[u2jrmw]

Originally Posted by agent0986

What Americans are we talking about? The Americans I encounter on my daily commute, god forbid, will travel at about 65 mph max. The E90 already has waaaaaay too much power for public roads in this country. Everyday I ask myself, why can't we have an autobahn here and everyday i see new reasons daily. Whenever I see a G35 sedan or a C class or even an Acura TL and so far yes even the new 3 series it's been male or female drivers average age over 40. Or at least thats the case over here in Long Island. Someone enlighten me if other parts of the country are similiar/different. But my question is. so are these people buying these cars for the HP? Because if they are, they are certainly not using any of it. I think BMW does not have anything to worry about it, cause if you have driven one, I really highly doubt youre going to ever go back to another company, even if you get 50 more hp or a 1 sec faster 0-60 time. In the end it's still the best most fun driving machine out there. Now if this was Germany...that would be another story
But so back to what I was saying, will they get engine upgrades? Most likely, because they are being forced into this japanese hp war...the Japanese are smart, they realized they will never be able to match the driving dynamics so they took another angle and it worked...b/c we Americans bought on and we think more is better even if we NEVER god forbid push that needle anywhere close to 80 mph...but honestly people, unless you track your car what are you going to do with the 335i on public roads that you can not do with the E90? Same goes with the IS350, G35, etc. etc. Point is you can do pretty much the same stuff in all 3 car on public roads, but it'll only be fun in one... AMEN

The number of times I have sat behind some slow ass driver in some super HP car amazes me. There I am in my A4 1.8T with hardly any HP and these fools with huge engines are driving around like snails. To be honest I didn't feel a huge difference in the 325xi (about 30 hp difference when I test drove it. I did feel a huge difference in the G35x, but i didn't really enjoy the way it handled compared to BMW or Audi.

[HRC]

Too bad we can't have a together buddy, I'll drink one for ya!!

Danny

Originally Posted by lux.sh

Now thats a great post, and much more conviencing to understand your point of view.
I completely agree. And please, do not get me wrong. I LOVE my car to death. In fact, my hartge lip and hamann eyelids just arrived today, and I am excited more than ever. You'll be surprised, I defend my BMW against other cars in other forums. I just love to play that "go against" game. When Im here, I am not going to stand those plain bmw biased people, people who doesn't deserve to be called as "automotive enthusiasts". I just realized you are not one of them, and thats great to know.

Keep up your love for your E90. I'll do the same. Afterall, BMW is a dream car for everyone, and I feel absoutely gifted and blessed to have one. You don't know how happy I am with my E90. Whenever I go down to my garage in the morning, just looking at that beautiful blue/white badge makes my day.

[akhbhaat]

Originally Posted by lux.sh

Oh not again. don't put yourself in trouble.
I guess you weren't here when 325vs330 debate was hot.
don't make bold statements.

If most people didn't care much for power, why is there a power-up model for EVERY manufacturers? Just put in a 1.3liter 90hp motor in it, call it a day. Why is there a horsepower race going on? And why did bmw respond back?

Being flamed by a bunch of nameless, faceless forum posters hardly constitutes "trouble" in my book. But you're right, I wasn't here.

Besides, it's an objective fact. A 325 with the same equipment (that is, HID, power seats, and Logic 7 on top of the base model) still runs a couple thousand less than a basic 330. The only physical difference is that point is 30 or 40 hp, one inch diameter on each wheel and the size of the car's brake rotors. Whether or not those things are worth the extra money is entirely up to the individual buyer...debating it is silly.

If people DID care so much about power, why is the lower power (read: cheaper) model usually the most popular? Well, in most cases, the base model has enough power for most buyers. There are exceptions: the 530 has traditionally outsold the 525. The 525, while cheaper, simply does not have enough power to satisfy the average driver. The 325, however, does. It's simply about finding a happy medium between too little and more than most people will need or want. The 325 does this nicely. The 330 is a bit overpowered in that respect, but it also costs a lot more...people who will pay the premium for it clearly want an overpowered car. Note that this includes most enthusiasts, which is why you'll see so many 330 owners (E90 or E46) on the BMW boards relative to their 325 counterparts (close to a 1:1 ratio, I'd say), even though the vast majority of 3ers on the road are actually 325s. Enthusiasts almost always want more, more, more power - and Lexus and Infiniti are delivering it. BMW needs to do the same if they want to keep selling their cars to the fickle "mainstream" enthusiasts and not just the BMW die hards.

I do find the idea of a lower priced 323 model entering the US market a curious one to consider. It would be interesting to see how the sales breakdown figures if that model is introduced: will most people keep buying the 325 (or 328 if that's what they call it)? Or will the 323 start to make up the majority of sales? A lot of people would like to get into a BMW for under 30k these days (remember that the under 30k BMWs of the past would cost 33-34k today when you account for inflation and relative income).

[lux.sh]

LOL. 330 is overpowered. Thats a funniest thing i've ever heard.
I love this forum. Learn new stuff everyday.

[Robin_NL]

LOL @ this thread. I ALWAYS buy the most powerful car I can afford in a model range. With the biggest brakes etc as standard.


I'm a driver and I love women, I LIKE cars, I want to punish them(not the women)because they are made for being punished




To each his own, the cheaper models are most popular because they are the cheapest.

AND there is nothing like OVERPOWERED in my dictionary....

(edit: sometimes my 330 feels lame like a Zastava Yugo )

[lux.sh]

Originally Posted by Robin Hood

AND there is nothing like OVERPOWERED in my dictionary....

(edit: sometimes my 330 feels lame like a Zastava Yugo )

well said. thats exactly what I wanted to say.

330 is not even close to being overpowered. even in its class, it has lowest power out of all(compared to TL, G35, IS350).

[acd483]

Originally Posted by u2jrmw

I don't think that's entirely true. I am looking to replace my Audi A4 1.8TQ and I am looking at:

Audi 2.0T Q
BMW 325xi
Jaguar X-Type 3.0
MB C280 4-motion
Infiniti G35x

I think that the majority of people look across the board at cars in the price range. There are people looking for the ultimate driving machine, but I have to say here in Chicago most 3 series drivers seem to be 30+ women.

I'm sorry but "drivers" don't buy Jags or Mercs. I would never consider a japanese car or any make that sells 95% automatics. That's just not the kind of brand with which I could have any relationship.

I think most people cross-shop based on price, but we're in a BMW forum, not the Toyota forum.

Agreed, the 3 is the unofficial car of Chicago, and look at the badge on the back of the ones women drive. 99% finish with "XI."

[u2jrmw]

Originally Posted by acd483

I'm sorry but "drivers" don't buy Jags or Mercs. I would never consider a japanese car or any make that sells 95% automatics. That's just not the kind of brand with which I could have any relationship.

I think most people cross-shop based on price, but we're in a BMW forum, not the Toyota forum.

Agreed, the 3 is the unofficial car of Chicago, and look at the badge on the back of the ones women drive. 99% finish with "XI."

I think if you did your research you will find that 95% of BMW's sold in the USA are automatics...

Well I think I possibly represent the more average buyer that is going to buy a car based on the following factors:

Safety
Looks
Handling/Power
Value
Reliability

I was pretty much ready to buy a 2006 325xi after driving it, but when I researched further I found that there were issues like:

After sales service seems generally to be considered poor
Run flat tires have a dubiously short life
The car doesn't even come with an alarm

I know all cars will have issues, but I am looking for the best overall experience. I buy a new $30,000-$40,000 every 3 years or so and I want to feel like my money was well spent.

[acd483]

Originally Posted by u2jrmw

I think if you did your research you will find that 95% of BMW's sold in the USA are automatics...

I call your bluff...show me the proof.

[kickpoint]

Originally Posted by acd483

I call your bluff...show me the proof.

I believe the numbers. I recently ordered a 325i/Manual/Sport. I would have loved to drive away with the car, even if there were options that I did not necessarily want, however no dealer in he area could locate a 325i/Manual/Sport anywhere, including incoming vehicles. I was shocked. Manual dealerships would have 1 or two manuals on the lot, but non with the sport package.

This being my first BMW, I would have thought manual transmission would be more popular then with other brands, but I was dead wrong.

It's in serious dying demand. I have a new appreciation and understanding for those brands that do not offer it at all, given the cost savings for manufacturing and development. I love the fact the BMW, and most European brands, still do this.

Make no mistake though, the far majority of American drivers (even BMW drivers) are looking to have there cars shift for them.

[StevoSEA]

Even if all of this happens (big if!!!) why would you call an E90 330i "obsolete". It is still a great BMW, will still have excellent resale value and still have the same warranty and will most definately cost less (far less than the turbo, if we ever see it.) I'd buy the 330i and relax!

[StevoSEA]

Originally Posted by bmwrules

This kind of info is making my life harder. My wife and I have been planning on placing an order in late February to get her a 330 with delivery around April. I will be highly annoyed if I get a car in April and 3 months later it is obsolete. My wife doesn't mind and wants to go ahead and get it now and not worry about a better one coming out soon after. Me, I just can't get past this prospect.

Even if all of this happens (big if!!!) why would you call an E90 330i "obsolete". It is still a great BMW, will still have excellent resale value and still have the same warranty and will most definately cost less (far less than the turbo, if we ever see it.) I'd buy the 330i and relax!

[gdnyc]

None of the dealers I went to here in the NYC/Long Island area had any manuals on the lots. They told me that they don't sell as well as the automatics. When they place orders for inventory, they always order automatics.

[acd483]

Originally Posted by gdnyc

None of the dealers I went to here in the NYC/Long Island area had any manuals on the lots. They told me that they don't sell as well as the automatics. When they place orders for inventory, they always order automatics.

It's depressing that so many people buy Bimmers with automatics. Completely defeats the purpose in my opinion. I think it depends on the region, people in the city generally go for autos, while people in more rural areas buy stick.

[StevoSEA]

Originally Posted by acd483

It's depressing that so many people buy Bimmers with automatics. Completely defeats the purpose in my opinion. I think it depends on the region, people in the city generally go for autos, while people in more rural areas buy stick.

I agree, my 325i sp/pp/sat prep/MT. was only 3 in all of SoCal (among 9 dealerships checked.) I feel very fortunate in not having to order one. I was also able to test drive the one I ended up buying. I enjoy the manual much more than the "steptronic". It is a joy to drive even in urban traffic, no complaints.

[Accounting4Speed]

When I ordered my car I asked my CA what the breakdown on automatics v. manuals was. According to him in the 3-series, about 70% sold are automatics. Then, you have to consider the rest of BMW's models, the 5, 6, 7, X5 all are mostly sold in automatics. So when you think about the numbers, you're looking at upwards of 85%-90% of all BMW's sold today are automatics. Staggering.

[hector]

even vettes which are true sports cars are sold predominantly with autos(about 2:1 i believe), we americans are basically pussies.

[voltron1011]

I knew when I ordered my manual 325i that I would be seriously hindering my ability to resell it later on. I've sold many cars in the past (all manuals) and the first thing people would ask me when they called about it, "Is it an automatic?"