Which Porsche after a 1M ???

[James T. Kirk]

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Which of the myriad of Porsche models would be the next step up from the 1M? I may be looking for a new car and I've always wanted a Porsche, but I sure don't want anything that is less than my 1M in driving performance.
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[Robin_NL]

Rothmans 956

[/thread]

Cheers
Robin

[yemski]

997 GT3

[ChrisBuer]

Good timing this thread. I attended the Porsche Centre at Silverstone yesterday and drove the 911 Carerra (both 4WD and 2WD), the new Cayman, the new Boxster and a few others (Panamera, etc). This was a good opportunity to test the all of the above against my (admittedly tuned) 1M.

All I can say is that all of the above were fun, but the Boxster and Caymen were the two I thought stood out the most. Having said that, none of the above cars, not even the 400bhp Carrera felt anywhere near as quick as my 1M. The throttle response felt slower, the lack of torque was a lot less and I think they handled no better (and no worse) than my 1M.

So what would I choose? None of the above if I'm honest, although I'd like to drive the GT3 as I think that would be the only car I'd want to swap my 1M for

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by ChrisBuer

Good timing this thread. I attended the Porsche Centre at Silverstone yesterday and drove the 911 Carerra (both 4WD and 2WD), the new Cayman, the new Boxster and a few others (Panamera, etc). This was a good opportunity to test the all of the above against my (admittedly tuned) 1M.

All I can say is that all of the above were fun, but the Boxster and Caymen were the two I thought stood out the most. Having said that, none of the above cars, not even the 400bhp Carrera felt anywhere near as quick as my 1M. The throttle response felt slower, the lack of torque was a lot less and I think they handled no better (and no worse) than my 1M.

So what would I choose? None of the above if I'm honest, although I'd like to drive the GT3 as I think that would be the only car I'd want to swap my 1M for

me too...

[Romo]

I was thinking for the new Cayman S, which is a nice looking car IRL

But my biggest concern is the lack of torque compared to the 1M, the numbers do speak for them selves;

Cayman S 370 Nm
1M (on paper 450-500 Nm) IRL more like 550 Nm

The comment above proofs my concern to be real ..



I really do like the Porker ( and I`m not a huge fan of the brand ), but it needs more bite IMHO

Let`s see what the M2 / M4 will bring......

[nachob]

Originally Posted by James T. Kirk

Which of the myriad of Porsche models would be the next step up from the 1M? I may be looking for a new car and I've always wanted a Porsche, but I sure don't want anything that is less than my 1M in driving performance.
.

I think the most visceral Porsche like 1M is the 935PDP! Big fenders big power slight lag and limited numbers!

[Mahlzeit]

+1 vote for the 997.1 GT3. Just need to add rear seats, as I need to cart kids frequently, and in general want to share the experience with my boys.

Really would love to drive one in a non-sales environment. To see if it could serve the purpose.

In my very shallow search it seems a non-tracked gt3 runs around high 70's. so be prepared to through $25k on top of your 1M's value. Not trivial, but not out of reach either

[IZAGLO]

Cayman S...........would be my choice and indeed feel this is every bit as fast as the 1M, even with less TQ..
My other choice would be a Lotus Evora S....
My favorite 2 cars so far for 2013...
I as well am waiting for the M2 to be released but for what it's worth i love the 2 cars i just mentioned..and they are sexy as hell!!!!!!!

***There is a BIG difference in the Cayman and the Cayman S...it's huge. Not just in power..suspension, exhaust, and with the sport exhaust on this car it sounds amazing when wringing it out.

[Artemis]

Nothing beats the stance, awesomeness and sound of a good old 993 Turbo.

Plug in your headphones and start from 01:00 of this notorious Stockholm 2000 video (fake cops, though):

However, the Mother of all street race videos will always remain "C'était un Rendez-vous" shot by Claude Lelouch in August 1976 at dawn in Paris (do know that the raw sound of the 4-litre V12 Ferrari 275 GTB revving was added in the cutting room and that the car was by no means speeding as fast as the sound suggests):

[b33g33]

I was going to say Cayman R but you might as well go for broke and do it properly:

get a Singer.

[Pete_vB]

You want better "driving performance" measured how? Street speed, track? Are you looking new or used? DD? Modified?

A Cayman S is going to be slightly higher performance than an equally tuned 1M everywhere except a straight line. It doesn't always feel like it, and it's not as sideways as a 1M, but against a clock it's clearly quicker: fractionally better brakes, slightly more grip, more stable at high speed, quicker transitions. In a straight line, however, if feels slower due to the lack of torque. In reality a new Cayman S is probably roughly as quick (stock). Tuned it won't pick up as much as a 1M, but it does have the same 350 hp motor as the base 991 carrera with a milder tune.

Personally I find the older Caymans a little boring to drive compared to the 1M, haven't tried a new one yet. The chassis is just screaming for more power, though, and even 350 hp seems light; a 3.8 X51 swap would probably be the minimum needed for that car to feel like an upgrade in driving experience over the 1M for me.

Any of the GT3s are similar or upgrades, IMHO. You're still missing the torque, but the throttle response and top end makes up for it. The new one's going to be a monster, but it's a shame it'll only come with a DCT- probably a deal breaker for me.

GT2s are monsters. 500 hp and torque at the wheels with just a chip in the 996, more in the later ones. If you don't mind the looks and the turbo lag they are in a different league than the 1M.

My personal choices would be either a 997.2 GT3/ RS, or a new Cayman with a motor swap, likely the new GT3 motor. Semi-credible rumor has it that Porsche may produce that car as a 2016 model, I'll buy one if they do.

Of course any of the older cars can be modified to be as fast as you'd like, but I'm assuming you're looking for something more modern.

[Pankrivoklat]

Buy one of RAUH-WELT BEGRIFF brilliantly restored Porsche 964.

[Pankrivoklat]

[ozinaldo]

Originally Posted by Romo

I was thinking for the new Cayman S, which is a nice looking car IRL

But my biggest concern is the lack of torque compared to the 1M, the numbers do speak for them selves;

Cayman S 370 Nm
1M (on paper 450-500 Nm) IRL more like 550 Nm

The comment above proofs my concern to be real ..



I really do like the Porker ( and I`m not a huge fan of the brand ), but it needs more bite IMHO

Let`s see what the M2 / M4 will bring......

Just a week ago test drove the new Boxster S and my 1M one after another: unless you open the Porsche on a long straight with Sport or Sport Plus mode on, I could easily believe that 1M has around 100 hp more and torque is like double of Porsche. It was PDK equipped car. At full acceleration they seem close enough. Porsche has a much better (read: neutral) balance though and infinitely better quality of materials inside as well as a surprising ride comfort.

[TunedM2C]

For DD I would go with a 991 S. GT3 is a fantastic car but not the best DD IMO.

[Romo]

Originally Posted by ozinaldo

Just a week ago test drove the new Boxster S and my 1M one after another: unless you open the Porsche on a long straight with Sport or Sport Plus mode on, I could easily believe that 1M has around 100 hp more and torque is like double of Porsche. It was PDK equipped car. At full acceleration they seem close enough. Porsche has a much better (read: neutral) balance though and infinitely better quality of materials inside as well as a surprising ride comfort.

Great comment, thanks

I must say i do like the Cayman S a lot, it looks marvelous IRL

In next few weeks I will make an appointment for a test drive myself.

I also heard the Cayman will eventually will come with a 4 cylinder turbo, not caled "R" but most likely "GT"

We will see, I will definitely wait for an M2 and than make a comparison between the BMW and the Porker.......

[NjSant]

The singer porsches are absolutely stunning imho but I believe they're around 250k give or take depending on how you build it.

I think the cayman is the most comparable to the M and from what Ive heard are great fun to drive. Obviously won't have much cargo space in any porsche but I dont know if thats a concern, I like being able to fit a golf bag in my car. Also, GT3's are epic.

Singer

[vantagesc]

Originally Posted by Pete_vB

You want better "driving performance" measured how? Street speed, track? Are you looking new or used? DD? Modified?

A Cayman S is going to be slightly higher performance than an equally tuned 1M everywhere except a straight line. It doesn't always feel like it, and it's not as sideways as a 1M, but against a clock it's clearly quicker: fractionally better brakes, slightly more grip, more stable at high speed, quicker transitions. In a straight line, however, if feels slower due to the lack of torque.

Very true, it's hard to beat the 1M in the "real world" because most of the time you are not keeping the engine spinning at high revs and need the torque. Hell, my 135i is faster than my track car in the real world where you can't take turns at insane speeds and spin your motor above 6k rpm all the time.

So from a performance perspective, the 911 Turbo is probably one of the best "real world" Porsches you can get.

But I mean, all of these cars have adequate performance for the street IMO. Get the one that's the most fun to drive.

[ozinaldo]

Originally Posted by Romo

Great comment, thanks

I must say i do like the Cayman S a lot, it looks marvelous IRL

In next few weeks I will make an appointment for a test drive myself.

I also heard the Cayman will eventually will come with a 4 cylinder turbo, not caled "R" but most likely "GT"

We will see, I will definitely wait for an M2 and than make a comparison between the BMW and the Porker.......

Hmmm, a new Cayman with a four cylinder turbo and manual box would be like a dream come true! That will be both faster and more agile, probably lighter and more fuel efficient. If only we could put back the old steering in the new car, but I believe if you go with the new Cayman you won't notice it anymore after sometime since it is perfectly precise and silent at the same time. In any case put the sport exhaust as a nice distraction

[lcrain]

For me, I wouldn't sell the 1M for anything less than a GT-3, maybe a Cayman R or Boxter Spyder. That said, if you don't plan to see any track time then the GT-3 is likely overkill.

You didn't mention price point, which would really help this discussion. Unless you either plan to buy a used car or spend $100k+ you are looking at a pretty small sample size of P-cars. Cayman/Boxter S, or a base 911, maybe an S with minimal options.

If you are going used, I would look at the Cayman R or the Boxter Spyder. Neither are practical as an only car for most lifestyles, but both feel rare and special similar to the 1M. The driving dynamics of the mid-engined porsches are hard to beat. That said, on the road it won't "feel" as fast as a 1M due to the lack of torque.

I personally would have a hard time buying a brand new Porsche of any flavor. They bend you over once you start checking the boxes on options. Maybe having exactly what you want is important to you, but to me it really isn't. I would need a few things (limited slip diff, bluetooth, sport seats or buckets), but wouldn't be as picky about things like leather covered AC slats, red seat-belts and the like.

[Pete_vB]

Originally Posted by vantagesc

From a performance perspective, the 911 Turbo is probably one of the best "real world" Porsches you can get.

But I mean, all of these cars have adequate performance for the street IMO. Get the one that's the most fun to drive.

I agree, but honestly I don't find the TT that much fun to drive. It's hugely effective, but the 1M going sideways is simply much more fun most of the time for me.