RR Downpipe installation issues

My135 · 03-19-2009, 11:00 AM

Please understand, solving this kind of problem remotely is difficult. There are just too much things going on and can go wrong, things like mis-communication, part was not perfect, car to be installed on not exactly the same as others and might has some small variations which trigger the difficulty of install ... etc. I think it is too early to slam RR. Please give them time to resolve the issue themselves and report it back.

M3Newbie88 · 03-19-2009, 11:29 AM

I guess 1 thing people and RR have understand here is that Keith nor I are bashing the products here.. we both have many products from them.. myself I have their intake, scoops, plenum, catch can and downpipes.. and was thinking about the DDV and exhaust.. but getting a product that causes such a hassle no matter time or money really takes a toll on our patients. My problem went on for 3+ months and you tell me how fustrating it is to have a premium product I bought "catted coated downpipes" to cause these problems from the get go once it is installed.. I spend $$$ on installs and removals.. I even bought the BT tool to check codes and all that stuff.. what we want here is probably either a resolution or take the product back that is either defective or not up to par/standards. This doesn't seem to be a problem for catless downpipe users but for us who paid the extra $$$ for catted downpipes and me the coated ones I would rather give it back.. heck even if you sent me catless now and paid me the difference fine.. because sending me another cattted one if that was the case would mean I would have to take my chances in time and $$$ to get it installed to say it doesn't work.

And you are right it takes time.. give them time to fix things but guess one everyday goes by my product I bought is not used and is depreciating... you tell me if that is fair?

My135 · 03-19-2009, 11:41 AM

Certainly, I can feel your pain and frustration. It should not be like this at the beginning. This is why I stay away from mod which I can not DIY. It is just too expensive to have some one install and re-install again and again while figuring what is wrong remotely. The thing that I am trying to point out is solving problem like this remotely is PITA.

M3Newbie88 · 03-19-2009, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by My135

Certainly, I can feel your pain and frustration. It should not be like this at the beginning. This is why I stay away from mod which I can not DIY. It is just too expensive to have some one install and re-install again and again while figuring what is wrong remotely. The thing that I am trying to point out is solving problem like this remotely is PITA.

Ya this is the only product/mod on my car I do not install or reinstall.. even the JB3 takes me mere minutes now to do..

dperez · 03-19-2009, 08:53 PM

I installed Riss Racing DP and Exahust. NO fitment problems.

jeremyc74 · 03-19-2009, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dperez

I installed Riss Racing DP and Exahust. NO fitment problems.

Catted or catless?

KeithLM · 03-20-2009, 11:31 AM

Just a quick update. We're now investigating the possibility that an O2 sensor was damaged during one of the downpipe swaps. Anthony has generously offered to send out a new sensor once I confirm with Stett the code and the sensor it relates to.

Every indication is that the car will be fine in the meantime which is good because my schedule is full the next few days. Hopefully we'll have some satisfactory resolution next week.

Riss Racing · 03-20-2009, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KeithLM

Just a quick update. We're now investigating the possibility that an O2 sensor was damaged during one of the downpipe swaps. Anthony has generously offered to send out a new sensor once I confirm with Stett the code and the sensor it relates to.

Every indication is that the car will be fine in the meantime which is good because my schedule is full the next few days. Hopefully we'll have some satisfactory resolution next week.

Glad we seem to have found the issue! Thank you for working so well with us Keith. I know there have been quite a few exchanges but at the end of the day we want to make sure your happy, and we have the issue fixed. To give everybody a little more insight from a tech point of view the code he is getting is....

heater control circuit (bank 1 sensor 1) - This is an oxygen sensor.

Meaning the sensor is most likely bad. Could have been damaged in install or a million different ways.

What we are doing is getting him...
Bank 1 Sensor 1 PART#11787558055
Price: $237.22 (we are paying for this & shipping to him for free)

On the diagram below you can see it is the short pipe front/top sensor. In the diagram for people that don't know the short pipe is the one in the bottom left corner at the top of the downpipe (#1 circle 8)

Evolved · 03-20-2009, 03:10 PM

Can't you test to see if the sensor is bad before you spend money on a part? You potentially could be wasting $240.

KeithLM · 03-20-2009, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evolved

Can't you test to see if the sensor is bad before you spend money on a part? You potentially could be wasting $240.

Because of the placement of the sensors it's going to be labor intensive to pull the sensor. Stett may have to go so far as to remove one of the downpipes to pull the sensor. The code indicates the sensor is bad. Now granted it could just be that the wires from the sensor were disconnected. But what if that's not enough? What if it's an intermittent failure?

Riss has taken the right approach for this issue. They're taking the safest path, while there is some expense involved it will hopefully prevent future problems with these sensors. Stett will be moving the bung so the sensors are clear of each other. If he doesn't replace the sensor and it turns out the one in there was stressed and reports the error on occasion that will lead to more visits to the shop and more frustration.

TT1351 · 03-20-2009, 04:39 PM

Keith, you should change your name to St. Keith. Despite it all I commend the calm attitude during your frustration. I purchased a set of catted DP, installed them myself, but got it done. I don't know how ready I would be to swap out my stock DP's based on my experience, but I know I could do it faster based on what I learned with my first go around.
After the install, to my chagrin I got the SES, bought a code reader, (good investment BTW), which indicated the common fault normally associated with catless DP's reset it only to have it reappear. Bought the 02 sensor, thankfully they worked. Only fitment issue I had was I had to kind of angle in one of the DP's to get it to seat properly, and on the lower portion a close fit to underbody (actually touching). I have learned over the years nothing rarely fits like OEM. At the end of the day they work, the car goes like a raped ape, (thanks JB3v1.22).
Anyway my point is I nominate you for sainthood, well done!.
Fran

esscolab · 03-20-2009, 05:10 PM

KeithLM,

Hope it works out in the end for you. It's very infuriating when something like this doesn't work out as should. Nods of respect to Riss Racing for being patient and offering to pay for the component parts that will I am sure fix the issue.

Note to RR, When are you guys going to have a UK presence,? It will be a lucrative arrangement I am sure.

Riss Racing · 03-20-2009, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by esscolab

KeithLM,

Hope it works out in the end for you. It's very infuriating when something like this doesn't work out as should. Nods of respect to Riss Racing for being patient and offering to pay for the component parts that will I am sure fix the issue.

Note to RR, When are you guys going to have a UK presence,? It will be a lucrative arrangement I am sure.

Thanks for the Kind words. We already have CA Automotive there

randomquickness · 03-20-2009, 09:12 PM

I am glad to see things are being worked out...call me a RR fanboy if you want but their reputation for customer service is excellent for a reason!

Berduderunner · 03-20-2009, 11:24 PM

I hope the problem was successfully diagnosed...

KeithLM · 03-21-2009, 06:46 PM

Well I went to the track today. Downpipes didn't seem to cause an issue, but the DDV let me down. I will be removing that ASAP. I had enough trouble with the install, those hoses used for connecting it just aren't enough. Seems like that pipe needs to be longer on both ends. This time it slipped out of the blue hose going to the manifold. I have the clamp tightened as far as it can go. I had noticed some discoloration on the pipe, either moisture or water, before. Well during my fourth track session the car went into limp mode after I pulled a pass. I checked that first thing, as the only other time I've had limp mode is when I installed the DDV and didn't have it fully secure. Sure enough it was loose, had completely come out near the bottom. I found some tools, got it back in, tightened down the clamp all the way, and made it back to the track for the latter half of my next session. Got on track, did a few laps and limp mode again after I pulled another pass. I can't spot the specific problem, but I'm sure it's leaking boost around that fitting. There's a lot of oil that is being pushed out there. I skipped the last session because I didn't want the problem to worsen. I made the 85 mile journey home without any trouble.

The ODB II tool arrived today, but it gives me a linking error no matter what I do. I just can't seem to win this month. I'm pretty sure I'm gonna give up on performance mods.

randomquickness · 03-21-2009, 07:55 PM

wow, you are having a rough month! I thought the ddv install was quick and painless. never had any issues with it at all.

KeithLM · 03-21-2009, 10:25 PM

The DDV was always fighting me. It did not want to connect to the intercooler and manifold at the same time without a lot of effort. Then the diverter hoses, well that's another problem.

elite · 03-22-2009, 08:15 AM

Keith you can't win. Buy a G37 and become a winner!

MastaMind · 03-22-2009, 08:41 AM

Save the Keith Foundation, anyone?

KeithLM · 03-22-2009, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elite

Keith you can't win. Buy a G37 and become a winner!

If I wanted something big, heavy, and boring I would have just kept my TL.

elite · 03-22-2009, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KeithLM

If I wanted something big, heavy, and boring I would have just kept my TL.

I guess if I wanted something little and limp, I would have bought a 1.

03-19-2009, 11:00 AM	#89
My135 Lieutenant Colonel 85 Rep 1,609 Posts Drives: Join Date: Mar 2008 iTrader: (0)	Please understand, solving this kind of problem remotely is difficult. There are just too much things going on and can go wrong, things like mis-communication, part was not perfect, car to be installed on not exactly the same as others and might has some small variations which trigger the difficulty of install ... etc. I think it is too early to slam RR. Please give them time to resolve the issue themselves and report it back. __________________ 7/08 135 Coupe, Crimson Red, 6 SP, Sport, Taupe Lette/Aluminum. Performance Mods: JB4 on Map 5, BMS DP Fix V3, Injen polished intake, AR Catless DP, Maddad resonated mid-pipes, aFe exhaust polished tips, ST Suspension Coil Over and Hotchkis front sway bar. Others: BMS OCC, BT Scanner, Mud Flap. Next Mods: AA Front Strut Brace.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

03-19-2009, 11:29 AM	#90
M3Newbie88 Brigadier General 138 Rep 4,053 Posts Drives: E92 M3 Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Canada iTrader: (5)	I guess 1 thing people and RR have understand here is that Keith nor I are bashing the products here.. we both have many products from them.. myself I have their intake, scoops, plenum, catch can and downpipes.. and was thinking about the DDV and exhaust.. but getting a product that causes such a hassle no matter time or money really takes a toll on our patients. My problem went on for 3+ months and you tell me how fustrating it is to have a premium product I bought "catted coated downpipes" to cause these problems from the get go once it is installed.. I spend $$$ on installs and removals.. I even bought the BT tool to check codes and all that stuff.. what we want here is probably either a resolution or take the product back that is either defective or not up to par/standards. This doesn't seem to be a problem for catless downpipe users but for us who paid the extra $$$ for catted downpipes and me the coated ones I would rather give it back.. heck even if you sent me catless now and paid me the difference fine.. because sending me another cattted one if that was the case would mean I would have to take my chances in time and $$$ to get it installed to say it doesn't work. And you are right it takes time.. give them time to fix things but guess one everyday goes by my product I bought is not used and is depreciating... you tell me if that is fair?
	Appreciate 0 Quote

03-19-2009, 11:41 AM	#91
My135 Lieutenant Colonel 85 Rep 1,609 Posts Drives: Join Date: Mar 2008 iTrader: (0)	Certainly, I can feel your pain and frustration. It should not be like this at the beginning. This is why I stay away from mod which I can not DIY. It is just too expensive to have some one install and re-install again and again while figuring what is wrong remotely. The thing that I am trying to point out is solving problem like this remotely is PITA. __________________ 7/08 135 Coupe, Crimson Red, 6 SP, Sport, Taupe Lette/Aluminum. Performance Mods: JB4 on Map 5, BMS DP Fix V3, Injen polished intake, AR Catless DP, Maddad resonated mid-pipes, aFe exhaust polished tips, ST Suspension Coil Over and Hotchkis front sway bar. Others: BMS OCC, BT Scanner, Mud Flap. Next Mods: AA Front Strut Brace.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

03-19-2009, 08:53 PM	#93
dperez New Member 5 Rep 28 Posts Drives: 135i white Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: puerto rico iTrader: (0)	I installed Riss Racing DP and Exahust. NO fitment problems.
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03-20-2009, 11:31 AM	#95
KeithLM Proud 1er 24 Rep 699 Posts Drives: Crimson/Coral 135i Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Wylie, TX iTrader: (0)	Just a quick update. We're now investigating the possibility that an O2 sensor was damaged during one of the downpipe swaps. Anthony has generously offered to send out a new sensor once I confirm with Stett the code and the sensor it relates to. Every indication is that the car will be fine in the meantime which is good because my schedule is full the next few days. Hopefully we'll have some satisfactory resolution next week.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

03-20-2009, 03:10 PM	#97
Evolved Bad Lieutenant 6 Rep 465 Posts Drives: Evo Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: PA iTrader: (0)	Can't you test to see if the sensor is bad before you spend money on a part? You potentially could be wasting $240.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

03-20-2009, 04:39 PM	#99
TT1351 Captain 508 Rep 929 Posts Drives: 135, GTS, E30 M3+ Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Massachusetts iTrader: (2)	Keith, you should change your name to St. Keith. Despite it all I commend the calm attitude during your frustration. I purchased a set of catted DP, installed them myself, but got it done. I don't know how ready I would be to swap out my stock DP's based on my experience, but I know I could do it faster based on what I learned with my first go around. After the install, to my chagrin I got the SES, bought a code reader, (good investment BTW), which indicated the common fault normally associated with catless DP's reset it only to have it reappear. Bought the 02 sensor, thankfully they worked. Only fitment issue I had was I had to kind of angle in one of the DP's to get it to seat properly, and on the lower portion a close fit to underbody (actually touching). I have learned over the years nothing rarely fits like OEM. At the end of the day they work, the car goes like a raped ape, (thanks JB3v1.22). Anyway my point is I nominate you for sainthood, well done!. Fran
	Appreciate 0 Quote

03-20-2009, 05:10 PM	#100
esscolab Brigadeer 74 Rep 728 Posts Drives: Black 135i Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Colchester - UK iTrader: (0)	KeithLM, Hope it works out in the end for you. It's very infuriating when something like this doesn't work out as should. Nods of respect to Riss Racing for being patient and offering to pay for the component parts that will I am sure fix the issue. Note to RR, When are you guys going to have a UK presence,? It will be a lucrative arrangement I am sure. __________________ Eibach Sports springs, Evole Remap, Quafe LSD, AR Downpipes, Forge FMIC, Hart'ge Quads, BMS Intake.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

03-20-2009, 09:12 PM	#102
randomquickness Brigadier General 219 Rep 3,668 Posts Drives: 996tt Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Georgetown, TX iTrader: (13)	I am glad to see things are being worked out...call me a RR fanboy if you want but their reputation for customer service is excellent for a reason! __________________
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03-20-2009, 11:24 PM	#103
Berduderunner drk one 38 Rep 797 Posts Drives: 2008 135i Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Tampa/Orlando iTrader: (0) Garage List 2008 e90 335i [0.00] 2008 135i [0.00]	I hope the problem was successfully diagnosed... __________________ Jet Black \| Coral \| HighGlossBlack \| Steptronic \| Premium \| Sport \| Comfort \| ActiveSteering \| Navi \| HiFi \| HD \| iPod \| SAT BMS JB3 v2.0 \| BMS DCI \| Berk Tech Sport Exhaust \| UR * DPs \| CoolingMist Meth Kit w/ CMGS \| H&R OE Sport Springs \| Breyton GTS-R \| Dunlop Direzza Sport Z1 Star Specs \| GP Thunder 8000K Low Beams/Angel Eyes/Cornering Lights \| LED Interior Light Kit \| Window Tint \| Smoked Tail Lights \| Smoked License Plate Cover
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03-21-2009, 06:46 PM	#104
KeithLM Proud 1er 24 Rep 699 Posts Drives: Crimson/Coral 135i Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Wylie, TX iTrader: (0)	Well I went to the track today. Downpipes didn't seem to cause an issue, but the DDV let me down. I will be removing that ASAP. I had enough trouble with the install, those hoses used for connecting it just aren't enough. Seems like that pipe needs to be longer on both ends. This time it slipped out of the blue hose going to the manifold. I have the clamp tightened as far as it can go. I had noticed some discoloration on the pipe, either moisture or water, before. Well during my fourth track session the car went into limp mode after I pulled a pass. I checked that first thing, as the only other time I've had limp mode is when I installed the DDV and didn't have it fully secure. Sure enough it was loose, had completely come out near the bottom. I found some tools, got it back in, tightened down the clamp all the way, and made it back to the track for the latter half of my next session. Got on track, did a few laps and limp mode again after I pulled another pass. I can't spot the specific problem, but I'm sure it's leaking boost around that fitting. There's a lot of oil that is being pushed out there. I skipped the last session because I didn't want the problem to worsen. I made the 85 mile journey home without any trouble. The ODB II tool arrived today, but it gives me a linking error no matter what I do. I just can't seem to win this month. I'm pretty sure I'm gonna give up on performance mods.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

03-21-2009, 07:55 PM	#105
randomquickness Brigadier General 219 Rep 3,668 Posts Drives: 996tt Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Georgetown, TX iTrader: (13)	wow, you are having a rough month! I thought the ddv install was quick and painless. never had any issues with it at all. __________________
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03-21-2009, 10:25 PM	#106
KeithLM Proud 1er 24 Rep 699 Posts Drives: Crimson/Coral 135i Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Wylie, TX iTrader: (0)	The DDV was always fighting me. It did not want to connect to the intercooler and manifold at the same time without a lot of effort. Then the diverter hoses, well that's another problem.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

03-22-2009, 08:15 AM	#107
elite Banned 3 Rep 60 Posts Drives: G37s Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: A City with one Big Ball! iTrader: (0)	Keith you can't win. Buy a G37 and become a winner!
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03-22-2009, 08:41 AM	#108
MastaMind I like beer 32 Rep 1,286 Posts Drives: AW 135 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Under Pressure iTrader: (0)	Save the Keith Foundation, anyone?
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