I Love My Car Too --- But That Doesn't Stop Me From Crashing It.... - BMW 1 Series Coupe Forum / 1 Series Convertible Forum (1M / tii / 135i / 128i / Coupe / Cabrio / Hatchback) (BMW E82 E88 128i 130i 135i)

deeb · 04-02-2009, 10:54 PM

Just a little warning to anyone out there switching from their winter tires back to stock run flats. Be VERY, and I mean VERY careful with with even the smallest amount of gas you give it around corners, because this can so easily happen to anyone. I had just switched about 5 minutes before and was heading home. I was going 40-50kph around a 45 degree corner in North Vancouver when all of a sudden, out of no where, my rear end just slid out... So of course like I always do when my rear end gets cacked out I correct it. But this time nothing happened, no traction was gained, no traction control went off because my tires wern't spinning, they were sliding.

So I slammed on the breaks at this point and little to my surprise, I just continue to slide and slide and slide. Notice how I'm not saying skid... That's because there was no skidding involved in this, there were no skid marks at all and as the guy in the X5 I hit said, it looked like I was on ice. I slid for about 40 feet, completely dry roads and ended up just barely hitting the X5 and managed to smoke the curb pretty good without slowing down much at all, despite all four tires completely locked up.

Here's the damage... Hard to tell from the pictures but my left front wheel goes straight when my right front wheel is turned all the way to the right... Messed up suspension, steering column for sure snapped, new bumper etc etc. Notice the front wheel and how far back in the wheel well it is...

Also note the car is not lowered at all.

JHZR2 · 04-02-2009, 10:58 PM

no pictures showing... Im not grasping how you did what you did - RFT or not, summer tires should be superior in most every way to snow tires, and I would think would be more resistant to letting loose in any way. How did this exactly happen?

warmtoes · 04-02-2009, 10:59 PM

Sorry to hear about your damage but why did you switch out your snows? I'm not even considering it for another week or two because of the unseasonably cold weather. And, the pictures aren't showing up.

warmtoes · 04-02-2009, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHZR2

no pictures showing... Im not grasping how you did what you did - RFT or not, summer tires should be superior in most every way to snow tires, and I would think would be more resistant to letting loose in any way. How did this exactly happen?

Summer tires are not very good at temperatures hovering around freezing and it's been cold here in Vancouver lately.

deeb · 04-02-2009, 11:07 PM

Sorry - Was resizing them as they came out too big.

Warmtoes - I realize summer tires are not good at these temperatures, but you have no idea how little I was pushing the car....

Robert · 04-03-2009, 12:01 AM

Wow, was traction on? I have gotten the rear end lose even with traction on before but was able to correct it.

warmtoes · 04-03-2009, 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deeb

Sorry - Was resizing them as they came out too big.

Warmtoes - I realize summer tires are not good at these temperatures, but you have no idea how little I was pushing the car....

Sorry dude, wasn't trying to criticize. I can imagine you weren't doing anything. It's just not a normal winter this year. Hope everything works out with the bodyshop.

MOCKBA · 04-03-2009, 12:27 AM

So what's reason to take summer tires if a car becomes so unstable?

lib · 04-03-2009, 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by warmtoes

Summer tires are not very good at temperatures hovering around freezing and it's been cold here in Vancouver lately.

^This. It's safe to be on summer tires in Texas (80F tomorrow) right now but you may be pushing your luck in Vancouver.

tbird · 04-03-2009, 05:49 AM

Agreed, 1) RFT's, 2) Cold, 3) Summer-oriented tires, you might as well be driving on tires made of wood.

While I'm not crazy about spending $700 or so on new tires, I will be happy to switch to non-RFT's when the original tires burn out. I've had good luck with GForce, and also with Rikens. GForce do well in both cold and warm, on both heavy and light cars.

TP 135i · 04-03-2009, 06:28 AM

Sorry about your car.
We had a discussion about the lack of traction with summer tires in this thread.......
http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=236470

cold summer tires + cold roads = weak traction

deeb · 04-03-2009, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TP 135i

Sorry about your car.
We had a discussion about the lack of traction with summer tires in this thread.......
http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=236470

cold summer tires + cold roads = weak traction

I drove with Summer tires until December when the snow started to fall. During this time I had noticeable reduction in traction however not even CLOSE to the lack of traction I had yesterday. I really feel its got nothing to do with this and everything to do with the fact the tires sat for 4 months.

It was really quite something the rear end just gave out like nothing, I was in a line of cars going around a 45 degree corner, all at the same speed and just whoooosh, out came the back... This would have never happened with the tires had they stayed on the whole time.

And it was 8 degrees celsius, so, not abnormally cold.

Bones13 · 04-03-2009, 10:39 AM

Rain, and fallen oak pollen/oak flowers making the southern roads slippery this week. But a tire change won't help that.

I am happy to report that I have never even considered "winter" tires. Here there are old tires, and new tires.

bman6074 · 04-03-2009, 10:42 AM

MMM i have had the RFT back on since mide march here in CT. THere have been a few days in a row that have been below freezing. Yea the grip hasn't been great but nothing of what you have described. Its weird that the DTC didnt' do anything i have noticed even if the car slides one way or another DTC starts cutting power to the engine and slowing me down.

5354 · 04-03-2009, 10:58 AM

Sorry to hear what happened, that sucks. That is surprsing to me too, I know it is a risk but I have been running on my run flats all winter long. I only kept the car at home when it snowed in Vancouver, so i'll be sure to be extra careful in the next few weeks.

BlackjackMulligan · 04-03-2009, 11:04 AM

wow that sucks. Glad you're ok.

I'm wondering if there was anything on the road to facilitate the slide, ie: oil, thin layer of sand, etc.

I had a situation where an dumbass in a Prius ran a stop sign right in front of me and I had to jam on my brakes. It was cold out and the road was slightly damp. The 1er barely slowed at all and just slid with the ABS going crazy. It's amazingly lucky that I didn't hit that f ing tree hugger.

amsfoto · 04-03-2009, 11:13 AM

I'm willing to bet it was because the tires had been sitting all winter? Tires harden up when not used and not properly covered for long periods of time.

tbird · 04-03-2009, 11:20 AM

We ALL have to watch out for the Prius. In a CR Report of 100 cars, it was #100 on braking, it had the longest distance to stop, due to its regen brakes.

pit1 · 04-03-2009, 11:47 AM

no doubt OEM tires are risking below freezing. So sorry to hear about your experience. It certainly sounds worse than simple summer tires in cold weather. How cold as it that day? I've had mine on in mid-20 deg F and it was squirmy enough to encourage a winter set but nothing like you described.

How did you have your tires stored? Could they have hardened and collected a film of dirt or oil over the winter? Also, no way to tell at this point, but could the winter of snow driving have screwed your alignment/camber?

Best of luck on the repairs

G5Ti · 04-03-2009, 04:57 PM

I'm really curious about the storage method, too. Or perhaps there was something oily on the road that exacerbated the issue?

When I had my 128 in for a little work over the winter, they gave me a 135 loaner with stock summer rubber. It was between -10F and 15F for the weekend I had it, and the roads were covered in ice and snow. It was NOT fun to drive on those roads, but with prudence on my part, the car and its electronics kept me out of trouble.

It sounds like there was something else at odds against you, whether road conditions or tires that didn't deal with storage well.

deeb · 04-04-2009, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G5Ti

I'm really curious about the storage method, too. Or perhaps there was something oily on the road that exacerbated the issue?

When I had my 128 in for a little work over the winter, they gave me a 135 loaner with stock summer rubber. It was between -10F and 15F for the weekend I had it, and the roads were covered in ice and snow. It was NOT fun to drive on those roads, but with prudence on my part, the car and its electronics kept me out of trouble.

It sounds like there was something else at odds against you, whether road conditions or tires that didn't deal with storage well.

Tires were stored in my room temperature garage.

I too think its because they hardened up while being stored and didn't have enough time to soften.

There was nothing on the road that I slipped on, perfectly dry no oil no sand no pollen no nothing. Tires had hardened up so much over the winter that there was literally no traction....

Time to get a VW Rabbit.

warmtoes · 04-05-2009, 02:12 PM

You didn't happen to wax the wheels or something like that during the time they were off?

04-02-2009, 10:54 PM	#1
deeb boss. Drives: 135i Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 216 iTrader: (0)	I Love My Car Too --- But That Doesn't Stop Me From Crashing It.... Just a little warning to anyone out there switching from their winter tires back to stock run flats. Be VERY, and I mean VERY careful with with even the smallest amount of gas you give it around corners, because this can so easily happen to anyone. I had just switched about 5 minutes before and was heading home. I was going 40-50kph around a 45 degree corner in North Vancouver when all of a sudden, out of no where, my rear end just slid out... So of course like I always do when my rear end gets cacked out I correct it. But this time nothing happened, no traction was gained, no traction control went off because my tires wern't spinning, they were sliding. So I slammed on the breaks at this point and little to my surprise, I just continue to slide and slide and slide. Notice how I'm not saying skid... That's because there was no skidding involved in this, there were no skid marks at all and as the guy in the X5 I hit said, it looked like I was on ice. I slid for about 40 feet, completely dry roads and ended up just barely hitting the X5 and managed to smoke the curb pretty good without slowing down much at all, despite all four tires completely locked up. Here's the damage... Hard to tell from the pictures but my left front wheel goes straight when my right front wheel is turned all the way to the right... Messed up suspension, steering column for sure snapped, new bumper etc etc. Notice the front wheel and how far back in the wheel well it is... Also note the car is not lowered at all. Attached Images __________________ .:08::black::135i::6speed::stick:.
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04-02-2009, 10:59 PM	#3
warmtoes Lieutenant Colonel Drives: X3 35i Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Vancouver Posts: 1,768 iTrader: (1)	Sorry to hear about your damage but why did you switch out your snows? I'm not even considering it for another week or two because of the unseasonably cold weather. And, the pictures aren't showing up. __________________ TiAg/Coral Red 135i Vert *X3 35i M-Sport received but haven't taken pics yet.*

04-02-2009, 11:07 PM	#5
deeb boss. Drives: 135i Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 216 iTrader: (0)	Sorry - Was resizing them as they came out too big. Warmtoes - I realize summer tires are not good at these temperatures, but you have no idea how little I was pushing the car.... __________________ .:08::black::135i::6speed::stick:.

04-03-2009, 12:27 AM	#8
MOCKBA Captain Drives: 135 convertible Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: SFBA Posts: 865 iTrader: (0)	So what's reason to take summer tires if a car becomes so unstable? __________________ 135i/cabrio/p/s/c MediaChest is iTunesLess way of iPod managing

04-03-2009, 06:28 AM	#11
TP 135i Major Drives: 2008 135i SGM MT Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Finksburg, Maryland Posts: 1,341 iTrader: (0) Garage List 1995 Acura Integra SE [0.00] 2008 BMW 135i [0.00] 2006 Porsche Cayman S [0.00] 1999 Toyota 4-Runner [0.00]	Sorry about your car. We had a discussion about the lack of traction with summer tires in this thread....... http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=236470 cold summer tires + cold roads = weak traction __________________ 2008 135i SGM

04-02-2009, 10:58 PM	#2
JHZR2 Captain Drives: 91 E30, 11 135i cv Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: New Jersey Posts: 834 iTrader: (0)	no pictures showing... Im not grasping how you did what you did - RFT or not, summer tires should be superior in most every way to snow tires, and I would think would be more resistant to letting loose in any way. How did this exactly happen?

04-03-2009, 12:01 AM	#6
Robert Major General Drives: 135i, current is350 Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Socal Posts: 6,765 iTrader: (1)	Wow, was traction on? I have gotten the rear end lose even with traction on before but was able to correct it.

04-03-2009, 05:49 AM	#10
tbird Captain Drives: "Bianca" 135cic AW/TC Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: FLL Posts: 679 iTrader: (0) Garage List 2008 135cic [0.00]	Agreed, 1) RFT's, 2) Cold, 3) Summer-oriented tires, you might as well be driving on tires made of wood. While I'm not crazy about spending $700 or so on new tires, I will be happy to switch to non-RFT's when the original tires burn out. I've had good luck with GForce, and also with Rikens. GForce do well in both cold and warm, on both heavy and light cars. __________________ 2008 135cic, Alpine White/Terracotta Leather/BlackTop, Premium Package (Bluetooth, folding mirrors, etc), Sport Package with M Wheel, Navigation, Logic7 with HD and IPod and Sirius, Steptronic, M Aerodynamic Kit 2001 Focus ZX3, modified for fun commuting Previous 2006 325xi 2002 Audi A4 3.0 Quattro 1997 Audi A4 2.8 Quattro 1984 Audi 4000S Quattro modified 1955 Ford Thunderbird 1969 Camaro modified 1993 Ford Explorer (basic hauling) 1984+1988 Ford Broncos 1993 Honda Civic (Commuter, junk) 2008 Mini (wife's car, AWESOME) A few more

04-03-2009, 10:39 AM	#13
Bones13 Private Drives: 2009 128i BSM/Coral Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: LA (Lower Alabama) Posts: 78 iTrader: (0)	Rain, and fallen oak pollen/oak flowers making the southern roads slippery this week. But a tire change won't help that. I am happy to report that I have never even considered "winter" tires. Here there are old tires, and new tires. __________________ 2009 128i BSM/Coral/Walnut/Steptronic Premium Package/Comfort Access Navigation/Premium Audio/USB/iPod Heated Seats/Xenon/Bike Prep

04-03-2009, 10:42 AM	#14
bman6074 Captain Drives: 2008 135i and 1999 M3 Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Farmington Posts: 649 iTrader: (0)	MMM i have had the RFT back on since mide march here in CT. THere have been a few days in a row that have been below freezing. Yea the grip hasn't been great but nothing of what you have described. Its weird that the DTC didnt' do anything i have noticed even if the car slides one way or another DTC starts cutting power to the engine and slowing me down. __________________

04-03-2009, 10:58 AM	#15
5354 numbers Drives: 135i cabriolet BSM Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Burnaby, BC, Canada Posts: 40 iTrader: (0)	Sorry to hear what happened, that sucks. That is surprsing to me too, I know it is a risk but I have been running on my run flats all winter long. I only kept the car at home when it snowed in Vancouver, so i'll be sure to be extra careful in the next few weeks.

04-03-2009, 11:04 AM	#16
BlackjackMulligan Most interesting Roadster Drives: '01 Z3.0 Roady;'10 C300 Sport Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Boston 'burbs Posts: 2,224 iTrader: (5) Garage List 2010 Mercedes-Benz ... [0.00] 2001 BMW Z3 3.0 Roa ... [0.00]	wow that sucks. Glad you're ok. I'm wondering if there was anything on the road to facilitate the slide, ie: oil, thin layer of sand, etc. I had a situation where an dumbass in a Prius ran a stop sign right in front of me and I had to jam on my brakes. It was cold out and the road was slightly damp. The 1er barely slowed at all and just slid with the ABS going crazy. It's amazingly lucky that I didn't hit that f ing tree hugger. __________________ I can't complain, but sometimes I still do........Life's been good to me so far. - Joe Walsh

04-03-2009, 11:13 AM	#17
amsfoto photographer Drives: AW e92 335i, JB 135i Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Rockville, MD Posts: 571 iTrader: (4)	I'm willing to bet it was because the tires had been sitting all winter? Tires harden up when not used and not properly covered for long periods of time.

04-03-2009, 11:20 AM	#18
tbird Captain Drives: "Bianca" 135cic AW/TC Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: FLL Posts: 679 iTrader: (0) Garage List 2008 135cic [0.00]	We ALL have to watch out for the Prius. In a CR Report of 100 cars, it was #100 on braking, it had the longest distance to stop, due to its regen brakes. __________________ 2008 135cic, Alpine White/Terracotta Leather/BlackTop, Premium Package (Bluetooth, folding mirrors, etc), Sport Package with M Wheel, Navigation, Logic7 with HD and IPod and Sirius, Steptronic, M Aerodynamic Kit 2001 Focus ZX3, modified for fun commuting Previous 2006 325xi 2002 Audi A4 3.0 Quattro 1997 Audi A4 2.8 Quattro 1984 Audi 4000S Quattro modified 1955 Ford Thunderbird 1969 Camaro modified 1993 Ford Explorer (basic hauling) 1984+1988 Ford Broncos 1993 Honda Civic (Commuter, junk) 2008 Mini (wife's car, AWESOME) A few more

04-03-2009, 11:47 AM	#19
pit1 Lieutenant Drives: 135i Join Date: May 2008 Location: It's always Sunny... Posts: 580 iTrader: (0)	no doubt OEM tires are risking below freezing. So sorry to hear about your experience. It certainly sounds worse than simple summer tires in cold weather. How cold as it that day? I've had mine on in mid-20 deg F and it was squirmy enough to encourage a winter set but nothing like you described. How did you have your tires stored? Could they have hardened and collected a film of dirt or oil over the winter? Also, no way to tell at this point, but could the winter of snow driving have screwed your alignment/camber? Best of luck on the repairs __________________ '08 135i Coupe (sold) SGM/Coral

04-03-2009, 04:57 PM	#20
G5Ti Purveyor of fine roads. Drives: 2008 BMW 128i Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Ohio Posts: 339 iTrader: (0)	I'm really curious about the storage method, too. Or perhaps there was something oily on the road that exacerbated the issue? When I had my 128 in for a little work over the winter, they gave me a 135 loaner with stock summer rubber. It was between -10F and 15F for the weekend I had it, and the roads were covered in ice and snow. It was NOT fun to drive on those roads, but with prudence on my part, the car and its electronics kept me out of trouble. It sounds like there was something else at odds against you, whether road conditions or tires that didn't deal with storage well. __________________ 128i alpine \| coral \| premium \| sport \| cold \| xenons \| ipod+usb

04-05-2009, 02:12 PM	#22
warmtoes Lieutenant Colonel Drives: X3 35i Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Vancouver Posts: 1,768 iTrader: (1)	You didn't happen to wax the wheels or something like that during the time they were off? __________________ TiAg/Coral Red 135i Vert *X3 35i M-Sport received but haven't taken pics yet.*

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