators. Hence they are heavier and therefore less raw feeling. Faults give rise to character and yet the market expectation of a BMW is that it will have none or have made progression toward this ideal.

Then there is the changing role of the compact car. It used to be the toy, or the cheaper second car. But now they are the main family car in many markets due to fuel costs, escallating costs of vehicle production and road crowding. This is evidenced by the market segment now demanding features previously seen on larger models, and the E90 addresses this better than any of its competitors in my view. The role filled by the previous gen 3 series is probably filled by Mini and perhaps the 1 Series these days.

Is the E90 still true to it's roots? Well IMO it is the best compact sedan going, fills the current market expectation of the class well. It still handles, drives and sounds better than any of its competition, and you don't have to buy Active Sterring or iDrive or any other features that intermediate between driver and the driving experience. Guess what though, people are buying these features - so what does that say about the market then?

Who will this car need to be relevant to in 2012? The Gen Y, Grand Tourismo generation... I think they have done a great job.

[MCS]

Great insight Jamie A. I do think that cars in the past were designed to fit 1, maybe 2 market segments at the most.

Today's "compacts" are larger, e90 interior almost the size of the previous gen 5 series, heavier, and more safety and environmentally regulated than previous generations. I agree that the role of the compact has changed, but they are now targeted at all market segments. BMW has done a great job of giving many variaitons of the 3 series to each:

E90 sedan - people who need 4 doors (in my case, I need to fit a baby seat)
e90 Coupe - younger or older gen without the need to haul kids all the time
M3/convertable - Same as above with the willingness to spend more for enhanced power or convertable
Wagon - more hauling power, especially for outside NA and with gas prices going up, I predict a slight shift from USA's infatuation with SUVs. They'll start gravitating to the family wagons with some speed and handling.

There are very few car companies that can only play in 1 space. Ferrari, Lambo, and a few others come to mind. Even Porsche has given into the market and developed SUVs with a 4 door on the way.

I agree with your view on product cycle. There are some visceral things about my current care (E36 model) that don't quite make it to the e90, but on a whole, the new generation of 3 series are a heck of a lot better.

[David328M-Sport]

Originally Posted by MCS

Even Porsche has given into the market and developed SUVs with a 4 door on the way.

don't forget the Cayenne. ugly thing.

fifth gear pitted a cayenne against an x5. the x5 won!

[BMW786]

Originally Posted by lux.sh

Although I agree, rear is still ugly compare to E46.

I think the E46 taillights look like a cheap Acura, especially with the bright orange, ewww. The E90 taillights are much better - more angled and chiseled.

I asked my friend who has an E46 330i about what he thought of the new E90. he said "it's ok." They know it looks tight, they just don't want to admit it.

Arrrghh, someone at work just got the same car as me, same color and everything - But he doesn't have Xenons!!

[JamieA]

My friends with E46's can't wait to have a drive. I haven't had one bad comment yet... my Audi dealer isn't happy though

[modeno]

ahh, yes, envy. only salvation left is to complain, if they cant join. I love my e46 without a doubt, but its time to continue on the generation. Many of the e90's standard features were only options on the e46 for extra costs, so there's no question the quality is superior. And styling is only piece of the pie anyways.

[mfstout]

It's not envy. It's just a difference of opinion. I bought a 2005 zhp and I do not envy the e90. I tried like hell to like it and just couldn't. I'm glad you love your e90. My friends all hate it and love the zhp. It's just personal taste. If the e46 owners envied the e90, they'd dump their cars and buy one. Don't assume everyone's dying to have your car. They are not.

I agree some of the other sites have a few juveniles on them, but everyone's entitled to their opinion. And I have a little news for you. Has it ever ocurred to you that maybe so VERY MANY PEOPLE around the world do not like the e90 because maybe, just maybe, BMW didn't hit a home run on the styling. Maybe, just maybe, they could have come up with a car that looked as good as the Mustang, or the Bently Coupe, or the new Pontiac Solstice. If so many people don't love the new design, maybe, just maybe, BMW missed the mark. You don't read about huge numbers of people hating the styling on the cars I mentioned above. I believe great design speaks for itself. The Audi TT looked good the moment it came out. I knew of no one who had to "get used to it".

Just my two cents.

sparky

[e90fanatic]

Originally Posted by lux.sh

Damn. BimmerForums.Com got problems.
Maturity of that board must be age of 15 or below.

So many people putting down our E90s.
Don't they know they are basically spitting to themselves?

Do I hear the word called "Envy"?
Whenever new model comes out, previous model owners always
rave about how new model sucks and blah blah blah.
this madness must stop. As much as I respect E36/E46, I wish
they can provide us the same respect that we give them.

I don't care what they say. E90 looks sweet in my eyes.
Although I agree, rear is still ugly compare to E46.

yea...envy is the word. Just ignore them...that's why i stopped going to that forum...

[F32Fleet]

It's hardly envy...Many E90 owners are 1st BMW owners so their experience with the brand is minimial at best. I think what get's previous gen owners in such a tizzy is seeing BMW move towards "technology for technology sake". Minor issues have grown over the years from model to model and previous gen owners know full well the more bells and whistles (ie, I-drive) the more issues owners are going to have. BMW has decided to compete in areas where it is the weakest (Electronics). E46/E36 owners are/were looking for BMW to make a huge statement with the E90 and some feel BMW dropped the ball.

IMO what you'll see is many E46/E36 (E36 owners especially) owners hold out for the 1 series.

Call it what u will, but it's not envy.

[lux.sh]

Originally Posted by mfstout

It's not envy. It's just a difference of opinion. I bought a 2005 zhp and I do not envy the e90. I tried like hell to like it and just couldn't. I'm glad you love your e90. My friends all hate it and love the zhp. It's just personal taste. If the e46 owners envied the e90, they'd dump their cars and buy one. Don't assume everyone's dying to have your car. They are not.

If it was just clearly "difference in opinion", I would understand.
I am not that stuck-minded. but these e36/e46 owners(seems like
you are one of them also. no offense. just generalization here)
are biased. Which is not a good way to judge a car
when someone is biased against something.

Its not really about "it" being "ugly, fugly" anymore. It "seems"
like its more about envy, just endless raving about putting down
the E90, so their E36/E46 can still look good. Because they know
it IS the older model now, because they know their resale went
down, because they know people would prefer to spend $40,000
on a new car from now on instead of E46, because they know
when E46 is parked and E90 is parked right next to it, people's
eyes will be focused on the E90, because they know its brand new
and its taking over.

Its not just neutral pure opinion anymore, it all sounds like just
random "rant" from them, because they are stressed or feel
threatened.

Which I do understand though, I once had older accord, bought it
for full price 6 month before totally new design came out which
I didn't know about. I felt the same way, but in the end, new one
lives and old one passes away.

What people don't realize here is -what they must admit-.
It no longer seems like just "design complains" anymore to me.

Originally Posted by mfstout

I agree some of the other sites have a few juveniles on them, but everyone's entitled to their opinion. And I have a little news for you. Has it ever ocurred to you that maybe so VERY MANY PEOPLE around the world do not like the e90 because maybe, just maybe, BMW didn't hit a home run on the styling. Maybe, just maybe, they could have come up with a car that looked as good as the Mustang, or the Bently Coupe, or the new Pontiac Solstice. If so many people don't love the new design, maybe, just maybe, BMW missed the mark. You don't read about huge numbers of people hating the styling on the cars I mentioned above. I believe great design speaks for itself. The Audi TT looked good the moment it came out. I knew of no one who had to "get used to it".

Just my two cents.

sparky

"A few juveniles"? lol. If that was the case, I wouldn't be making
a thread like this in the beginning. Its like most E36/E46 owners
want to crowl up our asses and try to push us down.
It almost look pitful. Yes it really does.

"My ZHP looks better and E90 is ugly!" Who are you to make
a judgement? I don't see many other brand owners complaining
about E90s. For example, few boards that I always go to,
such as G35 forums or V6Performance.net forums where basically
is full of our competitors. They don't complain like E36/E46 people,
nor there are cry-babies raving about the New E90. Yet, they
give us proper respect for what the car is capable of, and admit
the new fresh styling that might get time to get used to, but
its just matter of time.

Even our competitors are doing the right thing, while same BMW
people are fighting and saying ignorant stuff to each other.
How ugly is this situation? What would other brand car owners
think when they see this? BMW isn't something bunch of 16yrs old
kids drive around the town.

Like you've mentioned, just like the TT theory you brought up.
There are cars that most people love the moment it comes
out, but it seems you fail to realize there are 3 types of design
in this world.

One, right when the car comes out, it looks just beautiful.
Two, design seems "Questionable", and may needs time to get used
to. Opinions are usually 50:50 or 60:40 because of biased people.
In this case, our previous generation BMW owners. but at the end,
it usually works out all gravy.
Three, its just totally ugly the moment it comes out, and until the
model is re-designed.

Its obvious the new E90 falls into second category.
I don't know about your area, but popularity of E90 and how fast
it sells, I don't see too many "against-E90" people around this town.

Its your money to spend that 40~50 grand, and its your choice
to pick which car you want. In your case, your sexy ZHP which
I also love and considered at the moment prior to my E90.
And yes, everyone has their entitled opinions, but just remember,
when especially the previous generation owners have trend
to laugh at newer generation, its not the new generation thats
going to look funny, but the owners of previous generations,
basically laughing at the their own car. Afterall, E90 is refined
E46.

Overall, I will have to accept harsh, dumb and ignorant comments
from E46 owners about the design I guess. I really have no choice.

but seeing how whenever other things about E90 comes up
(non-design related), all of sudden all these raving E46/E46 owners
are quiet. Its really funny. At least they know its better car overall.

Oh, and they deny and say "its not envy", but who the hell knows
what they are thinking inside. I know they go to
edmunds.com and check E90 spec all the times.

[Xens]

Originally Posted by mfstout

It's not envy. It's just a difference of opinion. I bought a 2005 zhp and I do not envy the e90. I tried like hell to like it and just couldn't. I'm glad you love your e90. My friends all hate it and love the zhp. It's just personal taste. If the e46 owners envied the e90, they'd dump their cars and buy one. Don't assume everyone's dying to have your car. They are not.

I agree some of the other sites have a few juveniles on them, but everyone's entitled to their opinion. And I have a little news for you. Has it ever ocurred to you that maybe so VERY MANY PEOPLE around the world do not like the e90 because maybe, just maybe, BMW didn't hit a home run on the styling. Maybe, just maybe, they could have come up with a car that looked as good as the Mustang, or the Bently Coupe, or the new Pontiac Solstice. If so many people don't love the new design, maybe, just maybe, BMW missed the mark. You don't read about huge numbers of people hating the styling on the cars I mentioned above. I believe great design speaks for itself. The Audi TT looked good the moment it came out. I knew of no one who had to "get used to it".

Just my two cents.

sparky

I always thought TT was fugly and girly, they look okay to me now but still just okay. Different tastes in style is all I can say.

I posted pics of my car over on vwvortex car lounge section and a computer hardware enthusiast website under "motors" category, majority of people think it looks better than E46, some think the looks take time getting used to but is a step forward in styling, very few thought it was ugly.

I love E46s, it's the generation that sparked my love for BMWs, unfortunately I wasn't able to afford one for quite a few years. I too thought the E90 was fugly when it made its debut, so much so that when I was ready to buy my BMW a couple of weeks ago I was damn sure that I was gonna get an E46 over an E90. But then I realized that I was hating E90 ON PURPOSE, hating it just for the sake of hating along with a lot of e46fanatics. I felt like an old man (which I'm not) desperately trying to put down the new generation because the new generation is doing better and it's hard to swallow the pride. I realized that's not the kind of person I am, I've always been open to try out new things and experience new things, so I cleared my head. Cleared my head of all the hatred filled by others, I felt lighter, and I was finally able to say "it looks damn good, and it's hell of an improvement over the E46."

That's my story.

On a side note, e46fanatics have gone worse and worse over the years in my opinion. I was always a nobody but I've followed the site for 5 years, right now people just have no respect for each other, picking and bitching about the little things. Some veteran members have went on with their lives and left the e46 scene and there is just no respect in the community. I'm not pissed off, I'm not sad, I just felt like it went from a great community to a waste of my time.

[jkr325i]

Who cares what they think? The only thing that matters is how YOU feel. If you are comfortable and excited about your car then shake off the haters and enjoy your ride. I don't get bothered by e46 owners not liking the e90, besides the majority of the ones on the street (a LOT in ATX) usually give me an approving nod anyway. I personally could care less what they think, I am happy w/ my baby. That being said I wouldn't have been attracted to BMW in the first place w/ out the e46; it's best looking sport sedan out there, right after the e90... :rocks:

[ward]

Originally Posted by Socom

It's hardly envy...Many E90 owners are 1st BMW owners so their experience with the brand is minimial at best. I think what get's previous gen owners in such a tizzy is seeing BMW move towards "technology for technology sake". Minor issues have grown over the years from model to model and previous gen owners know full well the more bells and whistles (ie, I-drive) the more issues owners are going to have. BMW has decided to compete in areas where it is the weakest (Electronics). E46/E36 owners are/were looking for BMW to make a huge statement with the E90 and some feel BMW dropped the ball.

IMO what you'll see is many E46/E36 (E36 owners especially) owners hold out for the 1 series.

Call it what u will, but it's not envy.

this is probably the most inteligent post in this thread, I bought this car since I wanted a bigger comfortable highway bomber that was sort of sporty. If I didn't run a 2 car system I would have waited for the 1 series.

the 3 series isn't "sporty" in the same manner an E36 was, don't get me wrong I absolutely LOVE this E90, but if I wanted sporty the E90 would not be my first choice(it's almost as big as an e39 5 series)

[David328M-Sport]

Originally Posted by etherbored

it just struck me that david has seat heaters in melbourne, australia where the average winter temp is 10-14 (mid to high 50's).
does it really feel comparatively cold enough for them?
-e-

In the middle of winter the mornings and evenings/nights are very cold, not like most parts of the US. Canada, Europe during your winters, but nevertheless cold enough to certainly warrant seat heaters. Add some wind into the equation and YES I couldn't be without them! I had them in my e46 and of course now in my e90 and they have been working full time. They are beautiful!!!

So, have you ever bumped into Frasier?

[David328M-Sport]

Originally Posted by Aussie_E90_SBLACK_325

You are dead right David

Of course!!! Yes, I know.



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