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      12-19-2011, 06:28 PM   #67
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Track times for Willow Springs Big Willow comparing some 135i's and a 1M that did it at the end of November.

1M
1:40.125

135i N55 With Stock Run Flats, JB4, DP, KW V2 Coils, M3 Front Sway Bar + Control Arms.
1:41:791

135i N55 With Hankook V12's, JB4, DP, No Suspension Work.
1:39:696


I'm the 135i that did the 1:41, it was my first time at that track. I was on stock rims + run flats because I didn't want to wear out my aftermarket tires and rims. The other 135i has been to that track 1 time previously and has 0 suspension work done. I asked about the 1M from a friend that knows him and I was told that he has tracked his previous car which was an older M3 so he has been to the track.

Sure the drivers were different but it seems that all 3 were around Intermediate but basically a 135i with less than 2k in upgrades beat a 1M's time. The 1M had way more track time on that day as well since he went with a more expensive company that allows you way more track time than the group the 135i's went with.
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      12-19-2011, 06:40 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cooler2442 View Post
Track times for Willow Springs Big Willow comparing some 135i's and a 1M that did it at the end of November.

1M
1:40.125

135i N55 With Stock Run Flats, JB4, DP, KW V2 Coils, M3 Front Sway Bar + Control Arms.
1:41:771

135i N55 With Hankook V12's, JB4, DP, No Suspension Work.
1:39:696
That makes me feel pretty good about my time if I'm beating 1Ms at Big Willow with just a tune, downpipe and some crappy Hankook street tires Just for the record, my time of 1:39 was on JB4 map 2 (93 octane). For comparison purposes, I ran a 1:44.480 on my last visit to Big Willow in June with a JB3 on map 1 with RFTs.

edit: http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=534577 - The Bimmerpost review shows a 1:38.8 in a 1M at Big Willow.
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Last edited by allanak; 12-19-2011 at 06:46 PM..
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      12-19-2011, 07:22 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cooler2442 View Post
Track times for Willow Springs Big Willow comparing some 135i's and a 1M that did it at the end of November.

1M
1:40.125

135i N55 With Stock Run Flats, JB4, DP, KW V2 Coils, M3 Front Sway Bar + Control Arms.
1:41:791

135i N55 With Hankook V12's, JB4, DP, No Suspension Work.
1:39:696


I'm the 135i that did the 1:41, it was my first time at that track. I was on stock rims + run flats because I didn't want to wear out my aftermarket tires and rims. The other 135i has been to that track 1 time previously and has 0 suspension work done. I asked about the 1M from a friend that knows him and I was told that he has tracked his previous car which was an older M3 so he has been to the track.

Sure the drivers were different but it seems that all 3 were around Intermediate but basically a 135i with less than 2k in upgrades beat a 1M's time. The 1M had way more track time on that day as well since he went with a more expensive company that allows you way more track time than the group the 135i's went with.
Any in car videos? Willow Springs is a fun course, nice job.
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      12-19-2011, 07:50 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cooler2442 View Post
Track times for Willow Springs Big Willow comparing some 135i's and a 1M that did it at the end of November.

1M
1:40.125

135i N55 With Stock Run Flats, JB4, DP, KW V2 Coils, M3 Front Sway Bar + Control Arms.
1:41:791

135i N55 With Hankook V12's, JB4, DP, No Suspension Work.
1:39:696


I'm the 135i that did the 1:41, it was my first time at that track. I was on stock rims + run flats because I didn't want to wear out my aftermarket tires and rims. The other 135i has been to that track 1 time previously and has 0 suspension work done. I asked about the 1M from a friend that knows him and I was told that he has tracked his previous car which was an older M3 so he has been to the track.

Sure the drivers were different but it seems that all 3 were around Intermediate but basically a 135i with less than 2k in upgrades beat a 1M's time. The 1M had way more track time on that day as well since he went with a more expensive company that allows you way more track time than the group the 135i's went with.
From a friend that knows him yada yada yada...so not only is your information second hand, but it could have also been altered by the person who told you.

I wonder what the 1M driver's story is, first hand. For all we know, he may have been to the track before, but this could have been his first time in the 1M and he was getting familiarized with the car.
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      12-19-2011, 07:59 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1SerieStud View Post
From a friend that knows him yada yada yada...so not only is your information second hand, but it could have also been altered by the person who told you.

I wonder what the 1M driver's story is, first hand. For all we know, he may have been to the track before, but this could have been his first time in the 1M and he was getting familiarized with the car.
Lol altered? All I asked was if he has been to the track before and it was a yes. What else can be altered? That means he has raced his M3 before and he knows how tracking a car works.

I'm sorry that this hurts your ego but a 135i with less than 2K in mods just beat a 1M. Even if you don't want to believe it look at the posts above yours linking a 1M review at this particular track where they were able to score a 1:38.8. Compare that to a 135i with 0 suspension work and crappy street tires doing a 1:39.6. I'm willing to put $ on the line that if he gets better tires such as Hankook RS3's and some kind of coilover setup he will beat that 1:38:8 time proving that you don't need 20k+ worth of mods to be competitive with a 1M on the track.
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      12-19-2011, 08:06 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cooler2442 View Post
Lol altered? All I asked was if he has been to the track before and it was a yes. What else can be altered? That means he has raced his M3 before and he knows how tracking a car works.

I'm sorry that this hurts your ego but a 135i with less than 2K in mods just beat a 1M. Even if you don't want to believe it look at the posts above yours linking a 1M review at this particular track where they were able to score a 1:38.8. Compare that to a 135i with 0 suspension work and crappy street tires doing a 1:39.6. I'm willing to put $ on the line that if he gets better tires such as Hankook RS3's and some kind of coilover setup he will beat that 1:38:8 time proving that you don't need 20k+ worth of mods to be competitive with a 1M on the track.
I don't think you understand the fact that there is nothing you could type that would possibly get anywhere near to hurting my ego

What I'm saying is that you are trying way to hard to make a 135i comparable to a 1M, and it is obvious by the way you type. I've owned both, and I can tell you that the cars are not as close as you think they are in performance.

There is another parallel thread of someone with a 135i that averaged 1:49's on the same track. Sure, you can change this, that, blah blah blah and get close to a 1M, or possibly beat it, but tires are a relatively cheap upgrade on any car. Throw some RE11's on the 1M and you've just found yourself in the same hole trying to figure out how to catch up again.

Unless you follow HPA's path and spend a pretty penny (at which point you may as well get a 1M), $2000 are not going to make a 135i 1M-worthy.
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      12-19-2011, 08:15 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1SerieStud View Post
I don't think you understand the fact that there is nothing you could type that would possibly get anywhere near to hurting my ego

What I'm saying is that you are trying way to hard to make a 135i comparable to a 1M, and it is obvious by the way you type. I've owned both, and I can tell you that the cars are not as close as you think they are in performance.

There is another parallel thread of someone with a 135i that averaged 1:49's on the same track. Sure, you can change this, that, blah blah blah and get close to a 1M, or possibly beat it, but tires are a relatively cheap upgrade on any car. Throw some RE11's on the 1M and you've just found yourself in the same hole trying to figure out how to catch up again.

Unless you follow HPA's path and spend a pretty penny (at which point you may as well get a 1M), $2000 are not going to make a 135i 1M-worthy.
Trying to hard? We had 3 135i's come out. One was a beginner that has never tracked his car in his entire life. The other was me who has done 2 track events prior at different tracks but has never been to this track at all. And the third one has been to this track once before. Did I go in there doing research about 1M times and hoping that we would beat them? No. I saw the final times today in the morning and while I was looking at registering for another track event I saw them post times from their last one which included a 1M and his best time. After seeing that I realized that a 135i beat his time.

This obviously hurts your ego because in this article they favored the 135i and you came in here defending it saying how it could never come close to a 1M unless you spend 20k+. So your trying your best to defend how a 135i can't touch a 1M unless they spend ungodly amounts of money. And how you've owned both so it obviously makes you can expert in both because you have pushed both to the limits on a track and modded your 135i extensively right? Obviously not.

The 1:47 time was the 135i that has never tracked his car in his entire life. Why do you think I asked if the 1M owner has tracked his car previously? If he hadn't then I wouldn't have even made this post because being new to the track and having some track time is a huge difference.

Do you not understand the concept of this thread? The article is comparing a stock 1M vs a modded 135i. Which is what is being compared, if you want to say "oh I can go throw a tune and start modding my 1M with tires and coilovers and be better" then that is obvious. I'm just providing an example of a modded 135i with less than 2k in mods beating a stock 1M's time and getting close to a professional reviewers time on this track.
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      12-19-2011, 08:26 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cooler2442 View Post
Trying to hard? We had 3 135i's come out. One was a beginner that has never tracked his car in his entire life. The other was me who has done 2 track events prior at different tracks but has never been to this track at all. And the third one has been to this track once before. Did I go in there doing research about 1M times and hoping that we would beat them? No. I saw the final times today in the morning and while I was looking at registering for a another track event I saw them post times from their last one which included a 1M and his best time. After seeing that I realized that a 135i beat his time.

This obviously hurts your ego because in this article they favored the 135i and you came in here defending it saying how it could never come close to a 1M unless you spend 20k+. So your trying your best to defend how a 135i can't touch a 1M unless they spend ungodly amounts of money. And how you've owned both so it obviously makes you can expert in both because you have pushed both to the limits on a track and modded your 135i extensively right? Obviously not.

The 1:47 time was the 135i that has never tracked his car in his entire life. Why do you think I asked if the 1M owner has tracked his car previously? If he hadn't then I wouldn't have even made this post because being new to the track and having some track time is a huge difference.

Do you not understand the concept of this thread? The article is comparing a stock 1M vs a modded 135i. Which is what is being compared, if you want to say "oh I can go throw a tune and start modding my 1M with tires and coilovers and be better" then that is obvious. I'm just providing an example of a modded 135i with less than 2k in mods beating a stock 1M's time and getting close to a professional reviewers time on this track.
slow down dude you're going to have a heart attack. I seriously don't care what you or anyone thinks about either car, but I prefer hard facts versus "hey, we all got close times and one of us beat his best time, but I heard from a friend from a friend from a friend that little Johnny has been to the track in a completely different car before." That's just as irrelevant as not saying anything at all.

As I said, I would love to hear the 1M driver's story and if that's the best he could do, then that's the best he could do...but if he's as experienced as you say he is, then it's doubtful.
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      12-19-2011, 08:32 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1SerieStud View Post
slow down dude you're going to have a heart attack. I seriously don't care what you or anyone thinks about either car, but I prefer hard facts versus "hey, we all got close times and one of us beat his best time, but I heard from a friend from a friend from a friend that little Johnny has been to the track in a completely different car before." That's just as irrelevant as not saying anything at all.

As I said, I would love to hear the 1M driver's story and if that's the best he could do, then that's the best he could do...but if he's as experienced as you say he is, then it's doubtful.
Nice rebuttal, ran out of ways to state how a 1M can be modded to be better since the 135i is modded as well?

Why would you ask the 1M owner if its the best he can do? It's obvious that you can get a better time in the 1M like the Bimmerpost review with a 1:38:8 but that was done by professional reviewers.

Hard facts were provided. The times were done by Intermediate drivers and the 135i did a 1:39 while the 1M did a 1:40. If he was truly inexperienced then he would have done 1:45+ and not have been close to a professional review time of 1:38.
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      12-19-2011, 08:48 PM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cooler2442 View Post
Nice rebuttal, ran out of ways to state how a 1M can be modded to be better since the 135i is modded as well?

Why would you ask the 1M owner if its the best he can do? It's obvious that you can get a better time in the 1M like the Bimmerpost review with a 1:38:8 but that was done by professional reviewers.

Hard facts were provided. The times were done by Intermediate drivers and the 135i did a 1:39 while the 1M did a 1:40. If he was truly inexperienced then he would have done 1:45+ and not have been close to a professional review time of 1:38.
Are you really this incompetent or do you not understand that I don't need ways to prove anything to you or anyone else? I own, in my opinion, the better car. I had a choice to keep my 135i, or get a 1M, and I made the right decision for me. Tell you what, you can slap a jet turbine on a 135i and make it go around the track in 30 seconds and I would still prefer my car.

You have to be either extremely mentally challenged, or high as a kite to actually believe that I need to make stuff up for some reason. I know you really want me to care in order to give all this drama that you have formed some level of validity, but I really don't lol

I've wasted too much of my time typing to you. Moving along...
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      12-19-2011, 08:59 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by 1SerieStud View Post
Are you really this incompetent or do you not understand that I don't need ways to prove anything to you or anyone else? I own, in my opinion, the better car. I had a choice to keep my 135i, or get a 1M, and I made the right decision for me. Tell you what, you can slap a jet turbine on a 135i and make it go around the track in 30 seconds and I would still prefer my car.

You have to be either extremely mentally challenged, or high as a kite to actually believe that I need to make stuff up for some reason. I know you really want me to care in order to give all this drama that you have formed some level of validity, but I really don't lol

I've wasted too much of my time typing to you. Moving along...
You seem like the incompetent one here. This thread is about 1 subject. Stock 1M vs modded 135i. Each time you attempt to defend your car you bring up ways a 1M can be better if modded. That is not the subject of this thread. So obviously your reading comprehension is at a 2nd grade level if not lower. Then when you can't defend your car any more because you ran out of arguments, your 5 year old mentally challenged brain kicks in and attempts to attack the person directly.

I would not have posted anything else relating to your posts at all if you didn't attempt to attack and berate my post. I was just providing facts and showing that you don't need 20K+ to have similar track times. Did I ever state that the 1M sucks and isn't worth the price? No.

Then you bring up that you owned both cars and the 1M is obviously superior. What did you do to your 135i? Did you touch alot of the suspension? Did you take it to the track? Did you push it to its limit? I highly doubt you did any of the above. Keep referring that you owned both cars and the 1M is superior. Is it superior when you have a stock 135 vs 1M? Yes it is clearly superior.
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      12-20-2011, 01:07 PM   #78
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If you have a stock 1M (stock including pads, tires etc.) on a given track versus a 135i with $5,000 or so of carefully chosen mods with the same driver in both cars, I think they'd be in the same ball park in terms of lap times. Wider extreme performance summer tires with light wheels, high temp brake fluid with aggressive brake pads, an ECU reflash with a larger intercooler and downpipes putting the power down through some basic suspension improvements and adjustable camber plates should be enough to at least match a lap time.

That being said, there is no way it would ever feel as connected and confident as a stock 1M even if the car was just as quick around a course. That's why you guys probably upgraded to a 1M is because you don't to worry about anything associated with making a 135i faster while improving feel up to stock 1M levels because it's already there and if you still do want to make it faster it's easier to do so. It has properly sized brake rotors that won't cook the piston seals from the large caliper putting too much heat into them, it comes with fenders that are big enough to fit monster truck tires underneath so you don't have to worry about putting on any tire larger than a 235 and the 1M already has great engine cooling along with more aggressive and well connected suspension pieces that all (best part about it) come from the factory. So there's factory reliability, factory quality and superior resale value.

Now, that being said, the 1M feel and speed CAN be had for LESS and BOTH the 1M and 135i have the same potential. They have the same chassis and same power plant making them damn close in terms of maximum potential. Sure the 1M has a quicker steering rack and whatever else, but a quicker rack isn't really going to make the car any faster in a measurable way or change it's potential to be more than a 135i's. Yeah, the 135i sun roof adds weight to the worst area maybe limiting it's maximum potential a little bit, but who really cares about a 2/10ths of a second? If you want to factor in stuff like that then go ahead, but I wouldn't consider it as a game changer. I would put money on the the HPA 135i being faster around most tracks than a stock 1M which is the foundation of this thread and if anyone doesn't feel that way then so be it. The costs and ultimate conclusion are plainly stated in the article and as I previously mentioned there are pieces they didn't need to add that drove the cost up and didn't add any value in terms of feel or speed. Having used those costs towards things like widening the body to fit larger wheels and tires would have widened the gap even further.

I would certainly buy a 1M if I had the money and agree that it is a "superior" car if you factor in everything, but I do not believe it's arguable that a 1M can be anything significantly more than a modified 135i can be in speed, driver feel or value and that's what this thread is all about. That's all from me folks. Lol
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      01-11-2012, 10:51 PM   #79
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Should have called it the 135iM
It be cool if they took the old e30 chassis and make it appeal sleek and modern with curvature flared wells, with a F30 3 series front end... then throw the M badge on
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      06-08-2013, 07:52 AM   #80
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Well if i could afford a 1m i would so the 135i the best option .
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      06-14-2013, 08:30 PM   #81
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Well if i could afford a 1m i would so the 135i the best option .
Yes, the 135i would be the best option!
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      08-27-2015, 12:17 PM   #82
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bumping this for those didn't get a chance to read this great article!
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      08-27-2015, 12:54 PM   #83
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great article!
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      12-28-2019, 11:30 AM   #84
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Now that the 135i is so relatively cheap, this article is particularly interesting.
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      01-03-2020, 12:55 PM   #85
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Now that the 135i is so relatively cheap, this article is particularly interesting.
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