Decided to sell

[BMW86]

Originally Posted by IEDEI

no actually you were extremely rude if i'm honest. i wasn't pushing my car on you. hell i have the same car you have on order. you attempted to discredited what i said because you don't like ONE of the car i own? for that reason alone? that's awfully shallow and judgemental of you...

I apologise if I offended you mate. No hard feelings from me.

FYI, the 135is is not the same car as mine. It has a completely different engine. I want to avoid an N54 v N55 debate though.

Over here in Australia, we give each other heat all the time but there is no disrespect involved. As I said, each to their own. There are a lot of (ignorant) car enthusiasts that will openly tell you the 1 series is a girls car, nothing more. Some power mods and aftermarket exhaust opens their eyes though

[BMW86]

Artemis and ozinaldo:

Here's a thread that I found particularly interesting and more importantly, relevant to what we have been discussing here.

The thread is titled - Are E9X M3 owners biased against the new M4?
http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=878143

What's better than our opinions? How about some data from 494 people.

I noticed a good chunk of these people are M3 owners too. It appears that you would both fall within the 5% category

[510135]

+1
I am from the school "Latest is greatest" cars evolve , technology advances, we move on and up.

I do like the look of the e46 M3 Csl and it was/is a cracker of a sports car , but the e92 M3 that replaced it is more advanced, the more modern lines make it more appealing to me and better reliability ticks another box. Ultimately a better car
. I think the new M4 will be stunning and a pleasure to drive, and a all round better car.

So what if you drive a relic Audi TT or a relic M3 if you love it who gives a stuff about what others think of it...

[bsm135]

I agree on the latest is greatest.
In my opinion, as soon as a new model is released, the old model loses a lot of its "spotlight and glory".

New technology, better engines, fuel economy. In almost every case, Almost every aspect of a new vehicles predecessor are looked at in order to be improved in the new model.

Take the TT for example. The old model was cool around the time of its release, but the new model is way better in my opinion. In fact, it's in a completely different league to be honest.

No offence to anyone that owns one, (or any earlier model car), I just know I wouldn't buy one, if there's a new model out that supersedes the previous model.

If there was nothing to improve on it, then why not keep it the same?

[IEDEI]

Originally Posted by BMW86

I apologise if I offended you mate. No hard feelings from me.

FYI, the 135is is not the same car as mine. It has a completely different engine. I want to avoid an N54 v N55 debate though.

Over here in Australia, we give each other heat all the time but there is no disrespect involved. As I said, each to their own. There are a lot of (ignorant) car enthusiasts that will openly tell you the 1 series is a girls car, nothing more. Some power mods and aftermarket exhaust opens their eyes though

all good, man. thanks. i guess i'll be owning 2 "girls cars" then. lol.

[ozinaldo]

Originally Posted by BMW86

Artemis and ozinaldo:

Here's a thread that I found particularly interesting and more importantly, relevant to what we have been discussing here.

The thread is titled - Are E9X M3 owners biased against the new M4?
http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=878143

What's better than our opinions? How about some data from 494 people.

I noticed a good chunk of these people are M3 owners too. It appears that you would both fall within the 5% category

I don't have a problem with the M4 and I shouldn't anyway since we know little about the car still, but I actually believe that best M3 to date is still the E46. You got to understand that it is not only technological advancement it is also changing client profiles and market priorities which makes me think that we are not passing from times that prioritize better driver's cars. So, it is not like they can't do it, it is more like they have less and less reason to do it.

And as a matter of fact I never gave a ratt's axx to which group I fall in whatever opinion poll, be that minority or majority It might be one of the reasons why I love the 1M so dearly and a uber quick future mobile i-pod which might be using hydrogen as fuel would not easily change that too! I don't worship technology, I expect it to serve my needs and expectations which are pretty classical and modest.

If it would comfort you it may be a generational thing; I also think that Chuck Norris would kick the axx of Jason Statham while Daniel Craig is better than all previous Bonds but one, Sean Connery.

[Robin_NL]

Nice thread

I think the best car in the world is the latest Benz S Class W222.

It has the latest and greatest high technology, gimmicks and gadgets. It's the forerunner and pioneer in terms of new technologies soon to follow in less expensive cars.

(Audi A8, BMW 7, Lexus etc do the same but atm the new S Class is way ahead of them all)

Now comes the interesting part. Do I want one? No.

Not because of its pricetag, just because such a car doesn't suit me at all.

I've had E46, E90, F30 3 series and I swear to God. The latest was not the greatest, not in terms of driving pleasure, agility and BMW-ness...imo.

The CSL vs GTS comparison is a good one.
Although the CSL is an icon of its era the GTS is supposed to be better.

Define better

It's bigger, heavier, a 997.1 GT3 is just as fast or faster. They just shaved of 2 seconds on the Nordschleife laptime in 8 years of development time.(?)

I love both cars though.

My dealer still has a GTS for sale. it's the pricetag. A few weeks ago it was 139k euros, now its 199k euros. They're out of their mind....

http://www.debeier.nl/bmw/auto/BMW/3...S%20M-DCT/5637

Cheers
Robin

[michaeldorian]

BMW M3 CSL is my favorite car of all time.

[Karmic Man]

The latest is the greatest is a view express by a person and cannot be measured quantitatively in anyway. It is only expressed through our feelings. If one does not feel that way then it is certainly not true.

It is also meaningless to say M2 > 1M performance wise as it is all speculations without empirical numbers or any direct comparisons of their driving dynamics.

What is true is the production of the 1M is very limited therefore has a high resale value because it is a very capable and enjoyable car to drive. It is kind of the first of it's kind in the M world therefore has a sentimental value attached to it.

In terms of driving purity or rawness the latest is not the greatest and probably quite the opposite dur to emissions regulations + manufacturers' cost cutting practise and people getting lazier...they don't make sports cars like they used to...hell even manual gearbox sports cars are getting rarer.

[Robin_NL]

Originally Posted by Karmic Man

The latest is the greatest is a view express by a person and cannot be measured quantitatively in anyway. It is only expressed through our feelings. If one does not feel that way then it is certainly not true.

It is also meaningless to say M2 > 1M performance wise as it is all speculations without empirical numbers or any direct comparisons of their driving dynamics.

What is true is the production of the 1M is very limited therefore has a high resale value because it is a very capable and enjoyable car to drive. It is kind of the first of it's kind in the M world therefore has a sentimental value attached to it.

In terms of driving purity or rawness the latest is not the greatest and probably quite the opposite dur to emissions regulations + manufacturers' cost cutting practise and people getting lazier...they don't make sports cars like they used to...hell even manual gearbox sports cars are getting rarer.

Take a look at this. The 'latest' definitely not the greatest according to CH.

Twinturbo manual transmission oldskool ftw

Cheers
Robin

[b33g33]

Originally Posted by ozinaldo

1M is both: last of the analog driver oriented performance BMWs and first of turbo and light (relatively speaking) M cars.

But, I don't agree with you that everything newer is by definition better than the previous. Not in cars, not in anything as a matter of fact. It may or not be.

I doubt that E9X 3 series including M versions was "better" than the E46 for instance. Or Dan Brown is a better writer than Fyodor Dostoyevsky. The latter(s) in both cases made more money, that's for sure. There will be a ton of M235i or M135i all around the Globe soon, there won't be too many 1M owners caring about it though

The same goes for the Inferno vs. Brothers Karamazov! Like comparing a Fabergé Egg to a Kinder in this last case.

Like.

[b33g33]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Please read again what you wrote there. As regards the semantics and reasoning, the verb 'flawed' might spring to the mind.

An ad hominem attack always weakens the strength of any argument when the attacker has no idea at all about the credentials/merits of the attacked person. You are perfectly entitled not to like or love someone and his/her views, but you always got a basic duty to respect any person. And, actually, a certain degree of cameraderie is highly appreciated amongst forum fellows, sharing a common passion.



Uh, please don't venture into the wine business.

OK seriously, as regards cars, latest may sometimes be greatest and wow, but sometimes it's simply astray or a let down (regardless the sales figures). Latest is supposed to (live up to the expectation to) be better (and equipping cars with the latest hi-tech features contributes in achieving this goal), but it ain't always. Sometimes it even lacks the potential to outdo previous.

True that previous is sometimes not as great as latest, but sometimes it is (or becomes) vintage, classic or oldskool over time, a benchmark or point of reference. And all this not only because of nostalgia reasons (let's admit it: most of us still use a physical calculator or a pen that may be many years old, although we can use our latest smartphones ). As previous becomes a kind of its own, it can be compared to later or latest, for better or for worse.

Oh well, in the end it all comes down to (very) personal preferences. Each of us has a sweet spot for some aspect(s) of certain personal favorites. And even so, most of our personal choices inevitably evolve over time too, as each of us goes through phases, with circumstances modifying mindsets, manners and means, including (dis)liking certain cars. No-one remains the same person (s)he used to be. Pantha Rhei.



True that the E46 M3 CSL may not be as 'shock & awe' as the E92 M3 GTS, but in my eyes it remains one hell of an exquisite class act pulled off by BMW M, striking a fair balance between elegance and sportiness. So far, the E46 M3 CSL gracefully stood the test of time, aging rather well. Time will tell whether the E92 M3 GTS manages to get the same 'classic' credits and accolades over time.
]

Also, like.

[JasonCSU]

Originally Posted by ozinaldo

I also think that Chuck Norris would kick the axx of Jason Statham

I would love to see that fight.

Originally Posted by ozinaldo

while Daniel Craig is better than all previous Bonds but one, Sean Connery.

Completely agree.

[doug_999]

C&D just did an interesting article on the E90 vs. the F30. In almost every way the F30 was equal to or superior... except... the aligning torque. This is the slip angle producing the cornering forces at the tire patches - "essentially, the tire trying to return to straight-ahead running."

The aligning torque in the F30 is 64 percent lower in the F30 vs. the E90 and "while the switch to electric power steering may improve mileage, it's a bummer for Bimmer driving satisfaction"

"In summary, the most significant change from the E90 to the F30 results from the switch to electric power-steering assist, which diminishes feel. Body roll in the two cars is identical, but the use of rear-suspension understeer instead of the larger tires in back may be why the new 328i feels less agile turning into corners. All of it adds up to a softer, tamer 3-series that's more about luxury than fun."

So the statement "New models are always better than their predecessors" should be "New models are better than their predecessors at some things, but not everything"

If you want more of a luxury ride, the F30 is BETTER than its predecessor.
However, if you want more driving satisfaction, the E90 is BETTER than its replacement.

PS - I believe one of the other auto mags did a similar, less empirical comparison and they ended up thinking the E90 was a better driver's car.

[Ollieb7]

Interesting you want to change. New here yes but thought you would like to know my experience;

I bought a brand new M135i, adaptive and flappy paddle. 4 months later back to the dealer. It was like driving playstation - electric steering has no feel, balance of car was slightly odd leaving you at point over 7/10ths as a passenger, comfort too soft, sport too synthetic flappy paddle left me emotionless even while hoofin it!

Just bought a BSW 1M and it is well more like it. Feel through the hydraulic steering, 1 suspension setting and terriffic balance, manual gearbox - thats before you even get onto rarity, residuals etc. New cars with all this electric stuff is not good news for the future so i do believe the 1M could be one of the last of the kind.

How do i set my barometer for cars? My Caterham R500 is pretty good for that!

[Robin_NL]

Originally Posted by Ollieb7

Interesting you want to change. New here yes but thought you would like to know my experience;

I bought a brand new M135i, adaptive and flappy paddle. 4 months later back to the dealer. It was like driving playstation - electric steering has no feel, balance of car was slightly odd leaving you at point over 7/10ths as a passenger, comfort too soft, sport too synthetic flappy paddle left me emotionless even while hoofin it!

Just bought a BSW 1M and it is well more like it. Feel through the hydraulic steering, 1 suspension setting and terriffic balance, manual gearbox - thats before you even get onto rarity, residuals etc. New cars with all this electric stuff is not good news for the future so i do believe the 1M could be one of the last of the kind.

How do i set my barometer for cars? My Caterham R500 is pretty good for that!

Welcome here and fwiw.



Do you have any pictures?

Of the R500 off course

Cheers
Robin

[Ollieb7]

Thanks

Just a wee one - a wee while back now though so looks a bit different..

[COZ01M]

Originally Posted by Ian///M

Depends what you want.
1. ultimate speed and bragging rights, then A45
2. unique, special, very fast cult car, then 1M

0-100 times aren't everything. The 1M is the last of it's breed. IMO it is pure raw ///M

Also, then there is the looks of the A45

Some 1M owners just don't get what it is about, so perhaps you should sell to someone who appreciates the brilliance of the package.

Summed it up beautifully Ian! No way would I get rid of my 1M.

[cheshirecat79]

Originally Posted by viciousgook

Love the car, plenty of spectacular reviews on it. Only thing I can't stand is the ridiculous exhaust note/upshifts and the 4 cylinder engine they call AMG lol. Other than that, the car is awesome, would be better not knowing it's a 4banger..
Personally I'd keep the 1er

The engine is a technological marvel- it certainly deserves the AMG moniker.